NY - UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Midtown. #10 *Arrest*

[CrimeDawg123]

I really don’t think he was headed anywhere. Foreign currency was probably from Japan, I’m guessing. IMO, he was lost. Hadn’t planned so well after the fact. Cold, gaunt, nowhere to stay, hunkering down in a McDonalds. Frightened.

I really agree with you. I think he was just wandering around and didn't have a plan. At first I thought he was heading to kill someone else but now I'm more inclined to think he just shut down and ended up wandering in Altoona.

 

[caradana]

I'm wondering if he was so depressed that he didn't care what happened to him, death, prison, or continuing life as a loner always on the move. If BT had his security, maybe LM would have shot anyway. Once one stops caring, maybe all possible outcomes would be equal, so whatever happens, happens.

Understanding why you’re theorizing this, and I would agree in a lot of cases. In this case, where he had the world at his fingertips and knew it; I think LM is afflicted, and he decided to pick up his personal cross and do this no matter what the cost. MOO: courts will spend the next 5+ years debating the sanity of that move, in various legal forms. But I don’t think it was individual anarchy, or Ayn Randishness, or nihilism. I think this was a guy who decided to do a thing to make a point, and he did that, and his point is made, and in an ironic and vicious way - his point has been made so effectively in the national conversation that it seems, almost … sane? … Fascinating case. MOO: Most interesting case of my adult life.

 

[alsleuther]

There's no question in my mind that he would have been caught eventually, no matter what he did, but he could have extended his time as a free man if he'd left the Northeast immediately, even if he'd used his real passport. He could have gone to one of the larger cities in Texas, for example, and then used another of his fake IDs to stay at another hostel for a bit. MOO

Maybe he stayed in the Northeast b/c he could stay all bundled up in hoodies and scarves, and a face mask might not be as out of place up there. I just looked up the weather in Houston, and it's currently 71 degrees! He would attract attention in that climate in his current clothing.

 

[mrstfs]

It was a calculated risk, but I suspect that he balanced getting away with it versus getting caught. His arrogance tipped him towards getting away with it, so it was worth it to him.

He started shaking when arrested, he looked as though he urinated on himself in the first prison cell photo, and he was visibly angry when he was taken into a court room. I don't think he expected to get caught. Big smile when he's thinking about murdering a stranger, rather sad when he's arrested.

Ironically, he once retweeted something that said “Netflix, door dash, and true crime podcasts have stolen more dreams than failure ever will.”

 

[Luna20]

I think so too. And that's not "normal" behavior. If in fact he was becoming increasingly convinced that mere speeches (valedictory or otherwise) weren't going to "fix things," and he was beginning to plan acts of violence, he was concealing a great deal from so-called "friends" and family. IOW, he was betraying them by pretending to be normal (or possibly masking his motivations as pain-related.

I also think that most people who plan and carry out crimes of this time take a great deal of pleasure/pride in their planning and it consumes them. Why people become obsessed in this way is not well understood, but I cannot see LM as a "normal" young man who suddenly flipped out due to pain and organized this crime. He was reading a lot and spending a lot of time thinking about what he wanted to do. IMO.

To me, it doesn't seem as if he had long term friends from college still involved in his life, as well. I'm guessing that he may be preferring his own company and thinking for a very long time. He put on the guise of the typical 20-something bro-dude, while reading increasingly radicalized literature and wanting to change the world (by himself).

IMO.

Was he Valedictorian in high school or college?

 

[HanniBJeter]

Was he Valedictorian in high school or college?

High school

 

[MassGuy]

How did people figure out what Reddit account belonged to LM? The same thing happened in the Madeline Soto case, the public was able to figure out which Reddit account belonged to her alleged murder. I understand computer forensics can make these discoveries, but how is the general public doing it?

The Soto case was easy, as Sterns used the same handle all over the place. That meant it took seconds to find.

From what I can gather here, it was a bit more complicated. He talked about the specific condition that he suffered from and someone probably made the connection with other identifying information he put out there.

 

[CrimeDawg123]

Ironically, he once retweeted something that said “Netflix, door dash, and true crime podcasts have stolen more dreams than failure ever will.”

When people say things like this it's usually because they enjoy Netflix, door dash, and true crime podcasts more then they care to admit.

 

[ttjo]

I

I don't like seeing people assume pain meds equals addiction because the stigma is keeping people in chronic pain suffering. I know a person suffering from Parkinson's and back pain after nine back surgeries who is only given Tylenol, she no longer has the will to live. To have any quality of life, some people need pain meds.

I hear you, and maybe if we heard that Luigi was seeing a doctor regularly for pain management and someone who monitors your use, it would be different.
Given the stories of his excessive pain, it makes you wonder how he managed, if he was taking pain pills, where did he get them without a RX, doctor's supervision, or someone monitoring the quantity over time, it can get away from you. Not even sure if thats the issue,
But I get the stigma; I see this as he was in pain. ( allegedly)

 

[otto]

I'm wondering if he was so depressed that he didn't care what happened to him, death, prison, or continuing life as a loner always on the move. If BT had his security, maybe LM would have shot anyway. Once one stops caring, maybe all possible outcomes would be equal, so whatever happens, happens.

He doesn't look depressed. He's flirting with the check-in woman at the hostel. Earlier this year, he was travelling around Asia until at least April. Everyone who encountered him described an active, good-natured man who enjoyed hiking.

It's possible that he had another re-injury in May. That's when he stopped promoting the surgery. Two months later he stopped talking to family. Six months later he allegedly committed murder.

If May 2024 was another turning point, did he see a doctor to request prescription for pain? Did he get what he needed?

Did Mangione make an insurance claim that his back injury prevented him earning an income? Did he receive a small settlement (monopoly money) ... did that pay for his travels to Baltimore, San Francisco, Hawaii, East Coast surgery, Japan, Thailand and more from June 2023 - May 2024?

Did Mangone go from months of enthusiastic adventures in Asia to murderous depression 6-7 months? What did his bank account look like during that year of travel?

I don't think he was depressed. I think he was angry - slowly writing the words depose, deny, defend on 3 bullets, ejecting them like a game player leaving a clue, leaving monopoly money in his backpack in the park - made me think he was intelligent with a sense of humour. Cycling away. It doesn't really suggest depression.

 

[acutename]

There is a lot to unpack in here regarding his time in HI:

Inside Luigi Mangione’s time as a beach bum in Hawaiian paradise — with accused UnitedHealthcare CEO assassin tickling girls, Tinder matching a yoga guru

“Of course I’m shocked but there was a darkness to him that was always there,” one pal told The Post.

nypost.com

there is a picture (diagram) of a spine on the wall above the table where they are all out eating- some herbal homeopathic foods?

 

[branmuffin]

Do you think Luigi thought he was going to get away with the murder? It's very interesting that he had foreign currency on him when he was arrested. But why be loafing around Pennsylvania after leaving NYC? Why not head for the Southern border and try to go to Mexico? And why not have a disguise? He could have put on a woman's wig, had a fake mustache or even died his hair blond. I'm just so curious how he ended up in a Pennsylvania McDonalds.

As I'm typing this I'm thinking of the Scott Peterson mugshot, where he had died his naturally dark hair blonde and headed South.

The foreign currency may have had more to do with where he came from (Japan, Thailand) rather than where he was going.

 

[Luna20]

I bet it was more gradual but progressed quickly, especially if you isolate and don't have anyone watching or noticing.
If he has distorted thinking, his ability to make the right decision is impaired.
This may be a strategy for his defence.
Someone here with more knowledge could probably explain it better.

This is very common in traumatic brain injuries. Impaired judgment is often the cause for death and/or destruction. It is due to the frontal lobe of the brain being affected. There is ample data to factually support this but I have not seen it apply to other injuries. It would be interesting to know if any others compare.

One of many:

Impact on decision-making:

• People with brain injuries may struggle with both major and minor decisions, sometimes making hasty choices without considering the full implications.
  
  
• Impulsivity:
  A common symptom is increased impulsivity, where someone might act without thinking through the potential consequences.
  
  
• Lack of insight:
  Some individuals with brain injuries may lack awareness of their own cognitive impairments, making it difficult to recognize when their judgment is poor.
  
  
• Frontal lobe damage:
  The frontal lobe is particularly important for judgment and executive function, so damage to this area can significantly impact decision-making abilities.

https://www.headway.org.uk/media/12044/decision-making-difficulties-after-brain-injury-publication.pdf

 

[JDG]

there is a picture (diagram) of a spine on the wall above the table where they are all out eating- some herbal homeopathic foods?

Looks like a critter to me, not a spine with all those legs.

 

[otto]

How did people figure out what Reddit account belonged to LM? The same thing happened in the Madeline Soto case, the public was able to figure out which Reddit account belonged to her alleged murder. I understand computer forensics can make these discoveries, but how is the general public doing it?

Mangione discussed (reddit) back surgery success for 10 months until May 2024, then he went silent. He discussed back injury history and treatment options. I wonder whether anyone on that discussion leaned towards radical.

When the first details about the shooter were released, some of those facts must have matched his reddit discussions. When he stopped posting, he probably drew additional attention.

I might have read that he was a reddit member for 6 years.

 

[justpeachy22]

I bet it was more gradual but progressed quickly, especially if you isolate and don't have anyone watching or noticing.
If he has distorted thinking, his ability to make the right decision is impaired.
This may be a strategy for his defence.
Someone here with more knowledge could probably explain it better.

I am not versed in legalities, but since when does "distorted thinking", mental illness, or the effects of pain killers (as many have suggested) work as a defense in front of a jury/get a killer off the hook from murder. Very rare I would think.

 

[Seattle1]

Agreed. It seems like it - that anger over his back disability became is anchor. One point that never made sense to me is that he had a lower back weakness, and he seemed to do everything he could to aggravate the weakness until it became a permanent disability.

When it became a disability, he wanted surgery. When the surgery did not restore his back to pre-injury condition, he became angry. He couldn't be angry at his own stupidity, because he's the smartest man in the room, so he decided to shoot a random stranger in the back.

If LM was harboring anger-- is it even about his back? I think not!

On Saturday, Feb 29, 2020, at nursing home in Kirkland, WA-- located across the lake from Seattle, the first COVID19 outbreak in the U.S. was confirmed. By early April, the Pacific Northwest was in total lockdown-- children could have probably played safely on the freeway. WA State Emergency Guidelines imposed by the Governor were in effect from Feb 29, 2020 to Oct 31, 2022, and in comparison to other areas, were strictly enforced.

That said, this two year period 2020-2022, seemingly had a tremendous impact on the high school upper classmen (juniors & seniors) who missed every celebrated right of passage, and all college grades in general, who struggled both socially and academically.

From LM's LinkedIn Resume (attached), he was wrapping up at UPenn May 2020, and cites his start date at True Car, Inc (Data Engineer I) as Nov 2020.

Unlike his 2016 HS Valedictorian Speech and Honors, good chance LM's May 2020 University graduation ceremony was canceled.

Again, taking note LM's first proper job post university graduation where he advances to Data Engineer III takes place during the isolation of the global pandemic, working not from Santa Monica, CA but employed remotely. (Having experienced the typical recruitment and relocation for my first job after graduation, I'd be absolutely shattered at this remote work experience).

While we know that True Car, Inc publicly announced its corporate restructuring and reduction of workforce in June 2023-- which very likely could have been pandemic related, I think we'd be remiss not to question if the golden boy may have taken it to heart that his measured improvements to True Car's performance metrics failed to save his job or deter the layoffs of his division (see resume --performance).

What changed for LM?

Did LM burn out working remotely -- missed the entry level mentoring and ego boost environment one needs to keep energized and interested?

Or was LM dealing with imposter syndrome -- now being offered interactive, live work where he'd no longer be able to hide out at home. Weren't the Honolulu digs somewhat an extension of the Frat house he left behind at UPenn?

And who doesn't have a friend that's allergic to gainful employment!

Did LM actually need surgery, or did he feign symptoms to advance surgery to avoid work?

I'm beginning to question whether if not for having money and opportunity, LM might have just been just been living the life of the Trump shooter, Thomas Crooks (who also scored 1530 on his SAT). Intelligent but very selfish and stupid. MOO

State of Emergency - COVID 2020-2022

 

[ttjo]

There is a picture (diagram) of a spine on the wall above the table where they are all out eating- some herbal homeopathic foods.

LOl. it looks like a Thai restaurant called Opal in Chinatown, downtown Honolulu

 

[LaylaD]

He was never a UHC customer nor was his mum, if they had had a bad experience then the killing of the CEO of the company involved makes more of an excuse (not that there is one)/might gain a little sympathy to try in court but BT/UHC has made no difference to his life or that of his mum

In reading up on UHC, I came across articles discussing a Feb 2024 cyberattack that made me rethink the UHC connection. Most posts (if not all) look at UHC from the consumer aspect - and it has been stated that he/his family were not consumers. However, the cyberattack impacted claims processing around the country, and many clinics and nursing homes faced severe cash flow challenges. This may have had a more direct impact on LM’s family.

From HHS: “numerous hospitals, doctors, pharmacies and other stakeholders have highlighted potential cash flow concerns to HHS stemming from an inability to submit claims and receive payments.”

https://www.hhs.gov/about/news/2024/03/05/hhs-statement-regarding-the-cyberattack-on-change-healthcare.html

From AHA: “Change Healthcare manages the clinical criteria used to authorize a substantial portion of patient care and coverage, processes billions of claims, supports clinical information exchange, and processes drug prescriptions. Significant portions of Change Healthcare’s functionality have been crippled. As a result, patients have struggled to get timely access to care and billions of dollars have stopped flowing to providers, thereby threatening the financial viability of hospitals, health systems, physician offices and other providers.”

Congress Urged to Help Hospitals Impacted by Change Healthcare Cyberattack | AHA

The American Hospital Association (AHA) writes to the Committee on Ways and Means of the House of Representatives in advance of the March 20 hearing on the President’s Fiscal Year (FY) 2025 Health and Human Services (HHS) Budget to update you on the recent cyberattack on Change Healthcare and...

www.aha.org

Congress grills UnitedHealth CEO over Change cyberattack

Legislators slammed Andrew Witty over the company’s lack of cybersecurity practices and the impact of the breach, which may have compromised the data of a third of Americans.

www.healthcaredive.com

 

[acutename]

UnitedHealthcare CEO shooting suspect fled New York via train, not by bus as originally thought: reports

Investigators first thought Mangione had taken a bus out of the city because he was seen on surveillance video at the George Washington Bridge bus station.

nypost.com

Interesting to learn that LM travelled by Train from Penn Station and not bus. A clever manouver - we was not seen exiting because got to subway station thru a tunnel. Took A train, 8th Ave express - 6 stops til Penn Station. Very quick.
Understand now why he was surprised to be caught at Altoona.

“A pedestrian tunnel, maintained by the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey, links the bus terminal to the subway station.”

I initially thought he had plane tickets and was going to an airport ASAP. But now I think after the shooting he was just done and had no long range plans.