Russia Attacks Ukraine - 23 Feb 2022 #12

[Mo Thuairim]

I've seen nothing has changed today, for the exception of US stopping aid.

Zelensky has NOT apologize to our president or the American citizens who have financially supported his war. He is still not thanked the US for all we've done. It's really hard to keep giving to somebody so ungrateful.

I see European countries are still thinking about, stepping up, supporting, but no action. They meant Saturday and Sunday. Lots of hugs, pats on the back, a trip to see the King, but no plan. Everyone still thinking about it. They do have plans, to make a plan. They've talked about doing more financially. They did put up 2 billion to purchase missiles, that still needs to be manufacturer. Anybody got a timeline on how long it takes to make these.

If I lived in Europe, I'd really be concerned. The leaders of this country are all talk and no action. If something major did happen, how many weeks would it take them to meet, support, and take action When you run a government you got to be ready to act instantly.

European countries, should have stockpiles of equipment, missiles and ammunition own hand for immediate use. Clearly there is no offer to dip into the stockpile, and leads me to believe there is no stockpile.

Clearly Putin and the rest of the world see how unprepared European countries are. No an action plan, no ready to go in any and all emergencies. They still have little commitment for boots on the ground. Most of the financial commitments are in the future. No immediate readily available funding, weapons or supplies.

Instead of getting on social media and complaining about the US stopping aid. They should be saying don't worry. We have got you covered. We've got stockpiles of supplies, food and other immediate need items. No they're all sitting around talking, posting on Twitter, speaking in the media, about how bad the US is.

I have to laugh. These countries are so ill prepared for an emergency, immediate attack on their Homeland, and lack the ability to cohesively pull themselves together and assist one little country. Europe is at grave risk by being unprepared.

Proud, happy, an extremely thankful to live in the United States of America. We believe in being prepared.

Saw the first new ad from the DOD for marine recruitment, last night. You know we didn't recruit under the previous administration. Made me so proud, had tears in my eyes watching those young folks in uniforms, knowing they are ready on a moment's notice to defend our freedom.

My opinion only, European country's need to get there at together. They clearly showed their soft spot and weaknesses this past weekend.

Moo

You have to laugh? About war? OK.

Anyway. New today:

Commission pitches '€800bn' defence package ahead of leaders' summit

EU leaders will gather in Brussels on Thursday for an extraordinary summit dedicated to defence and Ukraine. #EuropeNews

www.euronews.com

 

[Simply Southern]

"Shadow Defence Secretary James Cartlidge responded sharply to Vance, pointing out that Nato's Article 5 has only been invoked once - by the US after the 9/11 attacks.

He wrote on X: "And [Britain] came to their aid deploying 1,000s of personnel to Afghanistan, including my own brother and numerous parliamentary colleagues, past and present.

"It's deeply disrespectful to ignore such service & sacrifice."

JD Vance branded 'deeply disrespectful' after DISMISSING Britain as 'random country that hasn't fought for 40 years' despite Afghan deployment

European leaders held crisis talks over the Ukraine war on Sunday

www.gbnews.com

What is it with politicians like JD Vance who use such non politican-like insulting language?! Surely he is not a politician at all! JMO MOO

What is a shadow defense secretary? Since somebody that sits on the sidelines?

Maybe JD is sending a message, it's a wake up call, Europe needs to get on the ball. Heard on TV last night .... They're like an X girlfriend, living in the past, bringing up stuff that happened years ago, trying to rehash and collect restitution, and no plans for the future.

We do appreciate any and all countries that sent troops to help America. I will be forever grateful.

Moo

 

[BrianJohnson]

The problem with Trump is that he doesn't actually believe in anything at all. All he's interested in is the acquisition of power. Power for power's sake. He's in the party he is purely because he sees it as being able to get him what he wants. He's a bully and a bigot and doesn't care about other humans.

I honestly find it difficult to believe how anyone can place any trust in him, I genuinely do. He lies and lies and lies and his supporters say nothing and even repeat his lies.

What your political leanings happen to be are irrelevant, imo. No one with any sense can possibly align behind Trump, regardless of what he claims his political stance is.

If DT goes on like this for the next four years then the USA is absolutely finished. It will be a vassal state of Russia and nothing more. As my above post, Man In The High Castle territory.

What I like about Trump is he puts his country first and his citizens, and their jobs, and safety first ahead of globalist agendas of Biden, Macron, Trudeau, Starmer, Sunak, Johnson, Blair etc, they were globalist sellouts who put other countries ahead of their own and endangered their citizens with open borders, unlimited immigration etc, Trump puts his country first which is what every leader anywhere should be doing

Do I like him as a person? not particularly, he has some deeply unpleasant character traits, but I support his agenda, Ukraine excepted

 

[Simply Southern]

You have to laugh? About war? OK.

Anyway. New today:

Commission pitches '€800bn' defence package ahead of leaders' summit

EU leaders will gather in Brussels on Thursday for an extraordinary summit dedicated to defence and Ukraine. #EuropeNews

www.euronews.com

I'm laughing about.....

Another meeting, of course everybody has to get on a plane and meet in person. I'm sure we'll see lots of festivities, photo shoots, hugs and pats on the back. Then big a announcement, they're working on a plan they'll announce when and where their next meeting will be. . The war will be over and a peace deal signed before they even come up with a written plan, much less implementing it.

It's going to be interesting to see if any of the countries are interested in taking advantage of a loan to help out Ukraine. Do none of these countries have reserve, contingency funds for emergencies?

Is this the European way of.... Running out the clock?
Moo...

 

[HmmMysterious]

Vance calls the Uk "some random country" that hasn't fought a war in 30 or 40 years. He really does need knocking down a peg or two doesn't he? What exactly is a "random" country anyway lol. Butwe know he meant to undermine the Uk. JMO

"The US vice-president has sparked a row with his comments about a potential peacekeeping force in Ukraine.

he said a US stake in Ukraine's economy was a "better security guarantee than 20,000 troops from some random country that hasn't fought a war in 30 or 40 years".

Anger over JD Vance 'random country' peacekeeping remark

The US vice-president faces criticism after saying troops from "some random country" will not deter Russia.

www.bbc.co.uk

JD Vance is proof that dumb people can go to Yale too. He's flying a little too close to the sun, huh?

 

[Mo Thuairim]

I'm laughing about.....

Another meeting, of course everybody has to get on a plane and meet in person. I'm sure we'll see lots of festivities, photo shoots, hugs and pats on the back. The big a big announcement, they're working on a plan. The war will be over and a peace deal signed before they even come up with a written plan, much less implementing it.

It's going to be interesting to see if any of the countries are interested in taking advantage of a loan to help out Ukraine.

Is this the European way of.... Running out the clock?
Moo...

But the article wasn't about a meeting. It was about financing an EU rearmament plan, announced ahead of the summit on Thursday. You may deem it insufficient but you were enquiring about something new today from Europe. I provided the link.

 

[RichardKimble]

I'm laughing about.....

Another meeting, of course everybody has to get on a plane and meet in person. I'm sure we'll see lots of festivities, photo shoots, hugs and pats on the back. Then big a announcement, they're working on a plan they'll announce when and where their next meeting will be. . The war will be over and a peace deal signed before they even come up with a written plan, much less implementing it.

It's going to be interesting to see if any of the countries are interested in taking advantage of a loan to help out Ukraine. Do none of these countries have reserve, contingency funds for emergencies?

Is this the European way of.... Running out the clock?
Moo...

The coalition of the willing for the next photo shoot, by the time they've reached a decision Zelensky will be fully on board with Trump.

Zelensky says he’s ready to resume negotiations with Trump

Volodymyr Zelensky said he is “ready to come to the negotiation table” with Donald Trump “as soon as possible” to sign a mineral deal and secure peace.

www.telegraph.co.uk

 

[Simply Southern]

What I like about Trump is he puts his country first and his citizens, and their jobs, and safety first ahead of globalist agendas of Biden, Macron, Trudeau, Starmer, Sunak, Johnson, Blair etc, they were globalist sellouts who put other countries ahead of their own and endangered their citizens with open borders, unlimited immigration etc, Trump puts his country first which is what every leader anywhere should be doing

Do I like him as a person? not particularly, he has some deeply unpleasant character traits, but I support his agenda, Ukraine excepted

Yeah we may not have free health care, which so many remind, us of so often.

But we do have.... Is one of the best, if not the best, military forces in the world. We are ready, we are prepared. We know what to do, and we don't need to meet for weeks, consult with other countries, to take immediate action. We can scramble jets, and the blink of an eye, to defend our country, from every corner of our borders and world wide.

Moo

 

[Simply Southern]

But the article wasn't about a meeting. It was about financing an EU rearmament plan, announced ahead of the summit on Thursday. You may deem it insufficient but you were enquiring about something new today from Europe. I provided the link.

They got to have a meeting they're all going to Belgium. They talked about this on Saturday. They should have it ready to roll by now. They really like getting together for these summits. You don't need a summit to announce or offer a plan. Send everybody a copy of the plan, so they can read ahead and be prepared with questions and set up a video conferences.

Moo

 

[justtrish]

Anti-Semitism has been rampant on our campuses and the U.S. Department of Education's Office of Civil Rights will now crack down on colleges and universities that fail to protect Jewish students on their campuses. By withholding federal funding, this will go a long way to ensure that leaders on our campuses protect students who are the victims of discrimination.

The images are still in my mind. Some colleges just turned the other way and allowed it, while Jewish students did class from their dorm rooms because it was not safe for them to attend class in person. That is not okay. Protesting should not endanger the lives of others and what I saw on some campuses was basically terrorism. If "protecting" Jewish students meant they are confined to their dorm rooms because the school can't ensure their safety, then the "students" doing that protesting needed to be removed from the school.

 

[Mo Thuairim]

They got to have a meeting they're all going to Belgium. They talked about this on Saturday. They should have it ready to roll by now. They really like getting together for these summits. You don't need a summit to announce or offer a plan. Send everybody a copy of the plan, so they can read ahead and be prepared with questions and set up a video conferences.

Moo

I think we are talking about two different things, though. The summit was taking place anyway. I was referring to Ursula von der Leyen's new plan to make changes to the EU fiscal rules to allow for a ramp-up in defence spending in member states. That's new today.

 

[Sundog]

​

​ Zelensky offers partial ceasefire with Russia to restart peace talks​

This is a headline from the Washington Post, but the article has a paywall, so not able to read it. Perhaps others can summarize it if they have access?​

 

[Vern]

Because it is T who is the only one who has attempted to bring P to the negotiation table. He is probably the only one who can bring P to the table. Z messed it up real bad.

So you imply you wish to see an all out war? You wish the creation of the Allied forces vs. the Axis, hence WW3. Do you even remotely realize the implications of this? T is not interested in this, neither are the American people. The Euro's and other warmongers will have to go it alone.

Sign up now, Z needs money, and meat, for the grinder.

Putin has proven he is not interested in peace.

Putin has proven that International Agreements & Peace Deals, aren't worth the very paper that they are written on. Liksewise the USofA: 1994 Budapest Memorandum and the USMCA - the very International Trade Agreement that Trump (as 45) insisted upon, negotiated & signed which he has tossed to the wind today - to name just two.

And, in addition to the US Presidents threats to annex Canada, Panama, and Denmark (via the annexation of their territory of Greenland) - all democratic sovereign nations I point out - last night his Vice President, the former military-reporter JD Vance, had this to say on the "Peace Deal" and another supposed-US ally, Britain (and as an aside - France):

Calls for Vance to apologize over British troops comment

JD Vance was today facing furious demands to apologize after he appeared to dismiss Britain as a 'random country that hasn't fought a war in 30 or 40 years'. The US Vice President was accused of 'disrespecting' the sacrifice of British troops who fought alongside American servicemen in Afghanistan and Iraq. He sparked widespread anger among veterans and MPs from across the House of Commons with his apparent dig at Britain's military history. It came as he rubbished Prime Minister Sir Keir Starmer 's offer of a peacekeeping force in Ukraine with British and French boots on the ground. Mr Vance used a Fox News interview to instead heap pressure on Ukraine to sign a minerals deal with US President Donald Trump. He said this was 'a way better security guarantee than 20,000 troops from some random country that hasn't fought a war in 30 or 40 years'. But seething ex-servicemen pointed out that 636 British troops died in Afghanistan and Iraq after the UK joined US military action in the wake of the 9/11 terror attacks.

They were there fighting and dying with the US: Gulf War 1, Afghanistan, Iraq, Lebanon, ISIS etc etc (just as Canada was). If Vance was actually a competent Military Correspondent - he KNEW those facts to be false when he spouted them. That is the exact opposite of 'diplomacy'. It is the very opposite of 'democratic'. It's all rhetoric.

One thing is very clear to me, IMO, and that is that no agreement signed by Putin and Trump without boots on the ground from ALL Nato countries and a commitment to initiate Article 5 if Russia so much as sends a reconnaissance drone over those NATO troops on border is worth any more than the paper its printed on ... for obvious reasons.

Indeed, despite the rhetoric of the past month plus, more accurately precisely because of that rhetoric and Trumps' words, actions & deeds, the world is actually much unsafer today. And not just for me.

This is not a normal day. Everything is not 'copacetic'.

No one needs enemies when they have 'friends' like this IMO.

So much so, that my mind is already playing scenarios where that already promised and shipped Ukrainian aid that was halted by the US aministration last night will instead find itself redirected to Russia. IMO. Time will tell.

.

 

[Charlot123]

They have free speech. What they don't have the right to, disrupt classes, physical violence and destruction and suppression of religious rights.

I clearly remember last year. Students holding buildings hostage, blocking students from dormitories, classrooms and even the cafeteria. Setting fire on campuses, burning flags, spray painting buildings, camping out for days and monuments. These actions are illegal and should be prosecuted.

Students are at college to go to school learn and receiving education. They do have the right to express themselves, they do not have the right to physically force their viewpoint on another.

I don't want my taxpayer dollar going to a school that allows this.
Moo...

Well, First Amendment still exists. Vandalism is inappropriate, but to understand, many of these colleges are private and depend on the students’ parents payments. I always wonder how come no one in colleges wrote letters to the parents explaining that employment is also ad lib and the photos from the demonstrations might hinder their children’s future jobs. Our prisons are overflown and we don’t need to throw in students there. JMO.

 

[Simply Southern]

The coalition of the willing for the next photo shoot, by the time they've reached a decision Zelensky will be fully on board with Trump.

Zelensky says he’s ready to resume negotiations with Trump

Volodymyr Zelensky said he is “ready to come to the negotiation table” with Donald Trump “as soon as possible” to sign a mineral deal and secure peace.

www.telegraph.co.uk

I love that new phrase they coined ... Coalition of the willing. So is that how you define whether people are willing to help out or not. This is a good test, they're quickly know who's got their back and who doesn't. Maybe they'll realize, the US is no longer going to fund security for Europe. They need to pitch in for their own security, rather than rely on NATO. They're using NATO for their general defense.

They came up with that on Saturday they should know who's willing and who's not willing by today. I should have known by Monday. As of this morning, scanning all the news from Europe, Canada, Australia nice to still thinking about it. I guess they're hoping they can run out the clock. The US will fix it and I can spend the next year complaining about it.

Well they're trying to figure out who's willing... Trump has moved on with his plan. The decision was made early last evening, to have a hold on aid. They all act surprised this morning. Trump's been saying for weeks he's not going to continue to fund and a winnable war.

I wonder if Zelensky realized, Europe's going to leave him high and dry. Hugs, pats on the back and photo shoots don't buy many missiles.

Moo....

 

[Sundog]

Well, First Amendment still exists. Vandalism is inappropriate, but to understand, many of these colleges are private and depend on the students’ parents payments. I always wonder how come no one in colleges wrote letters to the parents explaining that employment is also ad lib and the photos from the demonstrations might hinder their children’s future jobs. Our prisons are overflown and we don’t need to throw in students there. JMO.

Colleges and universities are not permitted to "write to parents." Privacy laws that respect students' privacy rights. Most of them are adults, anyway, having reaching the age of majority.

Also, private colleges and universities also receive federal funding, and they don't want to lose it. Student loans, federal student aid for tuition, etc. Private colleges and universities don't want their prospective students to lose federal funding, their enrollment would drop.

International students are on student visas in order to study here. They can be deported if they are breaking the terms of their visas, and if they support officially-designated terrorist groups.

 

[Marantz4250b]

What is a shadow defense secretary? Since somebody that sits on the sidelines?

Maybe JD is sending a message, it's a wake up call, Europe needs to get on the ball. Heard on TV last night .... They're like an X girlfriend, living in the past, bringing up stuff that happened years ago, trying to rehash and collect restitution, and no plans for the future.

We do appreciate any and all countries that sent troops to help America. I will be forever grateful.

Moo

The opposite number to the defence secretary who is appointed by HM official opposition, currently the Conservative Party.

 

[Simply Southern]

Well, First Amendment still exists. Vandalism is inappropriate, but to understand, many of these colleges are private and depend on the students’ parents payments. I always wonder how come no one in colleges wrote letters to the parents explaining that employment is also ad lib and the photos from the demonstrations might hinder their children’s future jobs. Our prisons are overflown and we don’t need to throw in students there. JMO.

They all heavily rely on federal funding. They received funding for grants, research projects, capital and structure improvements, and of course Federal aid to cover tuition.

Many wrote letters to colleges. Many colleges became so violent students were forced to go home, after paying tuition. Congress subpoenaed four Ivy league presidents, to find out why they weren't protecting students. Why students were being locked in buildings being assaulted. They ask why did these college has not called the police to protect the students.

Yeah, that money's gone. They're taking a heavy cuts to funding this year in the new budget. The new administration rescinded job offer for 20 Harvard law School graduates for employment with the federal government. Many large corporations rescinded job offers to these college students.

Oh you couldn't tell me they were, they all hid behind mask, hats and scarves.

Moo...

 

[Charlot123]

Colleges and universities are not permitted to "write to parents." Privacy laws that respect students' privacy rights. Most of them are adults, anyway, having reaching the age of majority.

Also, private colleges and universities also receive federal funding, and they don't want to lose it. Student loans, federal student aid for tuition, etc. Private colleges and universities don't want their prospective students to lose federal funding, their enrollment would drop.

International students are on student visas in order to study here. They can be deported if they are breaking the terms of their visas, and if they support officially-designated terrorist groups.

Well, the students are of the age when such things are more common. They protest, right or wrong. Their parents or grandparents (probably, parents) could have protested the Vietnam War.

If private colleges are receiving federal funds, why should the students who did not protest suffer from those who did? Cutting funds will affect all of our thinking elites.

Personally, I think that “reaction”, suppressing the movement would move the protesters “underground” and then everyone loses any track over them.

 

[Marantz4250b]

What I like about Trump is he puts his country first and his citizens, and their jobs, and safety first ahead of globalist agendas of Biden, Macron, Trudeau, Starmer, Sunak, Johnson, Blair etc, they were globalist sellouts who put other countries ahead of their own and endangered their citizens with open borders, unlimited immigration etc, Trump puts his country first which is what every leader anywhere should be doing

Do I like him as a person? not particularly, he has some deeply unpleasant character traits, but I support his agenda, Ukraine excepted

He absolutely does not, though. If he did he wouldn't be bending before Putin and carrying on a course of behavior which could allow Ukraine to fall to Russia. If that happens it will be bad for the US in an absolutely epic way.

He has just announced huge tariffs on many imported goods that American citizens will now be paying for. He's even lied to the population that it's someone in a foreign country that pays them.

He organised an insurrection because he didn't like that he lost an election. People were killed because of it. How is that possibly "putting his country first"?

Trump puts himself and his own gain ahead of everyone, including every other American citizen.