Russia Attacks Ukraine - 23 Feb 2022 #12

[Deleted member 39678]

Not if the peace deal says we can not go on Ukraine land although its not his land to decide.

What kind of deal is that? I can answer that for you. A real crappy one that should never be signed. JMO.

 

[UK Girl]

From watching the entire video of the Oval Office PC it's clear to me that President Trump showed restraint when Zelenskyy first rudely interrupted him.

After Zelenskyy launched his rant about how the US let Ukraine down and how the US will feel I saw a President who stood up for all Americans. It made me very proud that he is my President after watching how he handled the rude and obnoxious behavior of Zelenskyy. JMO.

Thats great but everyone else around the world saw it and most have a different opinion. Within minutes literally Zelensky was getting messages of support from other world leaders and indeed the public at large. People were generally disgusted tbh.

 

[otto]

They weren't trying to help him. They were trying to help themselves. And they were being rude.

That much is obvious. The attitudes of Trump, Vance, Musk and whoever else is running the country were disgraceful before, during and after their meeting with Zelenskyy. I don't think that Trump's supporters will agree because they don't seem to see tantrums, shouting matches, intimidation and name-calling as rude.

Trump's plan was to rob Ukraine and to then invite foreign investment in Ukraine for "reconstruction". The USA wanted 100% control over who is invited, and there's every reason to believe that the first invitation would be sent to Russia.

 

[keek]

Thats great but everyone else around the world saw it and most have a different opinion. Within minutes literally Zelensky was getting messages of support from other world leaders and indeed the public at large. People were generally disgusted tbh.

It was immediate! Disgust at t and his <modsnip> next to him. IMMEDIATE.

 

[UK Girl]

I actually can see Trump leaving Nato too but..at this point that may not be a bad thing for the security of the other countries in NATO.

 

[UK Girl]

I suppose the other issue is Trump and Vance made it plain they did not want Zelensky as President to the point they lied about him to try and turn people against him. Did he create that incident Friday so he can now say well I will help Ukraine but can not work with him?

 

[keek]

I suppose the other is Trump and Vance made it plain they did not want Zelensky as President to the point they lied about him to try and turn people against him. Did he create that incident Friday so he can now say well I will help Ukraine but can not work with him?

Makes sense, always denigrates people he knowwwwwws in his soul are better than him. Well he sniffs it out I mean.

 

[UK Girl]

Incidentally there is a big petition here atm to withdraw the offer to have another state visit here because of the outrage at how Zelensky was treated but also because of remarks that have been made about Canada.

 

[Betty P]

Incidentally there is a big petition here atm to withdraw the offer to have another state visit here because of the outrage at how Zelensky was treated but also because of remarks that have been made about Canada.

His many remarks about Canada are deeply offensive and alarming. There's absolutely no reason to speak of Canada and its leaders as Trump does, nor is there any reason to threaten them. Such incredible damage Trump has inflicted on all of us.

 

[Cryptic]

It is mind blowing how quickly some people can be duped into thinking that Ukraine is the one to blame.

While I dont blame Ukraine- especially as Russia wanted to end Ukrainian independence as a nation, not just take relatively pro Russian areas.

That aside, the war is complex and contains pretty of ironies:

- 2014: Ukrainian ultra violent Maidan protestors over throw their pro Russian president. Yaunovych was massively corrupt, from the poor, coal mining, pro Russian Donbass "West Virginia on the prairie" area and...... had been democratically elected.

Needless to say not all Russians appreciated that those seeking "democracy" used violence to over throw a democratically elected (but very corrupt) government .... but still democratically elected.

But.... its also ironic that while Russia supported the Donbass area separating from away from Ukraine, parts of Russia who want to separate from the Russian federation (Chechnya) are invaded and levelled.

 

[STAGNUM]

Didn't Macron correct him on something also last week?

Yes he did.

 

[Donswife48]

President Trump can sit back and let Europe and UK take over. It would be a relief to us (the USA) to have someone else be responsible. As long as we're in Nato, we will unfortunately be compelled to contribute our share to fund Nato, but until Europe, Ukraine and UK draw Nato into a war, we are still relieved of suppling cash and military goods. Time magazine reported that we supplied cold hard cash to Ukraine so they could pay their soldiers and run their state. USAID had reported the cash is being funneled through the World Bank. They admit they have zero oversight on how the money is spent. JMO MOO

 

[STAGNUM]

Does anyone know if there’s a complete full text transcript of the Oval Office meeting somewhere ? I’m only finding edited versions. Thanks !

It is far better to watch the raw 43 minute video. The transcripts and sound bites don't allow the full context.

 

[STAGNUM]

Oh, I actually watched the whole video, thank you. I have watched Zelenskyy since "Quarter 95", his show, and then as a President. And I watch Ukrainian analytics frequently.

It is not about command of English. It is about how you, a politician, whose country's future depends on a huge partner like US, deal with the change of power. When the new president may still have some own memories about prior communications. Trump has a long personal memory. But as a businessman, he is quid pro quo. So I was not surprised when "Hunter's laptop" popped up. I knew that it would be somehow mentioned, probably as the prelude to signing the agreement. The message was obvious, you sign it as is or not. These are our current conditions.

Now, I am not sure that Trump has totally made up his mind about who's an ally or a foe. I think it is very complex. But what was on the table for Ukraine was obvious.

The interpreter gives you the time to think over your answer in a complex situation.

We are not talking about who was polite or not. Politics makes strange bedfellows, we all know.

Politically, it was a loss for Zelenskyy. And he did grow up into a politician over these years.

"Politically, it was a loss for Zelenskyy."

Nope:
Based upon the opinions expressed here in US and in Europe Zelenskyy has come out on top. He has gotten strong commitments from EU nations and also he is free of constraints placed on him by trump and prior administrations. I see him making a huge surge in ousting Putin from his borders and perhaps striking bigger targets inside Russia.

 

[SeesSeas]

Does anyone know if there’s a complete full text transcript of the Oval Office meeting somewhere ? I’m only finding edited versions. Thanks !

Text transcript is below the video:
C-SPAN
February 28, 2025

President Trump Meets with Ukrainian President Zelensky​

President Trump Meets with Ukrainian President Zelensky

A heated argument broke out between President Donald Trump, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky, and Vice President JD Vance in the White House Oval Office. The confrontation occurred before a deal was supposed to be made between Ukraine and the United States in which Ukraine would give the...

www.c-span.org

 

[STAGNUM]

..they only matter to t, bff calls, bro's. He'd never and if so, they would be scripted etc for the public's ears.

"It would be a PERFECT CALL, Everyone says".

 

[keek]

Incidentally there is a big petition here atm to withdraw the offer to have another state visit here because of the outrage at how Zelensky was treated but also because of remarks that have been made about C

"Politically, it was a loss for Zelenskyy."

Nope:
Based upon the opinions expressed here in US and in Europe Zelenskyy has come out on top. He has gotten strong commitments from EU nations and also he is free of constraints placed on him by trump and prior administrations. I see him making a huge surge in ousting Putin from his borders and perhaps striking bigger targets inside Russia.

Totally agree re the striking bigger targets now, nothing to lose, the so called peace talks were a farce and not about peace and safety and return to decent living in Ukraine for the Ukrainians. p would never let that happen, all that 'money' sitting in the land and also to own all of it along with the country itself.

 

[Charlot123]

Obviously Zelenskyy is politically naive and it's not a surprise to me he is afraid of diplomacy because he doesn't understand how it works.
1
I think that Ukraine would be better served by someone with the talents needed to get things done. JMO.

He may not be naive.
But politics have become the game of personalities.
So the question is, who agrees to sit with whom at the negotiating table. We are past the time of Yalta, obviously.

 

[STAGNUM]

Makes sense, always denigrates people he knowwwwwws in his soul are better than him. Well he sniffs it out I mean.

Trump is simply a huge bully and he surrounds himself with useful <modsnip> that he bullys. It is all about feeding his ego. That meeting failed Trump, <modsnip>

 

[Donswife48]

He may not be naive.
But politics have become the game of personalities.
So the question is, who agrees to sit with whom at the negotiating table. We are past the time of Yalta, obviously.

Zelensky did meet with a bipartisan group of senators before the Friday meeting with Trump.

Senators on both sides of the aisle tried to provide Zelenskyy with "friendly coaching," according to two people who were in the room during the bipartisan meeting with the Ukrainian leader.

While Zelenskyy did express gratitude while meeting with the senators, those in the room said he also pushed back, telling senators he needed a security guarantee. A few senators told him to focus on the mineral deal first and return to security later.

MSN

www.msn.com