4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #105

[Megnut]

Good gracious.

he had 2 months to clean it. You might be confusing having a dead body in a car... that is totally different with blood oozing thru the floorboards, etc. This blood would have only been on the surface of the killer's clothes.

And clothing he no doubt removed before getting in the car. They're not called coveralls for nothing. Balaclava, outer-gloves.

BK likely exited the house around 4:17. And didn't drive away for several minutes.

By the time he drove away, his forensic bundle probably looked like a rolled up sleeping bag.

Drove away clean.

Kept cleaning it anyway. Insurance.

JMO

 

[Warwick7]

Yeah this is such an important point and one that imo some conveniently ignore when they claim BK could not have done it because apparently no victim blood was IDed from the car.. .

That six week lead BK had for evidence disposal cannot be over over emphasised. An excessive cleaning compulsion would have been his best friend when it came to scrubbing out his car. I think it's possible he began that cleaning job (just to be extra sure even if he pre-prepped seats with plastic etc) the evening of Sun Nov 13th when he switched off ( moo) his phone in the vicinity of Johnson WA ( per PCA).

The area is a vast rural back water. He disconnects from the network on dark ( 5.30pm). We don't know what his cash purchase was earlier that day at Albertsons in Lewington ( or was it Clarkson?) but moo my imagination sees him obsessively checking his seats by torchlight and doing some scrubbing, away from prying eyes, maybe with products purchased that very day. And maybe also disposing of evidence such as clothing and possibly the knife. Jmo

o.m.g. this makes so much sense to me. On my timeline I have a huge question mark by the 5:36 to 8:30 where he shut off his phone again. And now we know he was buying everything with cash he could have very well bought cleaning supplies, even a black light (which I argued against before). I hoped we would track him by his debit card. But hopefully he took his phone everywhere.

Edit: I want to edit my comment by posting a timestamp picture we have at the beginning of each thread in a link. I took a screenshot of it. Notice it never tells us where #10 is located.

 

[Miss Poovy]

He almost certainly would have used OxiClean, or another oxygen based cleaner. It's something I learned about it another case, where the killer made the mistake of laundering his clothes with bleach - DNA was still present.

Oxygen-Based Cleaners (e.g., OxiClean, Sodium Percarbonate-Based Products):

• Why it works: These cleaners contain active oxygen compounds (like sodium percarbonate) that release hydrogen peroxide when dissolved in water. They flood blood proteins with oxygen, degrading hemoglobin and DNA to the point where forensic tests (luminol, phenolphthalein, or hemoglobin tests) may yield negative results. A 2009 study from the University of Valencia found that detergents with active oxygen eliminated blood traces on various materials, even after 40 days, rendering them undetectable by standard forensic methods.
• Effectiveness: These products can remove both visible stains and microscopic traces, especially if used with thorough scrubbing and rinsing. They’re particularly effective on fabrics like car seats or carpets.
• Use in cars: Safe for most car interiors, though repeated applications may be needed for porous surfaces like carpets. They leave minimal residue and are less likely to damage materials compared to bleach.
• Availability: Widely available in supermarkets as laundry or upholstery cleaners (e.g., OxiClean Upholstery Cleaner).

Just from a regular laundry point of view, I much prefer Oxi-Clean for blood, ketchup or really any type of penetrating stain. In general, you don’t have to worry about leaving a lighter spot.

 

[DizzyB]

Just from a regular laundry point of view, I much prefer Oxi-Clean for blood, ketchup or really any type of penetrating stain. In general, you don’t have to worry about leaving a lighter spot.

For me, this is the only thing that the defense can hammer away at-no blood or victim DNA was found in his car.
I would love to know if any DNA was there, other than his. Was his Dad’s still there, from the drive back to PA, or was that gone too? What can be detected in a car that was cleaned six ways till Sunday?

 

[girlhasnoname]

Re: Hon Judge Hippler's Order on State's MIL Admissibility of Text Messages

In the context of State's arguments for admissibility of hearsay (roommates' text messages) because excited utterance and/or present sense impression, and Defense's counter arguments.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/CR01-24-31665/2025/042425+Order+on+States+Motions+in+Limine+RE+Text+Messages+and+911+Call.pdf

IMO, what an Incredibly detailed and considered order. This order rightfully and properly considers context (tone and order of text messages, in addition to their content). Judge Hippler presents his legal argument with a genuinely human and empathetic analysis of the surviving victims' actions.

In doing so he puts a plug in the dubiously conjectured (selective use of evidence) defense arguments as to how the surviving roommates would have behaved had they 'really' been scared, or startled.

Page 9 under Section IV Analysis
(my emphasis)

"...They were awoken from sleep after a night of drinking with D.M. reporting that she heard noises and saw a masked intruder in their home. None of the other roommates were responding to their calls and texts, further indicating something was amiss. It would be potentially terrifying for anyone, including these young women. To argue that they would have run out of the house or called someone else for help had they really been startled unempathetically ignores these circumstances and the trauma and confusion they were evidently experiencing, which likely offset logical thought. Indeed, the girls' fear and confusion is evident in their words, with both questioning what was going on, D.M. stating she was "freaked out," "scared" and "confused" and B.F. attempting to get them together quickly for safety. They were clearly under stress and attempting to make sense of a frightening situation."

footnote 9 at the bottom of Page 9.

"Defendant's argument also ignores the fact that D.M. indicated to B.F. that the intruder was leaving the house, in which case it is not surprising the girls did not want to run outside, had the thought crossed their minds at all."

I feel like Judge Hippler overseeing this case is a real blessing for justice. Jmo

^^This

Some of the most detailed responses to Motions I've seen by any Judge of record.

 

[girlhasnoname]

It was confronting reading Judge Hippler's summaries. Those poor kids. I wish HJ could be given some recognition for his bravery like an award or something.

Agree, he helped preserve the crime scene and protected the girls from further traumatization. Outstanding and quick thinking on HJ's part.

 

[girlhasnoname]

I honestly think BK will be watching this trial as if he is just an observer.... watching it from a criminal and technical evidence standpoint. This, after all, was his chosen field of study.

He knows he killed them. He also knows he will be convicted.

IMO, he wants to see (scientifically and theoretically) how the evidence is presented and rebutted. In other words, this was his "thesis" to see what it feels like to kill someone.. It will just be an extension of his "thesis" to see how it feels to be convicted. It completes the whole project.

As totally screwy as that all seems, that is my take on BK and why this trial is proceeding.

Absolutely, with a side of evil serial killer wanna be thrown in.

jmo

 

[SteveP]

I can easily imagine BK, the doctor of criminology wannabe that he is, literally keeping a 'scorecard' somewhere, recording all of his 'wins' pertaining to these murders, highlighting the times he outsmarted the authorities, versus the state's 'wins'. I can almost see 'no DNA or blood evidence found in car', in bold letters under his 'wins'.

I wonder how many times, lately, he has crumpled that list up and thrown it in the trash... JMO

 

[mrjitty]

Agree, he helped preserve the crime scene and protected the girls from further traumatization. Outstanding and quick thinking on HJ's part.

Seriously

Judge Gull could do with a sitting down with Judge Hippler for some pointers lol

 

[Warwick7]

Dec 2021 to Jan 2022 He applied to WSU.

Jan 10th He buys black balaclava.

Feb1st to Mar15th He is ccepted by WSU and applied to PPD.

March 20th-30th He buys Ka-Bar, sheath and sharpener.

April 1st Emails suggest Kohberger was one of four candidates being considered.
At the time of the emails, Kohberger was finishing his Master's degree program at Desales University in his home state of Pennsylvania. He subsequently moved to Pullman, Wash.

April 12th final interview with PPD

July 9th to Nov 7th between 10pm and 4am He was within 100 meters 23 times of that house.

In M00 does it look like going to Washington was all all an elaborate plan to murder someone?

 

[girlhasnoname]

I ran across this while trying to find out more info about him cleaning his car. I had read one sister might have been suspicious, but several family members? BK's past behavior - check, location at the time of the crime - check, description of suspect vehicle - check. I can see this as being a real possibility.

<snipped>

Sources told NBC’s Dateline that one of the accused killer’s older siblings grew increasingly suspicious of her brother and his behavior when the family gathered to spend the holidays together.

Her suspicions were so great that – at one point – several family members searched Mr Kohberger’s white Hyundai Elantra for possible evidence of the crime, they said.

Bryan Kohberger’s sister feared he was involved in Idaho murders

 

[Tealgrove]

Dec 2021 to Jan 2022 He applied to WSU.

Jan 10th He buys black balaclava.

Feb1st to Mar15th He is ccepted by WSU and applied to PPD.

March 20th-30th He buys Ka-Bar, sheath and sharpener.

April 1st Emails suggest Kohberger was one of four candidates being considered.
At the time of the emails, Kohberger was finishing his Master's degree program at Desales University in his home state of Pennsylvania. He subsequently moved to Pullman, Wash.

April 12th final interview with PPD

July 9th to Nov 7th between 10pm and 4am He was within 100 meters 23 times of that house.

In M00 does it look like going to Washington was all all an elaborate plan to murder someone?

That’s where Bundy started.

I just can’t stop thinking that in some morbid way he was trying to reenact Bundy’s reign of terror but make it his own.

I can be way off in this but a lot of planning went into these murders. Months of planning.

MOO

 

[Chloegirl]

Dec 2021 to Jan 2022 He applied to WSU.

Jan 10th He buys black balaclava.

Feb1st to Mar15th He is ccepted by WSU and applied to PPD.

March 20th-30th He buys Ka-Bar, sheath and sharpener.

April 1st Emails suggest Kohberger was one of four candidates being considered.
At the time of the emails, Kohberger was finishing his Master's degree program at Desales University in his home state of Pennsylvania. He subsequently moved to Pullman, Wash.

April 12th final interview with PPD

July 9th to Nov 7th between 10pm and 4am He was within 100 meters 23 times of that house.

In M00 does it look like going to Washington was all all an elaborate plan to murder someone?

The 100 m, 300 ft is important because there is nothing else to visit right there. Apartments and houses and neighbors no shopping, no reason to be going to a frat across the road and it is not far enough that you are actually in the arboretum running.

A graduate student from Pullman, WA has zero business in this area of Moscow, ID. It's loud, very close to UI, and full of undergrads coming and going. You can manufacture an idea why he would be on UI campus (not really he had everything he needed and more at WSU) but not this close to the house. JMOO

 

[Warwick7]

Dec 2021 to Jan 2022 He applied to WSU.

Jan 10th He buys black balaclava.

Feb1st to Mar15th He is ccepted by WSU and applied to PPD.

March 20th-30th He buys Ka-Bar, sheath and sharpener.

April 1st Emails suggest Kohberger was one of four candidates being considered.
At the time of the emails, Kohberger was finishing his Master's degree program at Desales University in his home state of Pennsylvania. He subsequently moved to Pullman, Wash.

April 12th final interview with PPD

July 9th to Nov 7th between 10pm and 4am He was within 100 meters 23 times of that house.

In M00 does it look like going to Washington was all all an elaborate plan to murder someone?

July 9 to Nov 7 between 10pm and 4am He was within 100 meters 23 times of that house.

Kohberger ceased using his debit card for purchases after November, 10.

Nov 13 He murdered students.

He started making ATM cash withdrawals on November 13.

(Date) He cleared his history, browser history between November, 11 and November, 16.

 

[Warwick7]

That’s where Bundy started.

I just can’t stop thinking that in some morbid way he was trying to reenact Bundy’s reign of terror but make it his own.

I can be way off in this but a lot of planning went into these murders. Months of planning.

MOO

Oh yes I truly believe this! And, I think he wanted to get one up on Bundy, but failed miserably.

 

[INfisherman]

o.m.g. this makes so much sense to me. On my timeline I have a huge question mark by the 5:36 to 8:30 where he shut off his phone again. And now we know he was buying everything with cash he could have very well bought cleaning supplies, even a black light (which I argued against before). I hoped we would track him by his debit card. But hopefully he took his phone everywhere.

Edit: I want to edit my comment by posting a timestamp picture we have at the beginning of each thread in a link. I took a screenshot of it. Notice it never tells us where #10 is located.

View attachment 581526

So he’s not on I-95 but near Blaine when his cell comes back online. That’s an odd place to go. Wonder if that was the trip to bury or destroy his clothing & do the initial straightening up of the car? I noticed while looking on Google maps there seems to be some major roadway construction which has been going on for a few years. A roadway veers off of 95 & goes generally north/south & current imagery shows what looks like 2 overpasses being constructed which go over Eid Road, which runs east/west & goes from 95 into Blaine. Using Google Earth & the historical imagery for 2022, there is a large brown area, just north of Eid Road, with dirt access roads leading directly to this brown area. This is the beginnings of the new road construction & was only dirt at the time. It is now under pavement, which would be a pretty good place to put items one doesn’t want found. The surrounding area is mostly farm ground & quite rural.

Current imagery:


Historic imagery from 17JUL22:


They also have him on camera in Albertson’s grocery, across the Snake River, purchasing items - cleaning items?

MOO

 

[stormymama]

In M00 does it look like going to Washington was all all an elaborate plan to murder someone?

SBM. Yes, I think he was going to school to learn how to get away with being a killer and what better place to do it than the next state over from where he was in school. MOO

 

[StarryStarryNight]

That’s where Bundy started.

I just can’t stop thinking that in some morbid way he was trying to reenact Bundy’s reign of terror but make it his own.

I can be way off in this but a lot of planning went into these murders. Months of planning.

MOO

I’ve wondered that too.
The only difference I see would be that, in the beginning, Bundy lured young women away, using his charisma and counting on their empathy and BK would never have been able to pull that off.
In the end, at FSU, Bundy entered the sorority house in the middle of the night and brutally killed as many students as he could in his up close and personal way. BK could have been following that plan.

 

[Megnut]

Kindly, the "we" was me & the person I quoted. Zero disrespect, rudeness or snark intended at all, just a fact of the matter.

Here is a report of an unidentified source, who I assume is not BK’s sister, mentioning bleach. It was posted upthread earlier by another member, as was the reported use of bleach (but must have been overlooked):

By that point, police said Mr Kohberger had already been spotted cleaning his car out with bleach and so the family members didn’t find anything of note, the source said.

Bryan Kohberger’s sister feared he was involved in Idaho murders

Sources told NBC’s Dateline that the accused killer’s family searched his white Hyundai Elantra for possible evidence of the Idaho college murders

www.the-independent.com

BK was working in a PhD in criminology & wrote numerous papers about preserving crime scenes & evidence, as I’m sure you’re already aware. It’s not much of a stretch to assume he likely did what was necessary (used bleach or another strong cleaning agent) to make sure his car was free of incriminating evidence as best as he could, seeing as how LE found nothing we know of which was incriminating after, I believe, 3 searches. He probably did this prior to his father arriving in WA for that ride home.

I believe there were 5 links posted just today concerning the topic of his car being cleaned. This particular one discusses the source as LE:

The man accused of murdering four University of Idaho students in November had thoroughly cleaned the interior and exterior of his car and was also seen wearing surgical gloves multiple times before being apprehended, a law enforcement source tells CNN.
[snip]
The source, who spoke on the condition of anonymity, was briefed on observations made by investigators during four days of surveillance leading up to Kohberger’s arrest at his family’s Pennsylvania home on December 30.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/06/us/idaho-killings-suspect-bryan-kohberger-friday/index.html

JMO

Bolding the quote about bleach --

"By that point, police said Mr Kohberger had already been spotted cleaning his car out with bleach and so the family members didn’t find anything of note, the source said."

Underscoring what others have said, I think it's a two part statement. Because BK cleaned his car, the family members didn't find anything of note.

Based on this one sentence, I don't know that we can conclude that the family members saw him clean his car. They may have, but to me, it sounds like LE was on it. IMO it was seen by surveillance.

Roll that car wash footage!

It's all moot anyway because BK surely took deliberate preventative measures to make sure no blood was transferred into the car in the first place. Cleaning it was just added insurance. Out, out, Spot!

JMO

 

[Megnut]

So he’s not on I-95 but near Blaine when his cell comes back online. That’s an odd place to go. Wonder if that was the trip to bury or destroy his clothing & do the initial straightening up of the car? I noticed while looking on Google maps there seems to be some major roadway construction which has been going on for a few years. A roadway veers off of 95 & goes generally north/south & current imagery shows what looks like 2 overpasses being constructed which go over Eid Road, which runs east/west & goes from 95 into Blaine. Using Google Earth & the historical imagery for 2022, there is a large brown area, just north of Eid Road, with dirt access roads leading directly to this brown area. This is the beginnings of the new road construction & was only dirt at the time. It is now under pavement, which would be a pretty good place to put items one doesn’t want found. The surrounding area is mostly farm ground & quite rural.

Current imagery:
View attachment 581533

Historic imagery from 17JUL22:
View attachment 581534

They also have him on camera in Albertson’s grocery, across the Snake River, purchasing items - cleaning items?

MOO

Lends itself to getting lost. And needing his GPS to get back home.

I'm surprised he didn't "accidentally" break his phone or delete his history...

Einstein-of-crime didn't think of everything.

JMO