4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #105

[Chloegirl]

It’s here: https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/CR01...s+in+Limine+RE+Text+Messages+and+911+Call.pdf

Thank you! Poor XK (peace to you). Head towards the wall, feet towards the door -- not good. I think someone with more life experience might have known that meant more but at 19, probably not. JMOO

Okay, thinking a little further now it must have been absolutely surreal that HJ went to the kitchen to get a knife, to defend himself when about to check on what turned out to be stabbing victims. The reality of that is just too much.

 

[NCWatcher]

We know of him cleaning his car with bleach once in PA. I’d say it wasn’t the first cleaning that car had after the murders, with at least one likely including a vacuum.

JMO

I don't know that we know he cleaned his car with bleach in PA. So far as I can recall or locate now by googling, it has been reported he did. But it looks like his sister is the one saying he did that. That sister, one of his two sisters, has apparently said a lot of things to reporters and to LE. Maybe everything she's said is true, maybe it's not. But nothing she's said to reporters has been said under oath so I'm not ready to accept everything they report she says. Family dynamics can be weird & who knows what goes on with sibling relationships. At any rate, I can't find any MSM report saying LE found traces of bleach when the car was seized and essentially taken apart. I did see a mention that LE was surprised not to find bleach. I also did see mention a vacuum cleaner was seized but nothing of note was found there either.
MOO

 

[Cool Cats]

Buys the knife 8 months prior.

Assembles the balaclava, coveralls....

Stops using his debit card...

We've been asking why that night...

Looks like he was ramping up for it, months, weeks, days in advance...

His launch window.

Will we ever learn how he picked that night?

He was literally running out of time.

He wanted to do it on the weekend, I believe, because he actually was working as a lousy PHD teaching assistant during the week.

There were less and less weekends available to do the crimes before winter break. He needed to commit the crimes and then still have time to live in that area to see the local reaction. We see his smug photo, he was proud that he got it done and could watch his students' reactions. Very sick mind.

2 Cents

 

[Warwick7]

I don't know that we know he cleaned his car with bleach in PA. So far as I can recall or locate now by googling, it has been reported he did. But it looks like his sister is the one saying he did that. That sister, one of his two sisters, has apparently said a lot of things to reporters and to LE. Maybe everything she's said is true, maybe it's not. But nothing she's said to reporters has been said under oath so I'm not ready to accept everything they report she says. Family dynamics can be weird & who knows what goes on with sibling relationships. At any rate, I can't find any MSM report saying LE found traces of bleach when the car was seized and essentially taken apart. I did see a mention that LE was surprised not to find bleach. I also did see mention a vacuum cleaner was seized but nothing of note was found there either.
MOO

I have to keep an open mind understanding what happened on November 13th.

For example during the last 2-3 years nothing has been released about HJ as he went into the house. A lot of things like "nothing was ever mentioned" or "I see that as baseless" or "there is no evidence of" Are based on the very little info we are given.

Going back to HJ, here now we are reading that he went up the steps into the kitchen grabbed a knife before heading towards XK's room. So just because we're not giving all the details in the beginning doesn't mean that things didn't happen or that don't need to put stock in them.

 

[Warwick7]

He was literally running out of time.

He wanted to do it on the weekend, I believe, because he actually was working as a lousy PHD teaching assistant during the week.

There were less and less weekends available to do the crimes before winter break. He needed to commit the crimes and then still have time to live in that area to see the local reaction. We see his smug photo, he was proud that he got it done and could watch his students' reactions. Very sick mind.

2 Cents

I agree. And he needed them drunk. He needed them in a vulnerable state. So it had to be the weekend. And, in M00, as hateful as he is, he wanted to ruin thanksgiving for others.

 

[Warwick7]

Well that answered the lighting question I had about BK. I mean if everything is dark at 4am how could he see anything? Well DM could see Xana on her floor as she ran downstairs.

 

[NCWatcher]

I have to keep an open mind understanding what happened on November 13th.

For example during the last 2-3 years nothing has been released about HJ as he went into the house. A lot of things like "nothing was ever mentioned" or "I see that as baseless" or "there is no evidence of" Are based on the very little info we are given.

Going back to HJ, here now we are reading that he went up the steps into the kitchen grabbed a knife before heading towards XK's room. So just because we're not giving all the details in the beginning doesn't mean that things didn't happen or that don't need to put stock in them.

Simply because we don't know something happened doesn't mean it didn't happen, that's true. BUT saying BK cleaned his car with bleach in PA and authorities saying no traces of bleach were found when the car was seized soon after he supposedly bleached it, does call into serious question the claim he cleaned the car with bleach in PA. If not that, then it calls into question the ability of LE to do a proper search of the car they practically disassembled.

The sister saying something happened doesn't mean it happened or that we should automatically put stock in what she says. Maybe she was mistaken. Or maybe her statement is untrue for other reasons we don't know of at this point.
MOO

 

[Arkay]

The sister saying something happened doesn't mean it happened or that we should automatically put stock in what she says. Maybe she was mistaken. Or maybe her statement is untrue for other reasons we don't know of at this point.

Perhaps.

Or perhaps she just knows her own brother better than we do.

IMO

 

[Warwick7]

Simply because we don't know something happened doesn't mean it didn't happen, that's true. BUT saying BK cleaned his car with bleach in PA and authorities saying no traces of bleach were found when the car was seized soon after he supposedly bleached it, does call into serious question the claim he cleaned the car with bleach in PA. If not that, then it calls into question the ability of LE to do a proper search of the car they practically disassembled.

The sister saying something happened doesn't mean it happened or that we should automatically put stock in what she says. Maybe she was mistaken. Or maybe her statement is untrue for other reasons we don't know of at this point.
MOO

You make good points. At trial I do fear we are going to hear much much more than what we've seen in print.

 

[Ghostwheel]

Well that answered the lighting question I had about BK. I mean if everything is dark at 4am how could he see anything? Well DM could see Xana on her floor as she ran downstairs.

I keep thinking that Good Vibes light was something that was on at all times, but that has probably never been said. I have night lights all over my house so I suppose I just assumed it.

 

[NCWatcher]

Perhaps.

Or perhaps she just knows her own brother better than we do.

IMO

Could be. But the car bleaching story she supposedly told hasn't been backed up by physical evidence. LE was supposedly surprised not to find traces of bleach in the car but it wasn't found. That tends to call into question the sister's story of seeing him clean the car with bleach.

As a rule, family members aren't unbiased reporters. And they aren't always accurate in what they say. We all have perceptual biases, after all. A family member may know her family member better than the public does but that doesn't mean her perceptions are always accurate. Sometimes it means the opposite. And at any rate, the sister hasn't been questioned under oath or cross-examined. So I'm not ready to accept her claims as true especially when they SEEM to conflict with physical findings.
MOO

 

[Warwick7]

If it's his "rigid belief" he's going to be found not guilty---then he's in for a rude awakening.

 

[Warwick7]

Could be. But the car bleaching story she supposedly told hasn't been backed up by physical evidence. LE was supposedly surprised not to find traces of bleach in the car but it wasn't found. That tends to call into question the sister's story of seeing him clean the car with bleach.

As a rule, family members aren't unbiased reporters. And they aren't always accurate in what they say. We all have perceptual biases, after all. A family member may know her family member better than the public does but that doesn't mean her perceptions are always accurate. Sometimes it means the opposite. And at any rate, the sister hasn't been questioned under oath or cross-examined. So I'm not ready to accept her claims as true especially when they SEEM to conflict with physical findings.
MOO

BBM
We do not know all the evidence yet.

 

[Ghostwheel]

Simply because we don't know something happened doesn't mean it didn't happen, that's true. BUT saying BK cleaned his car with bleach in PA and authorities saying no traces of bleach were found when the car was seized soon after he supposedly bleached it, does call into serious question the claim he cleaned the car with bleach in PA. If not that, then it calls into question the ability of LE to do a proper search of the car they practically disassembled.

The sister saying something happened doesn't mean it happened or that we should automatically put stock in what she says. Maybe she was mistaken. Or maybe her statement is untrue for other reasons we don't know of at this point.
MOO

Help me, please. Where did authorities say there was no trace of bleach? Document or report somewhere? Just point me in the right direction and I'll search myself. TIA.

 

[NCWatcher]

BBM
We do not know all the evidence yet.

True. But LE said no bleach was found. Maybe they lied but I personally doubt it. It's one thing to choose not to disclose something, quite another to make blatantly false statements to the public or to create false official reports. I don't think those things happen except under extremely rare circumstances but if they do, and if they happened here, then some things we think we know that are incriminating might not be true if LE was lying.
MOO

 

[Warwick7]

Help me, please. Where did authorities say there was no trace of bleach? Document or report somewhere? Just point me in the right direction and I'll search myself. TIA.

And....bleach can take several hours or a few days then it dissipates. LE wouldn't be able to find a trace of it.

There was what 5 or more days from the surveillance cleaning to the arresting? That is plenty of time for it to dissipate.

 

[Warwick7]

I'm trying put this in order.

They all went up the stairs together, HJ got a knife from the kitchen, DM saw XK again and started to cry. HJ yelled for them all to leave when EA started to walk up the stairs. They went outside, called 911.

And then during the 911 call everyone went back into the house again after the 911 operator told them to check for breathing.

Thus why DM told BF, “but we HAVE to…”

 

[MassGuy]

And....bleach can take several hours or a few days then it dissipates. LE wouldn't be able to find a trace of it.

There was what 5 or more days from the surveillance cleaning to the arresting? That is plenty of time for it to dissipate.

He almost certainly would have used OxiClean, or another oxygen based cleaner. It's something I learned about it another case, where the killer made the mistake of laundering his clothes with bleach - DNA was still present.

Oxygen-Based Cleaners (e.g., OxiClean, Sodium Percarbonate-Based Products):

• Why it works: These cleaners contain active oxygen compounds (like sodium percarbonate) that release hydrogen peroxide when dissolved in water. They flood blood proteins with oxygen, degrading hemoglobin and DNA to the point where forensic tests (luminol, phenolphthalein, or hemoglobin tests) may yield negative results. A 2009 study from the University of Valencia found that detergents with active oxygen eliminated blood traces on various materials, even after 40 days, rendering them undetectable by standard forensic methods.
• Effectiveness: These products can remove both visible stains and microscopic traces, especially if used with thorough scrubbing and rinsing. They’re particularly effective on fabrics like car seats or carpets.
• Use in cars: Safe for most car interiors, though repeated applications may be needed for porous surfaces like carpets. They leave minimal residue and are less likely to damage materials compared to bleach.
• Availability: Widely available in supermarkets as laundry or upholstery cleaners (e.g., OxiClean Upholstery Cleaner).

 

[INfisherman]

I don't know that we know he cleaned his car with bleach in PA. So far as I can recall or locate now by googling, it has been reported he did. But it looks like his sister is the one saying he did that. That sister, one of his two sisters, has apparently said a lot of things to reporters and to LE. Maybe everything she's said is true, maybe it's not. But nothing she's said to reporters has been said under oath so I'm not ready to accept everything they report she says. Family dynamics can be weird & who knows what goes on with sibling relationships. At any rate, I can't find any MSM report saying LE found traces of bleach when the car was seized and essentially taken apart. I did see a mention that LE was surprised not to find bleach. I also did see mention a vacuum cleaner was seized but nothing of note was found there either.
MOO

Kindly, the "we" was me & the person I quoted. Zero disrespect, rudeness or snark intended at all, just a fact of the matter.

Here is a report of an unidentified source, who I assume is not BK’s sister, mentioning bleach. It was posted upthread earlier by another member, as was the reported use of bleach (but must have been overlooked):

By that point, police said Mr Kohberger had already been spotted cleaning his car out with bleach and so the family members didn’t find anything of note, the source said.

Bryan Kohberger’s sister feared he was involved in Idaho murders

Sources told NBC’s Dateline that the accused killer’s family searched his white Hyundai Elantra for possible evidence of the Idaho college murders

www.the-independent.com

BK was working in a PhD in criminology & wrote numerous papers about preserving crime scenes & evidence, as I’m sure you’re already aware. It’s not much of a stretch to assume he likely did what was necessary (used bleach or another strong cleaning agent) to make sure his car was free of incriminating evidence as best as he could, seeing as how LE found nothing we know of which was incriminating after, I believe, 3 searches. He probably did this prior to his father arriving in WA for that ride home.

I believe there were 5 links posted just today concerning the topic of his car being cleaned. This particular one discusses the source as LE:

The man accused of murdering four University of Idaho students in November had thoroughly cleaned the interior and exterior of his car and was also seen wearing surgical gloves multiple times before being apprehended, a law enforcement source tells CNN.
[snip]
The source, who spoke on the condition of anonymity, was briefed on observations made by investigators during four days of surveillance leading up to Kohberger’s arrest at his family’s Pennsylvania home on December 30.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/06/us/idaho-killings-suspect-bryan-kohberger-friday/index.html

JMO

 

[Ghostwheel]

I'm trying put this in order.

They all went up the stairs together, HJ got a knife from the kitchen, DM saw XK again and started to cry. HJ yelled for them all to leave when EA started to walk up the stairs. They went outside, called 911.

And then during the 911 call everyone went back into the house again after the 911 operator told them to check for breathing.

Thus why DM told BF, “but we HAVE to…”

GJ trans. is grand jury transcript

They pull specific lines out from the Grand Jury Transcript which may have been the way it was said during the Grand Jury, but not necessarily the order things happened. The page/line numbers don't make sense in the order they are. IMO.

"At approximately 11:50 a.m., D.M. called her friend E.A. and asked her to come over and check the house because she was scared. E.A. and her boyfriend, H.J. came over. Exh. D1; GJ Trans. at 276:9-12. They met D.M. and B-F. at the bottom floor of the house. GJ Trans. at 277:24. Together D.M., B.F. and H.J. started to walk up the stairs to the second floor. When they reached the second floor, H.J. went to the kitchen to grab a kitchen knife. When he came back out, D.M. "saw Xana again for a split second. And I just started bawling because I thought she had just like I don't even know. I thought maybe she was still just drunk and all asleep on the floor." GJ Trans. at 190: 1-25; 245:22-246:20. B.F. also saw Xana lying on the floor. /d. at 231:13-17. H.J. told D.M. and B.F. to "get out." E.A., who had started up the stairs, also turned around after H.J. instructed her not to come any further. /d. at 276:13-21. They both went outside. Shortly afterwards, H.J. exited the house and told them to call 911. He was pale white and mentioned something about someone being unconscious"