4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #105

[Warwick7]

The D had no hesitation in testing the fingernail mixture using cybergenetics.
Excluded BK.
The P came back and evaluated the testing - which was confirmed by their expert. Additional testing using true allele was performed by the P. Excluded BK.

Maybe the D has tested more than just the fingernail mixture?
JMO

Yes and if I remember correctly the defense counted as worthy is nothing.

 

[Cool Cats]

Maybe more footprints were found during additional crime scene processings, as the PCA states this latent shoe print was found during the second go around. It could be they have more than one, for all anyone knows at this point. Only one has been revealed by the state. I doubt any prosecutor is going to fully reveal all their cards or trial strategy in preliminary hearings. They’re only going to reveal enough to suppress motions filed by the defense or as required by an order from the court.

AT has argued that DNA left at a crime scene shouldn’t be constitutional for probable cause. That was not a fact. So not everything she says is true.

ETA MOO, "…or as required by an order…"

Quote:
"AT has argued that DNA left at a crime scene shouldn’t be constitutional for probable cause."

This doesn't make sense to me because the sheath DNA was left out of the arrest warrant and it was specifically stated in the warrant that the DNA was left out because there was the possibility the judge could rule it inadmissible.

It could cause problems if the probable cause - to arrest and search - was based on DNA evidence that turned out to be inadmissible at trial.

Pretty interesting that the PCA (probable cause affidavit) held enough evidence without the DNA. The witness testimony and car and phone evidence held up under grand jury scrutiny. Enough for the GJ to come back with 5 indictments. 4 aggravated murders and 1 burglary. In fact, enough aggravating factors to prosecute the defendant under death penalty specifications.

2 Cents

 

[Nila Aella]

Yes and if I remember correctly the defense counted as worthy is nothing.

It was mega worthy.
It eliminated the testimony of inconclusive!
And we don't know if the comparisons done by cybergenetics included anyone else (previously compared as inconclusive).
JMO

 

[jepop]

Amazon Click
JMO

I think Hippler ruled on that motion from the bench. My understanding is Defense's motion re Amazon clicks and knife purchase was denied. Jmo

Memorialized below. Point K, page 7.

ETA link

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/CR01-24-31665/2025/041825+Order+Memorializing+Oral+Rulings+on+Motions+in+Limine.pdf

 

[SteveP]

Amazon Click
JMO

Oh, thanks!

 

[Warwick7]

the PCA said that too.


View attachment 581215

source:
Exhibit A iil) ' 'Fo Statement of Brett Payne

This snip from the PCA does not prove there weren't other prints. This is a statement about what they want to discuss--that particular print.

 

[Nila Aella]

I think Hippler ruled on that motion from the bench. My understanding is Defense's motion re Amazon clicks and knife purchase was denied. Jmo

Memorialized below. Point K, page 7.

ETA link

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/CR01-24-31665/2025/041825+Order+Memorializing+Oral+Rulings+on+Motions+in+Limine.pdf

There is another order pending: vague and undisclosed testimony that he footnoted would be a seperate order.

Within this motion, Defendant also seeks to exclude testimony by Shane Cox and Michael Douglass on grounds that their expert disclosures were insufficient. That will be addressed in a separate order regarding Defendant's motion to exclude vague and undisclosed expert testimony.

JMO

 

[SteveP]

Amazon Click
JMO

Thank you for replying. As poster @jepop has noted and linked, Judge HIppler denied the defense motion to keep that out. I thought that he had, but then thught maybe the purchase was separated from other click activity surrounding the search after the murders.

 

[Warwick7]

It was mega worthy.
It eliminated the testimony of inconclusive!
And we don't know if the comparisons done by cybergenetics included anyone else (previously compared as inconclusive).
JMO

A WS member may feel it is worthy. But as for AT she didn't seem to feel it was worthy.

 

[Warwick7]

Prosecutor Bill Thompson

Who isn't trying the State's case in the court of public opinion nor at hearings. Saving the case in chief for trial.

JMO

Thank you!

 

[Cool Cats]

We are still waiting for Judge Hippler to issue rulings on the Defense motion to strike the death penalty, and the admissibility of text messages and 911 call audio. Any other biggies?

I find it interesting that the judge ruled that evidence supporting BK's autism spectrum disorder (ASD) cannot be used by the defense with 2 exceptions:

1.) Kohberger takes the stand.

2.) Defense experts can speak about ASD or obsessive-compulsive (OCD) behaviors in their rebuttal arguments.

For example, it could be used in connection to Kohberger's alibi:

His lawyers claim he was prone to solo nighttime drives and was doing so on the night of the murders. Defense experts could weigh in on his OCD causing sleep difficulties that led to that penchant for night drives to decompress.

Idaho college killings: Judge sides with prosecution in key rulings, including roommate's description of intruder

The judge overseeing the University of Idaho murders case has made several key rulings on what can be admitted at suspect Bryan Kohberger's upcoming capital murder trial.

abcnews.go.com

 

[INfisherman]

Quote:
"AT has argued that DNA left at a crime scene shouldn’t be constitutional for probable cause."

This doesn't make sense to me because the sheath DNA was left out of the arrest warrant and it was specifically stated in the warrant that the DNA was left out because there was the possibility the judge could rule it inadmissible.

It could cause problems if the probable cause - to arrest and search - was based on DNA evidence that turned out to be inadmissible at trial.

Pretty interesting that the PCA (probable cause affidavit) held enough evidence without the DNA. The witness testimony and car and phone evidence held up under grand jury scrutiny. Enough for the GJ to come back with 5 indictments. 4 aggravated murders and 1 burglary. In fact, enough aggravating factors to prosecute the defendant under death penalty specifications.

2 Cents

It was during the Frank’s hearing, I believe. I could very well be mistaken, as I am going from memory. It was what prompted JH to say his every day & twice on Sunday. Apologies if that was an incorrect link made by me.

ETA - I checked to make sure. D wanted DNA thrown out because they felt it was unconstitutional to use it to track him down via IGG without a warrant. I believe AT argued LE lacked PC to do so. JH stated when there’s a match as in this case, it’s PC every day & twice on Sunday. Hope that make sense. Had nothing to do with the PCA, per se. Link below.

Judge denies Bryan Kohberger motions to exclude key DNA evidence from trial

Kohberger, who is charged in the November 2022 murders of four students at an off-campus residence near the University of Idaho, has his trial is set for Aug. 11

www.nbcnews.com

 

[jepop]

There is another order pending: vague and undisclosed testimony that he footnoted would be a seperate order.

Within this motion, Defendant also seeks to exclude testimony by Shane Cox and Michael Douglass on grounds that their expert disclosures were insufficient. That will be addressed in a separate order regarding Defendant's motion to exclude vague and undisclosed expert testimony.

JMO

Ok. But to be clear the Amazon Click motion re relevance was infact denied.

Defense's Vague and Undisclosed testimony motion is still pending an order. State's proposed fact bearing experts for the Amazon evidence are included in that motion. Moo

I recall the State's responses to defense arguments and my prediction is Hippler will find no grounds to exclude the witnesses from testifying. The fact that the court found the Amazon evidence highly relevant supports this conjecture. My understanding is the State's witnesses will offer factual testimony, not opinions. Imo the defense's motion to exclude them is likely baseless.

 

[New Penny]

FYI

Very technical. Guest is an expert on mobile devices, call details records, etc.

Let me summarize it.

If you have a mobile device, you have no privacy.

Have a nice day.

JMO

He was also very critical of Sy Ray (sp?)

IMO

 

[Nila Aella]

DBM

 

[INfisherman]

Quote:
"AT has argued that DNA left at a crime scene shouldn’t be constitutional for probable cause."

This doesn't make sense to me because the sheath DNA was left out of the arrest warrant and it was specifically stated in the warrant that the DNA was left out because there was the possibility the judge could rule it inadmissible.

It could cause problems if the probable cause - to arrest and search - was based on DNA evidence that turned out to be inadmissible at trial.

Pretty interesting that the PCA (probable cause affidavit) held enough evidence without the DNA. The witness testimony and car and phone evidence held up under grand jury scrutiny. Enough for the GJ to come back with 5 indictments. 4 aggravated murders and 1 burglary. In fact, enough aggravating factors to prosecute the defendant under death penalty specifications.

2 Cents

Quoting this again because I left out the most important part of my response above.

 

[New Penny]

Investigators found two sources of unknown male blood DNA at the crime scene, which the defense has already questioned in court. A “blood spot” was discovered on a handrail inside between the first and second floors of the three-story Moscow home, while the other was found on a glove located outside of it, according to testimony from the lead police detective at a closed hearing in January.

Those DNA samples were not uploaded to try to identify them through the national DNA database, known as CODIS, because they were not eligible based on FBI criteria, Thompson said at an August 2023 court hearing

Read more at: https://www.idahostatesman.com/news/local/crime/article301947584.html#storylink=cpy

A 'blood spot' -----that does not sound like it was 'fresh blood.' imo

This sounds like a repeat of the “untested hair found on Libby’s sweatshirt! OMG!” From the Delphi murder trial which was proven to be her sister’s.

Move along nothing to see here.

ETA to add MOO

 

[Cool Cats]

Ok. But to be clear the Amazon Click motion re relevance was infact denied.

Defense's Vague and Undisclosed testimony motion is still pending an order. State's proposed fact bearing experts for the Amazon evidence are included in that motion. Moo

I recall the State's responses to defense arguments and my prediction is Hippler will find no grounds to exclude the witnesses from testifying. The fact that the court found the Amazon evidence highly relevant supports this conjecture. My understanding is the State's witnesses will offer factual testimony, not opinions. Imo the defense's motion to exclude them is likely baseless.

The defense is "twisting in the wind" to get evidence this damaging tossed out.

Their client left behind DNA specifically on a knife sheath under a victim but they claim this doesn't prove BK was at the crime scene, the sheath could have been put there by an unknown person - a John Doe.

But it is not a John Doe who went on Amazon before the murders and ordered that specific type of sheath and the knife to go with it and even a sharpener to maximize the lethal capabilities of the blade.

So the John Doe or SODDI defense (Some Other Dude Did It) goes "out the window" in the face of the Amazon evidence.

2 Cents

 

[katydid23]

The defense is "twisting in the wind" to get evidence this damaging tossed out.

Their client left behind DNA specifically on a knife sheath under a victim but they claim this doesn't prove BK was at the crime scene, the sheath could have been put there by an unknown person - a John Doe.

But it is not a John Doe who went on Amazon before the murders and ordered that specific type of sheath and the knife to go with it and even a sharpener to maximize the lethal capabilities of the blade.

So the John Doe or SODDI defense (Some Other Dude Did It) goes "out the window" in the face of the Amazon evidence.

2 Cents

Right, it proves that someone didnt put BK's DNA on their own knife probably.

But the D can still try and claim that BK bought a knife and it was stolen from him and then planted.

Nit that it sounds believable, but....

 

[Megnut]

If BK were any kind of real genius, he might have tried to frame himself... while producing an impenetrable alibi for himself, using software he would have had to engineer that could engage with his phone as if it were realtime human interfacing so it would look like he was somewhere verifiable while a lesser character was murdering the coeds, as if it was trying to frame BK every stab of the way. There's probably a really clever plotline for a movie here.

Student frames TA for murder, but there never was a student.

No worry here; BK's no genius.

JMO