4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #107

[PunishThenForgive]

The photos on his phone that he saved as well as his selfies would have had to come directly from the phone itself. I highly doubt that in 3 days LE was able to do a phone extraction and have enough time for someone to go through the results, find the relevant photos, AND give that information to Dateline.

Do the phone extraction, sure. Start looking through photos, probably. But to identify all those photos, make contact with someone at Dateline, and give them that info in that short period before the gag order--that I highly doubt, especially given how busy all the associated LE were at that point.

Immediately upon BK’s arrest, LE had access to his phone via face, fingerprint, or iris ID, according to the Dec. 29, 2022 - Search warrant (B. Kohberger), inventory, exhibits.

LE could then perform a data extraction on BK’s phone within minutes using Mobile Device Forensic Tools, according to the ACLU of Washington.

The search warrant allowed police to search BK’s phone for evidence such as that leaked to Dateline.

So LE would have access to BK’s photos and YouTube watch history and playlists very soon after his arrest. I bet they found disturbing content PDQ.

What would prevent a LE officer from using their own private phone to quickly take photos of this content, then share it with Dateline (which was likely very easy to contact)?

And Dateline didn’t need to wait for LE to identify any of those photos—Dateline could do that quite nicely itself.

Speculation/IMOO

 

[PunishThenForgive]

Immediately upon BK’s arrest, LE had access to his phone via face, fingerprint, or iris ID, according to the Dec. 29, 2022 - Search warrant (B. Kohberger), inventory, exhibits.

LE could then perform a data extraction on BK’s phone within minutes using Mobile Device Forensic Tools, according to the ACLU of Washington.

The search warrant allowed police to search BK’s phone for evidence such as that leaked to Dateline.

So LE would have access to BK’s photos and YouTube watch history and playlists very soon after his arrest. I bet they found disturbing content PDQ.

What would prevent a LE officer from using their own private phone to quickly take photos of this content, then share it with Dateline (which was likely very easy to contact)?

And Dateline didn’t need to wait for LE to identify any of those photos—Dateline could do that quite nicely itself.

Speculation/IMOO

If something like this happened, I doubt the leaker would be off the hook, though.

Surely LE agencies have rules against employees communicating with journalists without authorization, let alone leaking incriminating evidence—regardless of any court-imposed gag order.

 

[303gmf]

IMO - The original poster said we know for sure he went into the Mad Greek. The point I was making was, we don’t know & cannot be sure of this at all. You didn’t need to try & belittle me with your opinion. MOO

Belittle? Hardly

 

[PunishThenForgive]

I'm not sure why police would need to take the cameras to get the footage?

In the police body cam footage from the noise complaints in mid August and early September of 2022, just months before the murder, we can see the area around the front door and the back slider.

Bryan Kohberger case: Theory Idaho suspect was behind party house noise complaints debunked

Moscow, Idaho, police responded to noise complaints three times at the home where four University of Idaho students were later killed, but incident reports contain no evidence that prime suspect Bryan Kohberger placed the calls, as web sleuths have suggested.

www.foxnews.com

The first video in the article, with Kaylee in the sleeveless dress at the backdoor--at the very beginning and very end of the video you get a good look at the area left of the slider. The right side of the slider is visible at all times. You can also see a lot of the supporting posts for the deck above. No camera is visible.

Scroll down to the next video, where it is dark and starts at the front door. This is from the September 1 noise complaint. At 5-7 seconds into the video you get a good view of the doorbell and it is the same standard plain pushbutton doorbell we see in pictures of the house after the murders. At about 21 seconds you get a good view of that weird little wall that sticks out next to the spare room/storage room. Nothing is mounted there. At 29 seconds you get good view of the underside of the overhang from in front of the storage room all the way to the other end past BF's room. Nothing mounted up there. At 42 seconds, the officer has gone around back and you get a good view of the supporting post near the slider. Nothing mounted there.

Scroll down more to the final video with XK in a red hoodie. That is from September 2. At 3:34 it's just the plain rectangular push button doorrbell with no camera. The only thing mounted in the overhang are the recessed lights that you can see turned on in post murder photos. The front door lock is a keypad with a handle. You can see a metal disc covering what would have been the previous hole for the key entry. No cameras mounted around the front door frame.

Is it possible that they put one up between Sept 2 and Nov 13? Sure. But unlikely. The keypad front door lock seen here is the same one seen after the murders. I could go comb through social media of the girls posing out by the slider door and probably find images after Sept 2 of the back door as well.

Just to say--we all wish there had been security cameras. But there just doesn't seem to be any, from what we can see in videos and photos.

Not to mention if there was footage, AT would have tried to have that suppressed along with everything else. I also can't imagine Steve Goncalves not talking about security camera footage from 1122 if it existed.

ITA that there is no evidence that the house at 1122 King Rd ever had ring cameras.

However, IIRC the security camera at 1112 King was removed. Does anyone else remember that?

I see two porch lamps but no security camera in the photo of the house on Zillow:

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1112-King-Rd-Moscow-ID-83843/2085410319_zpid/

The photo isn’t dated, though. @gremlin444, what do you think?

Does anyone know why LE would take a security camera? Of course, it could have been removed by a graduating senior who had installed it herself.

 

[Sachi]

This trial cannot arrive fast enough. Eager for derailing efforts ,conjecture and blabbing irrelevance to be flattened like a sandcastle swallowed by an ocean tide of facts.

JUSTICE FOR MADDIE< KAYLEE< XANA AND ETHAN

" There are three sides to every story,
Yours, Mine
and
What really happened, which is better known as The Truth.
JTM

 

[Justice101]

Yep, and should there be a knife, it literally could be used to spread said icing on said cake.

Even though I firmly believe the knife is swimming with the fishes at the bottom of the Snake River along with the rest of his murder kit he hurled off the Red Wolf Bridge when he took his little Sunday sojourn down to the LC Valley.

Sorry to be graphic:

IMO based on what I have seen, flesh wounds with a knife cannot identify an individual knife per se... just the knife style and size. Not enough to PROVE that a given knife was the murder weapon just based on flesh wounds.

However, if the knife connected with bones which it probably did (ribs, arm, neck spine, leg bone, etc) AND there was some oddity with regard to the knife (tip previous broken, edge bent, edge with a chip or scar in it), and that spot happened to strike a bone, then there IS A CHANCE if there is some oddity in the knife like this that could have left a unique mark that could be matched up.

Unfortunately, I think there is almost ZERO chance there is any victim's DNA on the knife blade or handle itself. I'll bet he submerged the whole knife in alcohol or something after the crime.

I personally don't think it is THE knife and like someone else said, he probably ditched that along with his bloody clothes.

 

[Maat99]

This trial cannot arrive fast enough. Eager for derailing efforts ,conjecture and blabbing irrelevance to be flattened like a sandcastle swallowed by an ocean tide of facts.

JUSTICE FOR MADDIE< KAYLEE< XANA AND ETHAN

" There are three sides to every story,
Yours, Mine
and
What really happened, which is better known as The Truth.
JTM

It really is eye opening how easily people are swayed by YouTube conspiracy theories. Moo.

 

[Justice101]

It really is eye opening how easily people are swayed by YouTube conspiracy theories. Moo.

There are so many manifestations of people not believing the obvious:

1) Flat earthers.
2) Big Foot, Lock Ness Monster believers
3) Moon landing never happened

etc.

IMO, some people's inability to use deductive reasoning, insight, and critical thinking has been there all thru the ages. I used to argue with people about some of these things but it was a lost cause. I am just very thankful MOST of these people are not in a position of leadership when they can do more damage.

 

[ilovewings]

Re the motive - I don’t think there will ever be a clear motive behind BK’s actions, nor will there be just one IMO.

I think his reasoning is likely frayed, confusing and non-linear; his job was pretty much lost, far from his family, ongoing health and addiction issues would’ve taken a toll, lack of luck with women, poor self esteem, surrounded by criminology and investigative research. It’s a perfect storm for somebody like BK to do something like this. It’s nonsensical and immoral, and I think his “motive” will be an amalgamation of all these things. Both new problems in his life and recurring, persistent problems caused this.

JMO of course.

What it all came down to that night was rage- iMO it was pure unadulterated rage, from what ever caused the rage - it ultimately does not matter to me- IMO it was a rage killing.

 

[DizzyB]

What it all came down to that night was rage- iMO it was pure unadulterated rage, from what ever caused the rage - it ultimately does not matter to me- IMO it was a rage killing.

I try not to focus much on the “why” of a murderer’s mind. I’m curious as to why that night, instead of any other night, and why so many loops around, but I will never understand anyone’s drive to commit a murder. I don’t know if it’s rage, compulsion, misplaced revenge.

When reading about serial killers, there are supposedly 4 types: thrill seekers, mission-oriented, visionary killers, and power/control seekers. He could be any or all of those.

 

[iamshadow21]

I try not to focus much on the “why” of a murderer’s mind. I’m curious as to why that night, instead of any other night, and why so many loops around, but I will never understand anyone’s drive to commit a murder. I don’t know if it’s rage, compulsion, misplaced revenge.

When reading about serial killers, there are supposedly 4 types: thrill seekers, mission-oriented, visionary killers, and power/control seekers. He could be any or all of those.

The problem with categories like that is people tend to not fit neatly into boxes. It's why they've moved away from organised/disorganised, because most people show both. For example, planning to the nth degree, but leaving behind the sheath with his DNA - a mistake so basic that some people are convinced it's evidence of a conspiracy.

People are chaotic and contain multitudes. They also can act in ways that seem like they smack of self delusion or self sabotage when acting before, during and after a crime. It doesn't mean they're actually delusional, incapable, or 'trying to get caught'. They're just human, behaving in the ways that humans do, overestimating their own abilities and luck and underestimating how predictable their actions are and how competent those hunting them are.

As for 'types', you can read any of them into this crime and this perpetrator. Visionary probably the least, unless you're including in that the desire for power and glory through his killings, which is definitely a possibility. He was very much a student of violence and violent offenders. He could have wanted to join them in notoriety, and seen his path to that in a visionary light.

MOO

 

[PunishThenForgive]

ITA that there is no evidence that the house at 1122 King Rd ever had ring cameras.

However, IIRC the security camera at 1112 King was removed. Does anyone else remember that?

I see two porch lamps but no security camera in the photo of the house on Zillow:

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1112-King-Rd-Moscow-ID-83843/2085410319_zpid/

The photo isn’t dated, though. @gremlin444, what do you think?

Does anyone know why LE would take a security camera? Of course, it could have been removed by a graduating senior who had installed it herself.

Here’s the photo of the house at 1112 King Rd with the security camera that I believe picked up the footage of BK circling 1122 King Rd, the whimpers and the thud:

A Moscow police officer talks to residents of a neighboring home as part of a homicide investigation at 1122 King Road on Sunday, Nov. 13, 2022, in Moscow. (Geoff Crimmins)

Source: Moscow Police: 4 dead at home near University of Idaho campus; investigation continues

Here are the product details of a Light Bulb Security Camera available on Amazon:

Lightbulb camera supports multiple users to watch videos. You can share the device with your family and friends through the app for synchronized viewing. Outdoor security cameras storage supports cloud storage (paid access is required to use cloud storage to watch playback) If you don't want to buy cloud storage, you can also use up to 128G micro SD card to store playback videos. Light bulb camera wifi outdoor is Alexa compatible, easy to install and simple to operate.

BBM

 

[ilovewings]

The problem with categories like that is people tend to not fit neatly into boxes. It's why they've moved away from organised/disorganised, because most people show both. For example, planning to the nth degree, but leaving behind the sheath with his DNA - a mistake so basic that some people are convinced it's evidence of a conspiracy.

People are chaotic and contain multitudes. They also can act in ways that seem like they smack of self delusion or self sabotage when acting before, during and after a crime. It doesn't mean they're actually delusional, incapable, or 'trying to get caught'. They're just human, behaving in the ways that humans do, overestimating their own abilities and luck and underestimating how predictable their actions are and how competent those hunting them are.

As for 'types', you can read any of them into this crime and this perpetrator. Visionary probably the least, unless you're including in that the desire for power and glory through his killings, which is definitely a possibility. He was very much a student of violence and violent offenders. He could have wanted to join them in notoriety, and seen his path to that in a visionary light.

MOO

I agree with what you say-- but think about the frenzy he had to be in to butcher four people in a few minutes-- I really don't like to think about it too much but I will for a few seconds- he had to be in an emotionally frenzied rage- slashing and slashing at four people - stabbing them to death in a few minutes! If you think about that emotional rage-filled frenzy, it isn't so surprising he left the sheath behind- by obvious mistake. I really don't like to analyze criminals- I know lots of people do- I don't care much about what motivates a killer- there are so many reasons that you point out--- I don't like stories about serial killers--no mystery there to me---whatever motivates them- I don't care. they are evil.

 

[iamshadow21]

I agree with what you say-- but think about the frenzy he had to be in to butcher four people in a few minutes-- I really don't like to think about it too much but I will for a few seconds- he had to be in an emotionally frenzied rage- slashing and slashing at four people - stabbing them to death in a few minutes! If you think about that emotional rage-filled frenzy, it isn't so surprising he left the sheath behind- by obvious mistake. I really don't like to analyze criminals- I know lots of people do- I don't care much about what motivates a killer- there are so many reasons that you point out--- I don't like stories about serial killers--no mystery there to me---whatever motivates them- I don't care. they are evil.

Or maybe he felt nothing.

Yes, there are killers that act from rage. But there are others that have reported that they feel nothing emotionally when they kill. That committing great acts of violence was in part an experiment to see if they can feel.

If we're taking the forum posts from years ago as being written by the defendant, his emotional disconnect from humans he was closely intimate with was stark. He felt nothing about hurting them, and knew intellectually that that was wrong. So why would he feel anything murdering a stranger?

Unless he talks about it, honestly, we're never going to know why or how he felt. It's entirely possible he doesn't understand himself, just that it was the culmination of fantasy and desire to enact extreme violence going back many years. The catharsis from completing it may have resulted in the most 'normal' feeling he'd ever had.

MOO

 

[PunishThenForgive]

Here’s the photo of the house at 1112 King Rd with the security camera that I believe picked up the footage of BK circling 1122 King Rd, the whimpers and the thud:

View attachment 587056

Source: Moscow Police: 4 dead at home near University of Idaho campus; investigation continues

Based on court documents, including the PC affidavit, we know police used the video and audio recording of the light bulb camera at 1112 King Rd. If 1122 King Rd also had any security cameras, we’d likely see them referenced in court documents as well.

Say such security cameras did exist, but their evidentiary value was so great that the judge sealed any defense motions to suppress their audio or video recordings (as might occur for especially damning evidence we find out about only at trial).

Well, we know security cameras didn’t exist before September 3, based on body cam footage. If the 1122 King Rd roommates had installed the cameras after that date due, say, to fears of stalking, I think photojournalists would have photographed or filmed the security cameras for all to see, just like they did at the neighboring house at 1112 King Rd.

 

[Boxer]

Based on court documents, including the PC affidavit, we know police used the video and audio recording of the light bulb camera at 1112 King Rd. If 1122 King Rd had any security cameras, we’d likely see them referenced in court documents.

Say such security cameras did exist, but their evidentiary value was so great that the judge sealed any defense motions to suppress their audio or video recordings (as might occur for especially damning evidence we find out about only at trial).

Well, we know security cameras didn’t exist before September 2, based on body cam footage. If the 1122 King Rd roommates had installed the cameras after that date due to fears of stalking, I think photojournalists would have photographed or filmed the cameras for all to see, just like they did at the neighboring house at 1112 King Rd.

Wow. What a picture. The horrible murders - as police talk to neighbors, and this neighbor has a camera.

 

[ilovewings]

Or maybe he felt nothing.

Yes, there are killers that act from rage. But there are others that have reported that they feel nothing emotionally when they kill. That committing great acts of violence was in part an experiment to see if they can feel.

If we're taking the forum posts from years ago as being written by the defendant, his emotional disconnect from humans he was closely intimate with was stark. He felt nothing about hurting them, and knew intellectually that that was wrong. So why would he feel anything murdering a stranger?

Unless he talks about it, honestly, we're never going to know why or how he felt. It's entirely possible he doesn't understand himself, just that it was the culmination of fantasy and desire to enact extreme violence going back many years. The catharsis from completing it may have resulted in the most 'normal' feeling he'd ever had.

MOO

that's possible too!!

 

[PunishThenForgive]

Here’s the photo of the house at 1112 King Rd with the security camera that I believe picked up the footage of BK circling 1122 King Rd, the whimpers and the thud:

View attachment 587056

Source: Moscow Police: 4 dead at home near University of Idaho campus; investigation continues

Here are the product details of a Light Bulb Security Camera available on Amazon:

BBM

I guess the black light bulb camera escaped Kohberger’s notice during his night-time jaunts. If he had surveilled the neighborhood during the day, he might have spotted it.

 

[PunishThenForgive]

Or maybe he felt nothing.

Yes, there are killers that act from rage. But there are others that have reported that they feel nothing emotionally when they kill. That committing great acts of violence was in part an experiment to see if they can feel.

If we're taking the forum posts from years ago as being written by the defendant, his emotional disconnect from humans he was closely intimate with was stark. He felt nothing about hurting them, and knew intellectually that that was wrong. So why would he feel anything murdering a stranger?

Unless he talks about it, honestly, we're never going to know why or how he felt. It's entirely possible he doesn't understand himself, just that it was the culmination of fantasy and desire to enact extreme violence going back many years. The catharsis from completing it may have resulted in the most 'normal' feeling he'd ever had.

MOO

BK doesn’t seem to reveal his emotions in court, either, which doesn’t mean he has no emotions. Yet his alleged teen Tapatalk musings indicate he was indeed emotionally numb, at least at that point in his life when puberty was setting in.

It must be hell being BK. He knows there is something wrong with him—that he’s dangerous. He has likely know this since he was a teen. But instead of seeking help to escape his antisocial urges, he became obsessed with people he thought were like him. People like Ted Bundy. I haven’t seen any reporting that BK studied incel-type mass murderers, so maybe he isn’t like them after all (though he presented to me as one—until I saw the recent Dateline episode). He’s even more inexplicably evil.

IMOO

 

[iamshadow21]

BK doesn’t seem to reveal his emotions in court, either, which doesn’t mean he has no emotions. Yet his alleged teen Tapatalk musings indicate he was indeed emotionally numb, at least at that point in his life when puberty was setting in.

It must be hell being BK. He knows there is something wrong with him—that he’s dangerous. He has likely know this since he was a teen. But instead of seeking help to escape his antisocial urges, he became obsessed with people he thought were like him. People like Ted Bundy. I haven’t seen any reporting that BK studied incel-type mass murderers, so maybe he isn’t like them after all (though he presented to me as one—until I saw the recent Dateline episode). He’s even more inexplicably evil.

IMOO

Sounds like he did have an emotional reaction in the last session - when the subject turned to the surviving roommates. The shift was startling enough that people watching commented on it on the thread. He became animated all of a sudden.

I think he's going to switch on like that for certain witnesses and evidence at trial. It's going to be interesting to see exactly what creates that response.

MOO