4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #108

[Megnut]

I got the impression that they know he sat in a chair because of his bloody footprints. How else would they know?

So there could be his bloody footprints all over, possibly, because we know there is a ton of evidence still hidden behind the gag order.

The Van type shoe print by DM's door was mentioned to show it coincides with DM saying he walked past her room. They put in just enough information to get search warrants. So I am curious if the door shoe print matches the chair footprints.

2 Cents

Ohhhhh, another avenue for cleaning, distorted by the defense. If there were bloody footprints from the one assailant, he may have wiped his feet off, leaving smears and giving him almost clean shoes to exit in. Cleaned them well enough not to track visible blood but left a trail of blood protein, invisible to the naked eye.

BK may have done something instinctive right at DM's door, without even realizing it, which might account for one footprint and for not seeing DM -- he pivoted toward the kitchen. Putting extra pressure on his step... and turning away from DM's door. If she caught him exactly at that moment, she might have seen the tail end of that pivot, which is why she can't be sure if she saw one brybrow or two but felt like he looked at her, when in fact, he would already have been looking where he was going, toward the kitchen. She would have been shrouded in his periphery.

MOO he pressed down hard and left a tread pattern, from a shoe he didn't wipe completely clean.

Not unlike his DNA, on a sheath he didn't wipe clean.

JMO

 

[Kudzuu]

Ohhhhh, another avenue for cleaning, distorted by the defense. If there were bloody footprints from the one assailant, he may have wiped his feet off, leaving smears and giving him almost clean shoes to exit in. Cleaned them well enough not to track visible blood but left a trail of blood protein, invisible to the naked eye.

BK may have done something instinctive right at DM's door, without even realizing it, which might account for one footprint and for not seeing DM -- he pivoted toward the kitchen. Putting extra pressure on his step... and turning away from DM's door. If she caught him exactly at that moment, she might have seen the tail end of that pivot, which is why she can't be sure if she saw one brybrow or two but felt like he looked at her, when in fact, he would already have been looking where he was going, toward the kitchen. She would have been shrouded in his periphery.

MOO he pressed down hard and left a tread pattern, from a shoe he didn't wipe completely clean.

Not unlike his DNA, on a sheath he didn't wipe clean.

JMO

Yes! That clears the mystery of why he didn't see her . He was laser focused on leaving and didn't expect anyone else to be on that floor.

Poor DM!

 

[Kudzuu]

Literally a split second possibly.

 

[Megnut]

Yes! That clears the mystery of why he didn't see her . He was laser focused on leaving and didn't expect anyone else to be on that floor.

Poor DM!

Lucky to be alive.

Had he not been caught, I don't think he was returning to Pullman. I wonder who his next victim would have been. A survivor? Another college blonde? Was there an actual girl who rejected him so he was going to make examples of the rest, Bundyesque?

Thankfully, he'll never have the freedom to re-offend. And he'll be contained where the libraries have no windows.

JMO

 

[seasideForest]

A surviving witness said a hoodie is missing?

@danablue1 @Megnut

No. There has been some talk on the thread of a "garment" missing, then this garment seems to turn into a towel used for BK's alleged cleaning. I'm suggesting the allegedly missing item might actually be a piece of clothing, which is what a garment is, and I gave a shirt or a hoodie as examples. Obviously I should have given "shirt or sweater" as examples.

There has been some speculation on the thread that one of the surviving roommates might have known a towel was missing. I'm suggesting if the alleged missing item is in fact a "garment" aka a piece of clothing it's more likely BF or DM would know that's missing than a possibly generic towel.

Tho as @Megnut points out a few posts beyond mine with garment speculation, BF or DM couldn't have known something was missing because the house was locked down immediately.

Sorry for all the confusion.

All just MOO

 

[Cool Cats]

Ohhhhh, another avenue for cleaning, distorted by the defense. If there were bloody footprints from the one assailant, he may have wiped his feet off, leaving smears and giving him almost clean shoes to exit in. Cleaned them well enough not to track visible blood but left a trail of blood protein, invisible to the naked eye.

BK may have done something instinctive right at DM's door, without even realizing it, which might account for one footprint and for not seeing DM -- he pivoted toward the kitchen. Putting extra pressure on his step... and turning away from DM's door. If she caught him exactly at that moment, she might have seen the tail end of that pivot, which is why she can't be sure if she saw one brybrow or two but felt like he looked at her, when in fact, he would already have been looking where he was going, toward the kitchen. She would have been shrouded in his periphery.

MOO he pressed down hard and left a tread pattern, from a shoe he didn't wipe completely clean.

Not unlike his DNA, on a sheath he didn't wipe clean.

JMO

Only 2 options:

1.) He didn't see her
2.) He saw her but chose not to stop his exit from the house

From what you say - DM doesn't know - only "feels" like he saw her.

I can't make up my mind which scenario is most likely. Maybe DM will make it clearer in court before the defense starts emphasizing her statements of being drunk and fuzzy and not sure.

The new judge has decided that it will be a jury matter, that the jury can decide if DM's bushy eyebrow description fits Kohberger or not. He said she was very consistent in her multiple statements to LE and thus, he will not throw out her bushy eyebrow descriptions.

Defense wanted the term bushy eyebrows to be thrown out which is ludicrous because the witness has the right to give her testimony as she remembers that night.

Note the defense is not asking for DM's other descriptions to be thrown out such as height, weight, build and being male. I think she referred to him specifically as being a white male.

This bushy eyebrow thing really seems to have made the defense nervous. Why? I believe it is because it is too descriptive, personal and specific toward their client.


2 Cents

 

[Megnut]

Honest question:

As part of the investigation, did LE escort anyone into the crime scene (after the victims were removed) in order to determine whether anything was missing?

Survivors. Family members.

I can see where that would be fraught with new issues so I'm thinking it was decided against...

Maybe they showed very selective photos -- is this how the bathroom looked? Is this how the nightstand looked?

If BK first attacked XK around 4:12, and 4:17 might mark the end of his attack, that leaves a lot of time in that room. With dead or dying victims.

Besides apparently sitting down (perhaps for sexual gratification), I wonder whether he did things that were also just weird. But which LE might not even recognize as changed or missing

FWIW, as a parent, I would feel a need to see the crime scene for myself.

As a victim, I'd be okay never seeing that house or its insides ever again.

Random thought, as it just came to me. Perhaps photos were taking in the 2 o'clock hour while they were all piled in MM's room, giving a good before snapshot for comparison.

JMO

 

[Teche]

Hey, congrats to our new "Websleuths Guardians" @MassGuy @Megnut @tlyca

What is the WS Guardian designation? These individuals are top-notch posters.

 

[Boxer]

A surviving witness said a hoodie is missing?

I bet he wished he could take a "souvenir" but he had to get rid of any evidence.

2 Cents

MOO that ia why I believe the evidence is hidden not tossed in the river.

The river though close to the road near the stores he went to is still exposed to traffic and someone walking to the edge of the river over rocks would be probably not be noticed, but definitely could be noticed- as in a homeless guy sitting around unseen or a passenger in a car seeing someone heave pack or similar into the current etc.
A deserted riverside pullout could work but I think the phone gps and cell tower locations they pulled would show that stop.
He seems to be a planner of sorts, so hiding place prepared well in advance could be holding all the evidence.
I hope they had have had dogs walk every inch of road and turnouts between Stadium Way in Pullman and Conestoga and Palouse Dr.
The location of the Elantra is unknown and not in a trajectory that can be explained by the travel time between these points.
The gap is between leaving Pullman entering Moscow and being cam captured on Indian Hills Rd. and the delay of the exit route ping near Blaine.

 

[SteveP]

Honest question:

As part of the investigation, did LE escort anyone into the crime scene (after the victims were removed) in order to determine whether anything was missing?

Survivors. Family members.

I can see where that would be fraught with new issues so I'm thinking it was decided against...

Maybe they showed very selective photos -- is this how the bathroom looked? Is this how the nightstand looked?

If BK first attacked XK around 4:12, and 4:17 might mark the end of his attack, that leaves a lot of time in that room. With dead or dying victims.

Besides apparently sitting down (perhaps for sexual gratification), I wonder whether he did things that were also just weird. But which LE might not even recognize as changed or missing

FWIW, as a parent, I would feel a need to see the crime scene for myself.

As a victim, I'd be okay never seeing that house or its insides ever again.

Random thought, as it just came to me. Perhaps photos were taking in the 2 o'clock hour while they were all piled in MM's room, giving a good before snapshot for comparison.

JMO

I honestly do not believe that BK sat in the chair, as part of some sexual gratification fulfillment. Aside from the likelihood that he would have risked leaving DNA behind, which he certainly did not want to do, I do not believe he would have taken the time to strip off his coveralls, and whatever else, while theoretically still wearing gloves, only to have to pull up at least some again after finishing, before leaving the house to make a speedy getaway. If he sat in the chair at all, I believe it was only to catch his breath for a quick moment, as he was probably physically spent. Any gratification he wanted/needed could have come when he was back in the safety of his own apartment, as he almost certainly took a shower as soon as he got home. JMO

 

[al66pine]

Carving on EC. Like Victim in BK's Sister's Movie?

"Carve" is such a loaded word. If it's true, that is so intentional. It's not cutting, slashing, slicing. Carving. It rather implies a victim who isn't thrashing... it's measured.

And I just can't shake the move his sister was in. With carving, featured in every single murder.

What are the odds of that? That there'd be a suspect in a murder where a victim had carved injuries on top of a fatal one who happened to have a connection to a movie with the same. Does it prove he's guilty? No. Does it mean that's where he got the idea? No. But it's a curious parallel, especially when considered in light of the other parallels. Sleeping campers, re-appearing items....

I don't want to put more emphasis on a D movie than it warrants but it is one that makes me go hmmmmmm.

JMO

@Megnut Thx for your post.
Carve, yes, such a loaded word.

Two Days Back (2011) 3.9 | Horror, Mystery (at imbd.com) has 4 or 5 still photos re "Two Days Back."
Pix #2 shows a young male victim in unbuttoned shirt w initials(?) carved on his chest.
Has anyone who has seen the movie noted other carving images in it?
If so, time stamps pls and thank you. I have not watched it

I wonder if the rumored?/alleged? carving on EC bears any similarity to ^.

_________________________________________
ICYMI, Pic #5 shows BK's sister in red dress in middle of nine actors. Striking family resemblance. imo

 

[Ghostwheel]

800th listen, the THUD is a bum-bum-bum. I still don't know WHAT it is, but to me, it's three sounds, in rapid succession.

JMO

Finally got to hear the recording. I think I heard 4 distinct sounds, but I could be wrong. Sounded just like dropping an inanimate sack of potatoes on a wood floor to me, so in my mind, collapsing body on its side on a wood floor . Going down knee, hip, shoulder, head. Or someone dropped a sack of potatoes, or tripped over something.

 

[Boxer]

Bryan Kohberger update: map shows new movements revealed on night of murder

Kohberger, 29, has been charged with four counts of first-degree murder and one count of felony burglary.

www.newsweek.com

2:44 a.m., Kohberger was seen on surveillance footage from Washington State University southeast Nevada Street.

3.26am, it is on the 700 block of Indian Hills Drive.

42 minutes for an 18 to 20 minute drive.

The 20 minute route that takes him to Indian Hills south of the Pullman-Moscow Highway by Busby happens to touch the NNE point Sy Ray's "alibi" circle.

 

[SteveP]

Finally got to hear the recording. I think I heard 4 distinct sounds, but I could be wrong. Sounded just like dropping an inanimate sack of potatoes on a wood floor to me, so in my mind, collapsing body on wood floor on its side. Going down knee, hip, shoulder, head. Or someone dropped a sack of potatoes, or tripped over something.

I wonder if The FBI were able to enhance that audio beyond the quality of what we have heard. Try as I may, I cannot make out sounds that I could begin to distinguish as voices or a whimper. I agree with a thought from @Megnut, I believe it was, that perhaps the cadence was similar to the barking of the dog, although certainly not as clear as the barking after the thud, which I still think sounds like something hitting the floor, perhaps a piece of furniture, bed? chair? being shoved against the wall as someone fell against it and hit the floor. My ears are getting old, but my headphones are studio quality. Can anyone here really distinguish voices or a whimper?? JMO

 

[Ghostwheel]

I wonder if The FBI were able to enhance that audio beyond the quality of what we have heard. Try as I may, I cannot make out sounds that I could begin to describe as voices or a whimper. I agree with a thought from @Megnut, I believe it was, that perhaps the cadence was similar to the barking of the dog, although certainly not as clear as the barking after the thud, which I still think sounds like something hitting the floor, perhaps a piece of furniture, bed? chair? being shoved against the wall as someone fell against it and hit the floor. My ears are getting old, but my headphones are studio quality. Can anyone here really distinguish voices or a whimper?? JMO

I can hear something that is not white noise, but it does not sound like voices or a whimper in the recording I heard. It's just definitively different than nothing. I'll bet it was enhanced by LE and has some more specific sounds. But having fallen on wooden floors and dropped bags of potatoes on wooden floors, that falling sound was the sound of something with more than a single landing point on a wood type floor without a concrete foundation. IM klutzyO

 

[Boxer]

I can hear something that is not white noise, but it does not sound like voices or a whimper in the recording I heard. It's just definitively different than nothing. I'll bet it was enhanced by LE and has some more specific sounds. But having fallen on wooden floors and dropped bags of potatoes on wooden floors, that falling sound was the sound of something with more than a single landing point on a wood type floor without a concrete foundation. IM klutzyO

Agree. Pretty fuzzy for me though.

Wish that dog could talk, MOO he or she was certainly conveying it was as bad a thing as it had ever heard.

 

[stormymama]

800th listen, the THUD is a bum-bum-bum. I still don't know WHAT it is, but to me, it's three sounds, in rapid succession.

JMO

I also hear the bum-bum-bum. That sound is nothing like what I expected the infamous thud to sound like.

 

[Megnut]

Carving on EC. Like Victim in BK's Sister's Movie?

@Megnut Thx for your post.
Carve, yes, such a loaded word.

Two Days Back (2011) 3.9 | Horror, Mystery (at imbd.com) has 4 or 5 still photos re "Two Days Back."
Pix #2 shows a young male victim in unbuttoned shirt w initials(?) carved on his chest.
Has anyone who has seen the movie noted other carving images in it?
If so, time stamps pls and thank you. I have not watched it

I wonder if the rumored?/alleged? carving on EC bears any similarity to ^.

_________________________________________
ICYMI, Pic #5 shows BK's sister in red dress in middle of nine actors. Striking family resemblance. imo

The carving is explained toward the end of the movie, iirc every victim had the same carving. SPOILER (naming the person who violated his mother, resulting in the murderer's conception).

FWIW only males were murdered.

JMO

 

[stormymama]

Yes, carved is a loaded word. Why not say slash or cut or stabbed as is normally described in this case?
Carved could mean a shape of some sort. Or carved is simply the word used to describe cut marks.

I don't know but carved with KG 's dad saying the perpetrator punched his daughter in the face (probably mad she was in MM's bed) makes it even worse.

2 Cents

When I think of “carved” I think of the Black Dahlia.

 

[SteveP]

I also hear the bum-bum-bum. That sound is nothing like what I expected the infamous thud to sound like.

It certainly sounds like 3 parts to it, I just cannot figure out if they are all part of the same thing. I definitely believe that one of them is Xana hitting the floor. Ethan was supposedly found IN bed, so I do not think he was a contributor to the thud, as I believe he was probably completely passed out when attacked. Could Xana have grabbed for the chair and pulled it over onto the floor as she fell? Whatever caused the thud noises had some weight. JMO