4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #108

[PunishThenForgive]

DBM

 

[PunishThenForgive]

Again, who cares because it doesn't establish guilt or innocence.. ONLY MAY matter to the death penalty part or more likely to sentencing. Premature for sure.

The car accident is mentioned as a mitigating factor, so it would be used in the penalty phase.

IMO

 

[Megnut]

AT's scorched earth, depths of hell search for mitigating factors reveals little by way if mitigation and a coffee table analysis of What The Hell Went Wrong With This Kid/Man/Mankid. How did this happen? Dropped on his head, bullied, bullying, too much heroin, not even protein, too much time alone, too much coddling, not enough sleep, too much weirdness.

Interesting conversation but hardly a case for no DP.

BK had every opportunity to turn out better.

He chose this.

JMO

 

[Boxer]

AT's scorched earth, depths of hell search for mitigating factors reveals little by way if mitigation and a coffee table analysis of What The Hell Went Wrong With This Kid/Man/Mankid. How did this happen? Dropped on his head, bullied, bullying, too much heroin, not even protein, too much time alone, too much coddling, not enough sleep, too much weirdness.

Interesting conversation but hardly a case for no DP.

BK had every opportunity to turn out better.

He chose this.

JMO

MOO Smoking dope and living at the parents Zooming to college, manosphere marketing. All his clothes are name brand like Under Armor.
The failure driving up his need to "equalize."

 

[Sweeper2000]

the only thing i can see that would come close to being an explanation but obviously and completely not a justification or something that warrants leniency is his MH which yeh does seem to have taken a dive. When he writes about everything turning bad and then struggling after but I genuinely dont believe it was in any way the cause of his actions. not a leg to stand on.

 

[SteveP]

Have you ever woken with a crick in your neck that stayed stiff more than a couple hours, so you went online to some medical symptoms website that shall remain nameless, and after researching 'stiff neck' for a few minutes, you became convinced that you had contracted some rare dread disease, and your head was about to fall off? Okay, silly, I know, but you see what I am getting at. That is exactly what I see when I read that BK had yadda yadda when he was a kid, or he had undiagnosed this, or mis-diagnosed that, or he can't do this because of something that happened 25 years ago, or couldn't have done THAT, because of any number of reasons. I think AT long ago entered the realm of Ripley's Believe it or Not scenarios, to explain why her client could not have killed 4 innocent college students, and she thinks if she tells us enough times and ways, we may begin to believe it. Uhhh, no. JMO

 

[PunishThenForgive]

AT is spending so much time looking for “reasons” to exonerate Bryan’s actions, all while claiming he didn’t kill anyone. (So why is she searching for past trauma if he is just a good boy)?

He isn’t on trial for being on the spectrum, he is on trial for a quadruple murder, yet she persists in finding “reasons” that she will try to turn into “excuses.”

Not cheering for anyone to be in a car accident, of course, but if he was traumatized somehow in an accident, that is still not an excuse to mass murder some young people.

People have survived the Holocaust without afterward murdering innocent people.

People have survived living in abusive homes with dangerous parents, and from what we have learned about his family so far, they seem to have been very supportive. Even as an adult, with dad ferrying him home cross-country.

We here have all become familiar with cases in which the evidence is undeniable.

Just in recent cases—-Murdaugh at the dog cages, Libby recording Richard Allen on the bridge, and Bryan Kohberger’s DNA on the knife sheath.

These criminals have been caught red-handed. There is proof that they didn’t intend to leave behind, but which puts a bulls-eye on them.

Cannot wait for the trial to start. Nor for the judge to lay down the hammer.



JMO

Unfortunately, AT (whom I despise defending because I’m terrified she’s going to somehow get BK off) doesn’t have a choice. The penalty phase immediately follows the guilt phase of the trial. That, of course, sets up the tricky issue of searching for mitigating factors for someone you claim is factually innocent.

Look, I think something is wrong with the brains of criminals, and whatever this is may not be their fault. But it doesn’t matter who or what is at fault. Violent people are dangerous and we law-abiding people must be protected from them.

Also, society won’t work if we don’t hold adults accountable for their behavior, whatever caused it. Isn’t that the definition of being an adult?

IMO justice demands that people who commit heinous acts like the Idaho murders must be punished severely, not only to allay the understandable thirst for vengeance of the loved ones left behind, but to create a possible path for redemption of the perpetrator (if an ounce of humanity remains in him) and forgiveness for the family (even Steve Goncalves said he and his wife would forgive BK after he is justly punished: ‘We will forgive him’.)

The key, IMO, is to do all we can to prevent a child from developing into a violent adult in the first place. Because after that, most are lost causes IMO.

 

[Sweeper2000]

kay thats touched a nerve. didn't know they said they would forgive him. wow powerful and moving.

 

[Ghostwheel]

Unfortunately, AT (whom I despise defending because I’m terrified she’s going to somehow get BK off) doesn’t have a choice. The penalty phase immediately follows the guilt phase of the trial. That, of course, sets up the tricky issue of searching for mitigating factors for someone you claim is factually innocent.

RSBM

Jumping off this, there is something wrong with a system where there isn't a break between the guilt phase and penalty phase, IMO. How do you defend a person as factually innocent while trying to mitigate why he might be guilty? Isn't that a conflict? Wouldn't it make more sense to try the evidence, then IF found guilty, find mitigating circumstances why not the death penalty?

I, personally, would be rather upset if I were a juror and I kept hearing "The evidence shows his DNA on the sheath, but here is his sob story so take that into consideration while you deliberate actual evidence." or "Yes a car exactly like his containing his phone was in the area 23 times, plus again the morning after the murders, but her is another sob story to take into consideration while you deliberate actual evidence." I do not like overt manipulation. But I do acknowledge I function more on logic than emotion, so there is that.

 

[PunishThenForgive]

Jumping off this, there is something wrong with a system where there isn't a break between the guilt phase and penalty phase, IMO. How do you defend a person as factually innocent while trying to mitigate why he might be guilty? Isn't that a conflict? Wouldn't it make more sense to try the evidence, then IF found guilty, find mitigating circumstances why not the death penalty?

I, personally, would be rather upset if I were a juror and I kept hearing "The evidence shows his DNA on the sheath, but here is his sob story so take that into consideration while you deliberate actual evidence." or "Yes a car exactly like his containing his phone was in the area 23 times, plus again the morning after the murders, but her is another sob story to take into consideration while you deliberate actual evidence." I do not like overt manipulation. But I do acknowledge I function more on logic than emotion, so there is that.

I imagine that’s precisely why the jury doesn’t hear the mitigating factors until after the guilt phase (of course, a juror may have heard about mitigating factors before the trial begins—like we are hearing about them now ).

I agree with you, though, that ideally there would be a period of time between the guilt and penalty phase. The current system delays trials ridiculously and is a waste of money if the defendant isn’t even found guilty.

IMOO

 

[Ghostwheel]

I imagine that’s precisely why the jury doesn’t hear the mitigating factors until after the guilt phase (of course, a juror may have heard about mitigating factors before the trial begins—like we are hearing about them now ).

I agree with you, though, that ideally there would be a period of time between the guilt and penalty phase. The current system delays trials ridiculously and is a waste of money if the defendant isn’t even found guilty.

IMOO

Correct me if I am wrong, but wasn't there some mention of referring to ADHD to let jurors know why BK acts "differently"? Or was that conjecture or a request that was denied. I get lost sometimes.

 

[Megnut]

Correct me if I am wrong, but wasn't there some mention of referring to ADHD to let jurors know why BK acts "differently"? Or was that conjecture or a request that was denied. I get lost sometimes.

ASD, but yes, AT wanted to bump it out ahead of the penalty phase and into the guilt phase opening statement, iirc.

Don't think he's weird just because he acts weird.

JMO

 

[Ghostwheel]

ASD, but yes, AT wanted to bump it out ahead of the penalty phase and into the guilt phase opening statement, iirc.

Don't think he's weird just because he acts weird.

JMO

I knew it was some set of letters, but the combo escaped me. Thank you! It's that whole work thing that gets in my way.....

 

[PunishThenForgive]

Just wondering, will we ever hear the results of the investigation into the source(s) of these leaks in this case, or will they just be dealt with by the court without us ever knowing, assuming they do not involve any key members of the state's team or the defense's, and I cannot imagine that they would? I suppose if charges are filed against anyone, it would be public record, and could be found in a search, if someone knew when and where to be searching? Any thoughts as to how long that investigation might take? IIRC, Judge Hippler wanted the names of anyone with access to information leaked to Dateline within two weeks of his May 15 ruling, so the court has likely had the information for about two weeks now. Will that investigation necessarily have to be concluded before we move on to trial?

Good luck with that!

At the end of the video linked above and posted yesterday, the reporter at KTVB (“Boise’s Leading Local News”) stated:

One of the two surviving roommates has been subpoenaed by a judge to attend a hearing. The roommate who we will only identify as BF now lives in the state of Nevada. She was sent that subpoena last month requiring her to attend that hearing. It’s unclear what specifically that hearing entails or what exactly it will be, but we will report back when that information become available.

I could find nothing to corroborate this frustratingly ambiguous assertion, and figured he was reporting on something that actually happened (with much controversy) over two years ago.

With that possibility in mind, I double-checked that the video was not recycled content from two years ago by noting the date the video was created (June 10, 2025) and its content, the bulk of which discussed the State’s recent objection to AT’s motion to continue. KTVB even shared an image of the court doc, which after zooming in, I could confirm is the State’s objection filed on June 5, 2025.

Having recently allayed my fears about the 17 Washington cases that the rumor-mill claimed were evidence that Kohberger was suing someone—by finding the actual cases myself—I thought I would try again with the KTVB claim. How hard could it be?

Well, it is VERY hard to find a case if you don’t know which court the case resides in. After an hour of trying to figure out how to search for a case in Nevada, then in Washoe County (where BF apparently lived in April 2023), I ended up having to provide my name and email, AND invent yet another dang password , to create an account so I could search BF’s name on a single court’s website. The court I chose gave no results, so I gave up.

I figured it wouldn’t really be a big deal, anyway, if BF did recently receive a subpoena since she does (I’m assuming) live out of state and will have to testify at trial for the prosecution.

My point here is that trying to figure out who is being prosecuted for leaks by searching for court cases will be extremely difficult, at least for lay people like us. We don’t know the leakers’ names or where they live, and there could be quite a few people involved (none of whom are central players of the State, IMO).

All IMOO, of course.

 

[SteveP]

ASD, but yes, AT wanted to bump it out ahead of the penalty phase and into the guilt phase opening statement, iirc.

Don't think he's weird just because he acts weird.

JMO

And, IIRC, Judge Hippler ruled that she could only mention it in the guilt phase IF BK testifies, and well, you know, he can't, because, well, he can't.

 

[PunishThenForgive]

Jumping off this, there is something wrong with a system where there isn't a break between the guilt phase and penalty phase, IMO. How do you defend a person as factually innocent while trying to mitigate why he might be guilty? Isn't that a conflict? Wouldn't it make more sense to try the evidence, then IF found guilty, find mitigating circumstances why not the death penalty?

I, personally, would be rather upset if I were a juror and I kept hearing "The evidence shows his DNA on the sheath, but here is his sob story so take that into consideration while you deliberate actual evidence." or "Yes a car exactly like his containing his phone was in the area 23 times, plus again the morning after the murders, but her is another sob story to take into consideration while you deliberate actual evidence." I do not like overt manipulation. But I do acknowledge I function more on logic than emotion, so there is that.

ASD, but yes, AT wanted to bump it out ahead of the penalty phase and into the guilt phase opening statement, iirc.

Don't think he's weird just because he acts weird.

JMO

Yeah, presumably AT would not have been able to explain during the guilt phase of the trial why Kohberger having ASD might “cause” him to commit the crime.

I agree that if Hippler had allowed it, AT would have been limited to stating during her opening that ASD explains BK’s behavior and demeanor during trial—his low affect, his tendency to stare intensely and to engage in sundry other stereotypical behaviors that AT pulled out of her ear IMO, all while BK is standing trial for committing heinous acts and facing possible execution.

But I see where you’re coming from, @Ghostwheel. IANAL, so there may be leeway during the guilt phase of a trial for defense attorneys to appeal to juror’s emotions. The prosecution certainly does this, after all. How could they not with this type of crime?

IMO

 

[twall]

Good luck with that!

At the end of the video linked above and posted yesterday, the reporter at KTVB (“Boise’s Leading Local News”) stated:



I could find nothing to corroborate this frustratingly ambiguous assertion, and figured he was reporting on something that actually happened (with much controversy) over two years ago.

With that possibility in mind, I double-checked that the video was not recycled content from two years ago by noting the date the video was created (June 10, 2025) and its content, the bulk of which discussed the State’s recent objection to AT’s motion to continue. KTVB even shared an image of the court doc, which after zooming in, I could confirm is the State’s objection filed on June 5, 2025.

Having recently allayed my fears about the 17 Washington cases that the rumor-mill claimed were evidence that Kohberger was suing someone—by finding the actual cases myself—I thought I would try again with the KTVB claim. How hard could it be?

Well, it is VERY hard to find a case if you don’t know which court the case resides in. After an hour of trying to figure out how to search for a case in Nevada, then in Washoe County (where BF apparently lived in April 2023), I ended up having to provide my name and email, AND invent yet another dang password , to create an account so I could search BF’s name on a single court’s website. The court I chose gave no results, so I gave up.

I figured it wouldn’t really be a big deal, anyway, if BF did recently receive a subpoena since she does (I’m assuming) live out of state and will have to testify at trial for the prosecution.

My point here is that trying to figure out who is being prosecuted for leaks by searching for court cases will be extremely difficult, at least for lay people like us. We don’t know the leakers’ names or where they live, and there could be quite a few people involved (none of whom are central players of the State, IMO).

All IMOO, of course.

I found it and didn't have to give any info.

https://www.washoecourts.com/Query/PersonSearch

 

[vls12345]

"New details of Bryan Kohberger's addiction battle and dark past revealed in Idaho murder filings.​

View attachment 594317

Bryan Kohberger's secret past trauma and teenage addiction battle
are are expected to fall under the spotlight at his capital murder trial,
as his defense fights to save him from the firing squad.

Among them are details of past 'trauma',
including records about a childhood car accident Kohberger was involved in.

The details of this accident - including when and where it occurred - remain a mystery.

It is also unclear if Kohberger suffered any injuries in the accident.

But, the filing states
that the incident is documented in the defense's reports from mental health experts
and that the accused killer's family members can testify about the apparent trauma he endured.

As well as the car crash which was listed under 'trauma history',
Kohberger's past drug abuse is also mentioned -
with prosecutors revealing family members and mental health professionals can speak to this evidence."

New details of Bryan Kohberger's addiction battle and dark past

As a teenager, Bryan Kohberger struggled with heroin addiction and was once arrested for stealing and selling his sister's iPhone.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[stormymama]

Have you ever woken with a crick in your neck that stayed stiff more than a couple hours, so you went online to some medical symptoms website that shall remain nameless, and after researching 'stiff neck' for a few minutes, you became convinced that you had contracted some rare dread disease, and your head was about to fall off? Okay, silly, I know, but you see what I am getting at. That is exactly what I see when I read that BK had yadda yadda when he was a kid, or he had undiagnosed this, or mis-diagnosed that, …

RSBM
This is exactly the reason I’ve never put much stock in his supposedly having visual snow syndrome.

 

[PunishThenForgive]

I found it and didn't have to give any info.

https://www.washoecourts.com/Query/PersonSearch

THANK YOU! So the KTVB reporter was correct!

Two cases are listed for BF, the closed one from April 2023 and the more recent one mentioned by KTVB:


<modsnip - screenshots containing name of surviving victim removed>

The only difference between the two (besides the dates and status): the prior case type is Material Witness-Criminal, and the present case type is Other Civil Matters.

By the way, here is the page where I registered so I could search (unsuccessfully) for BF’s case.



I see now that “justice courts” are lower-level courts in Nevada (and maybe everywhere).

In Washington, the subpoenas were filed in superior court, but I knew based on my research that subpoenas would likely be filed in district court in Nevada. So who knows how I ended up on a lower-court’s page (although I didn’t know that justice courts are a thing yesterday—I thought it was just the name of the Nevada court website, lol).