Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #204

[MiniMoo]

That would be one hell of a coincidence if the studies she cited had been performed on that specific model gun. There are countless gun manufacturers who have further countless models of guns. I'd be surprised if she didn't use research involving an Sig firearm, as it is a very common brand. What the attorney is asking for her is likely impossible, as it does not exist.

What matters is that this research has been conducted on firearms that have the same type of parts, made of the same types of materials, that operate the same way.

If the type of gun model Allen had is common I feel that that particular type should have been tested.

It's kind of like saying Pepsi is similar to Coke and yet there are some people that would drink Coke over Pepsi or Pepsi over Coke because the difference comes down to the taste of it even though both a brown, sweet and full of gas.

I'm wondering if guns would be different in some ways when it comes to manufacturing and make despite all being guns.

That is just me.

Of course, I don't know a lot when it comes to weapons like guns.

JMO MOO JMT

 

[MassGuy]

If the type of gun model Allen had is common I feel that that particular type should have been tested.

It's kind of like saying Pepsi is similar to Coke and yet there are some people that would drink Coke over Pepsi or Pepsi over Coke because the difference comes down to the taste of it even though both a brown, sweet and full of gas.

I'm wondering if guns would be different in some ways when it comes to manufacturing and make despite all being guns.

That is just me.

Of course, I don't know a lot when it comes to weapons like guns.

JMO MOO JMT

These are studies that were likely done years ago. The analyst couldn't just create a study.

 

[MassGuy]

If the type of gun model Allen had is common I feel that that particular type should have been tested.

It's kind of like saying Pepsi is similar to Coke and yet there are some people that would drink Coke over Pepsi or Pepsi over Coke because the difference comes down to the taste of it even though both a brown, sweet and full of gas.

I'm wondering if guns would be different in some ways when it comes to manufacturing and make despite all being guns.

That is just me.

Of course, I don't know a lot when it comes to weapons like guns.

JMO MOO JMT

This right here is potentially a much bigger issue, although this guy is not a firearms expert.

https://fox59.com/news/legal-expert-doubts-states-bullet-evidence-against-richard-allen/

 

[girlhasnoname]

Day 12 in #Justice4Abby&Libby​

 

[Simply Southern]

Delphi murder suspect's stepfather spotted snoring in court

Defense attorneys in the Delphi murder trial are attempting to dismiss key evidence against suspect Richard Allen, which places him at the murder scene.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Richard Allen's stepfather struggled to keep his eyes open and was heard snoring in court while defense lawyers endeavored to discredit the state's evidence.

 

[girlhasnoname]

She's not used to seeing Rozzi's style of cross since most of the murder trials she presides over are gang bangers. JMO

Rozzi's style of cross comes across as bullying with a dash of I'm the smartest lawyer in the room to me.

He's been the one to be most aggressive and confrontational in cross, while Baldwin on the other hand, tries to pull off the "I'm just a good ole' boy, your friend" routine. Classic Good Cop, Bad Cop behavior IMO.

MOO

 

[girlhasnoname]

Trying to catch up this early morning. How old was the witness who saw the young boyish puffy haired guy? I have noticed lately that the older I get the younger everyone else is and someone around 40 looks very young to me. Just a simple thought from a newly awaken brain.

The witness was BB and I can't recall if her age has been mentioned or not. I know the other adult witness SC was in her late twenties when she passed RA walking on Old County road N300.

MOO

 

[girlhasnoname]

She's not used to seeing Rozzi's style of cross since most of the murder trials she presides over are gang bangers. JMO

To be fair, most of the types of trials Rozzi defends are drunk drivers, divorce cases, B&E's, assault and drug related crimes. We did a lookup of these many threads ago. Maybe @FrostedGlass still has the info.?

MOO

 

[Bergmann]

I’d like to see the same brand of ammo loaded and ejected from say five or more sig sauers of the same model including RA’s, the ammo collected and then so called ballistics experts under blind test conditions pick out RA’s ammo consistently from a statistical point of view.

This would to my mind establish some sound basis for attributing the bullet to RA’s gun.

I’m guessing that the states testing probably obviates this as it has now left identifying marks. This is a shame imo.

JMO

 

[girlhasnoname]

Agree !!..
Give the jurors something to think about over the weekend.

Isn't Court still in session on Saturday (today) or has that changed?

MOO

 

[joe jones]

My biggest issue with the cartridge testimony is she did not compare like with like, if the gun used to make the marks on found cartridge is RA gun then it should have made the marks on the test cartridges the same as the found one when she racked it and ejected it, the fact it never did is a big issue, and I can easily accept the argument it was not RA gun that made those markings, especially when it is a vital piece of evidence
I'm certainly not convinced it is valid scientifically to test a cartridge that racked and ejected to a fired round,

 

[joe jones]

Rozzi's style of cross comes across as bullying with a dash of I'm the smartest lawyer in the room to me.

He's been the one to be most aggressive and confrontational in cross, while Baldwin on the other hand, tries to pull off the "I'm just a good ole' boy, your friend" routine. Classic Good Cop, Bad Cop behavior IMO.

MOO

I don't think it is ever classed as bullying when it is his job to impeach a witness, I would hope he is aggressive and confrontational,

 

[MiniMoo]

My biggest issue with the cartridge testimony is she did not compare like with like, if the gun used to make the marks on found cartridge is RA gun then it should have made the marks on the test cartridges the same as the found one when she racked it and ejected it, the fact it never did is a big issue, and I can easily accept the argument it was not RA gun that made those markings, especially when it is a vital piece of evidence
I'm certainly not convinced it is valid scientifically to test a cartridge that racked and ejected to a fired round,

This gun and bullet testing I'm trying to understand better, but it isn't as clear as I'd Iike and some things I wonder about.

JMO MOO JMT

 

[joe jones]

Pm ok

This right here is potentially a much bigger issue, although this guy is not a firearms expert.

https://fox59.com/news/legal-expert-doubts-states-bullet-evidence-against-richard-allen/

that's a very good article about the whole days testimony for one cartridge, I didn't know she rewrote the protocols so her conclusions could fit the evidence, otherwise she couldn't have testified to the fired cartridge matched the unfired cartridge which calls into question the validity of her testing even more

 

[Vaderman]

Isn't Court still in session on Saturday (today) or has that changed?

MOO

Finishing up the latest "Murder Sheet" episode and it's stated that coming up next (today/Saturday) is the state's DNA witness.

 

[joe jones]

Finishing up the latest "Murder Sheet" episode and it's stated that coming up next (today/Saturday) is the state's DNA witness.

I wonder what DNA will be testified about, maybe they have the results from the hair

 

[INfisherman]

Possibly not so bad…..food for thought:

Maybe the confused or tired looking jury isn’t such a bad thing - maybe the D came across as over analytical? The key point might just be that they heard her testimony has never lost a case (paraphrased) and that sticks out. Jury might have been thinking "why can’t this guy just let it go"? Several instances of this & some might be likely to dismiss that person’s approach/questioning. The jury are humans & not perfect.

A reach yes, but possible. I know what it’s like to sit in a room in a meeting & that one person just keeps asking more & more questions.

Remember, she didn’t cave to the pressure applied during cross examination. Sounded quite confident rather than responding as if she wasn’t sure. That also makes an impression. Besides, is the attorney asking the questions the expert or the witness?

JMO

ETA last paragraph.

 

[INfisherman]

I wonder what DNA will be testified about, maybe they have the results from the hair

Unless prior testimony was misleading or an attempt at a surprise of sorts, that’s the only thing I can presume it might be.

 

[statt#1]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed due to non approved source>
I never considered the idea that RA may have left that bullet at the CS intentionally. That's an interesting notion for sure. I have some speculation on this, but would love to hear yours, as to why would he do that?

 

[INfisherman]

that's a very good article about the whole days testimony for one cartridge, I didn't know she rewrote the protocols so her conclusions could fit the evidence, otherwise she couldn't have testified to the fired cartridge matched the unfired cartridge which calls into question the validity of her testing even more

Yet again an attorney questioning an expert and her supervisor with no reason for creating a conspiracy. Outside testing agency. The line of people involved in these conspiracy theories just keeps getting longer in this case (to me).

She explained in detail why she had to fire the gun. She couldn’t get it to make the marks to come to a valid conclusion. The gun had been sitting for 5 years but not necessarily idle (not being fired). Use of the gun will result in wear of the internal components ejecting round after round after round. So logic would be the marks are going to become more difficult to observe. Also note they were examining these marks under a microscope, it’s not like the bullet found at the scene had marks visible by eye.

She admitted to this when she said "work smarter not harder".

JMO