CANADA Canada - Jack, 4 & Lilly Sullivan, 6, Vulnerable, wandered from home 10am, Gairloch Rd, Landsdowne Station, Pictou County, NS, 2 May 2025 #7

[MistyWaters]

To which court document(s) are you referring?

The documents that the media obtained through Freedom of Information legislation. All court documents are available to the public and these supported 13 subpoenas requested by the RCMP. The contents were widely published by various media in August, 2025.

Police court documents provide detail on Nova Scotia missing children case

Newly released court documents are revealing previously unreported details of the investigation into the disappearance of two young children from their home in rural northeastern Nova Scotia more than three months ago.

www.guelphtoday.com

 

[su5ie]

The RCMP can absolutely NOT lie in legal documents that are presented to the Court for the Judge’s approval. Please understand how serious that would be if LE lied knowingly lied to Judges in order to obtain search warrants or subpoenas, it’s not a matter up for debate. In that statement to the Court as at July 16th they did not believe the case was criminal in nature says everything they investigated prior to July 16th was neither suspicious nor incriminating. That’s the reason I wrote IMO it could come back to haunt them

Only after that date might their investigation have turned a corner into criminal. That’s why there’s absolutely no harm in them stating that fact, if that’s the reality. But protecting the integrity of the investigation is not at risk by announcing what is the type of investigation is currently in progress. Maybe it would even encourage more tips.

I do agree the RCMP has been far too silent if they believed Jack and Lilly were still alive.
JMO

Yes if they are stating there is no evidence to suggest the kids are dead .what is the alternative way of saying that ? All evidence leads us to believe the kids might be alive as we haven't found any evidence to suggest they are dead ??

Seems like a lot of what is released can have double meaning , are they being deliberately cryptic? Are they sending a coded message to a possible perp .

To me the statements could come from someone where English is not their first language as the words are there but they seem mumbo jumbo , like someone is trying to get their point across but their verbiage and placement is mixed up .

Be interesting to see the reaction to this latest article and search

From interviews on YouTube with people close to the investigation, seemingly they have organised private searches too and have turned up nothing either .

The thread I previously posted regarding missing people eventually found in previously searched areas does shed a light on searches not being as precisely carried out as we would like to believe.

I still wonder has gold / tan sedan lady come forward with an explanation and cleared herself and the two kids from the investigation.

Will that be the last we hear now from the RCMP on the investigation until such time remains are found or something leads to their whereabouts? Obviously that could take years .

I also wonder if family will hire private investigators and private search teams like Dylan Es dad has

 

[FromGermany1]

Newest thoughts (and maybe completely wrong):
What, if the parents had a meeting at the mall, where they had been seen to be shopping. This meeting wasn't video taped by surveillance cameras, because someone knew, where exactly cameras aren't placed (public toilet?). The children were for a reason given to someone unknown (to us/LE), rather NOT family, and Lilly and Jack didn't get home in the evening. Afaik, nobody has confirmed, that the children returned to their mobile home with their parents.

The following night the children didn't sleep in their clothing, they were wearing all day, and Lilly didn't sleep with her backpack. They weren't at home at all and also weren't in their beds. They were already absent, forever.

Afaik, we heard nothing from the evening and nothing from the night. Oh wonder, there was nothing to tell by DM. We only heard a story from the morning, which must be fictitious. It didn't happen. Why DM's mother allegedly heard children in the morning at a certain time, I don't know. Did she lie? Did DM, very sophisticated, play a voice recorder with children's chatter and his mother didn't recognize it, because she didn't come outside? On the other hand, repairing a fence (DM) and shoveling somewhere for a swimming pool (his mother) seems odd, when just then the 2 children "disappear" - looks like an alibi for both of them ("I wouldn't have done it, if I had known; so I am innocent.").

How it went from there on, we all know.

I can think of a CPS person, who knew people or a pair, who unofficially wanted 2 children. The CPS person persuaded MB to give her children away, promising, that MB in some form can keep in touch with her children. It was known, that MB was overwhelmed with her duties and wanted to get away from DM, therefore she agreed. DM didn't mind getting rid of the tiresome children (and didn't know, that MB would run away afterwards). So both agreed, then created their story of the disappeared siblings, beginning their lies with Lilly and Jack being annoying in the morning, when the parents wanted to stay in bed. Both adults MB and DM now have to stay with their story and aren't able and willing, to throw the other partner under the bus (despite separation!!).

Yes, the woman with the golden car, waiting at the open backdoor of her car, and the 2 children walking along a road in the direction of the car, doesn't fit my theory at all. IF the children were indeed Lilly and Jack, then they came from home, and my newest story is invalid ......

All MOO and speculation!

 

[Slebby]

I believe LE is very good at choosing their words, and not saying more than they need to, whether publicly or in official documents. Saying they have no reason to believe the case is criminal is not a conclusion that it is not criminal. If it was, they would have stopped investigating all avenues and major crimes would not be involved. It really is, imo, a statement that they have not unearthed evidence, as yet, of criminality. For all we know, they could be one forensic test away from breaking this case.
IMHO

 

[su5ie]

Newest thoughts (and maybe completely wrong):
What, if the parents had a meeting at the mall, where they had been seen to be shopping. This meeting wasn't video taped by surveillance cameras, because someone knew, where exactly cameras aren't placed (public toilet?). The children were for a reason given to someone unknown (to us/LE), rather NOT family, and Lilly and Jack didn't get home in the evening. Afaik, nobody has confirmed, that the children returned to their mobile home with their parents.

The following night the children didn't sleep in their clothing, they were wearing all day, and Lilly didn't sleep with her backpack. They weren't at home at all and also weren't in their beds. They were already absent, forever.

Afaik, we heard nothing from the evening and nothing from the night. Oh wonder, there was nothing to tell by DM. We only heard a story from the morning, which must be fictitious. It didn't happen. Why DM's mother allegedly heard children in the morning at a certain time, I don't know. Did she lie? Did DM, very sophisticated, play a voice recorder with children's chatter and his mother didn't recognize it, because she didn't come outside? On the other hand, repairing a fence (DM) and shoveling somewhere for a swimming pool (his mother) seems odd, when just then the 2 children "disappear" - looks like an alibi for both of them ("I wouldn't have done it, if I had known; so I am innocent.").

How it went from there on, we all know.

I can think of a CPS person, who knew people or a pair, who unofficially wanted 2 children. The CPS person persuaded MB to give her children away, promising, that MB in some form can keep in touch with her children. It was known, that MB was overwhelmed with her duties and wanted to get away from DM, therefore she agreed. DM didn't mind getting rid of the tiresome children (and didn't know, that MB would run away afterwards). So both agreed, then created their story of the disappeared siblings, beginning their lies with Lilly and Jack being annoying in the morning, when the parents wanted to stay in bed. Both adults MB and DM now have to stay with their story and aren't able and willing, to throw the other partner under the bus (despite separation!!).

Yes, the woman with the golden car, waiting at the open backdoor of her car, and the 2 children walking along a road in the direction of the car, doesn't fit my theory at all. IF the children were indeed Lilly and Jack, then they came from home, and my newest story is invalid ......

All MOO and speculation!

The point you make here about the possibility of an unofficial or off the record cps person or persons arranging an off the books type adoption is a thought thst crossed my mind .

There has been Whispers / rumours of this type of scenario happening in my country regarding missing teens and kids who were once under cps care being carted off secretly to other countries for a new start / better life . I don't know if they are just conspiracy or malice so don't quote me ,it's just something I heard from a relative whom through work would come into contact with menial workers in these child protection facilities.

From my perspective I couldn't see this happening but its a big wide world and corruption is part of it

 

[OneLove]

DBM.

 

[MistyWaters]

I don’t believe anyone in this thread is insinuating they’ve lied in legal documentation. Lied to the public? Sure. Selectively put their theories in court documents even though they have a different theory so that when requested by the press, the court documents only reflect certain items? Absolutely

“Selectively put their theories in court documents even though they have a different theory so that when requested by the press, the court documents only reflect certain items? Absolutely”

That doesn’t satisfy the definition of lying? Then what, a mistruth? Same thing. The RCMP had the liberty of redacting any information they believed would jeopardize their ongoing investigation if a concern was over the documents being requested by the press.

 

[TMich6811]

“Selectively put their theories in court documents even though they have a different theory so that when requested by the press, the court documents only reflect certain items? Absolutely”

That doesn’t satisfy the definition of lying? Then what, a mistruth? Same thing. The RCMP had the liberty of redacting any information they believed would jeopardize their ongoing investigation if the concern was about the documents being requested by the press.

Um, no.
Putting items that satisfy court orders/warrants/whatever and leaving out information not directly related is not lying.

Yes they could redact but why put any information in that position if it wasn’t required?

 

[LadyL]

I was reviewing some of the info that came out from the released court documents (around Aug 22 iirc)
It got me thinking about the wrench on the door. Apparently DM would place a wrench atop the front door (ie not the sliding glass door) because there has been a bear hanging around.

I live rurally in AB, it would not surprise me to have a black bear thru my yard, I’ve already seen one, scared the liver out of me! We had a mama and her 2 cubs hanging around 2 years ago, caught on our neighbors security cams. On both these occasions, I spent the next couple weeks escorting my dog outside, making a ton of noise, with my trusty bear spray in hand, until I felt sure they’d moved on and were hibernating.

What I know is that bears don’t come to the door. So I question if the wrench above the door was intended for bear detection, or to detect another threat, say, human?

Second, if a bear was hanging around, it surprises me they had garbage outside. Indeed, my garbage is in my garage at the moment, and afaik, I don’t have a bear hanging around. If I couldn’t keep garbage inside, like when I back country camp, I would string it up in a way that bears couldn’t get into it, couldn’t get habituated to dining on my trash, until the trash can be carted away.

Third, if a bear was hanging around, it surprises me the house is not locked down in a way small children could not open a door and get outside. If the sliding door was not lockable I would have a heavy barrier in front of that door, especially given that it is the door leading to their play area.

It’s puzzling to me. It makes me wonder again if there was actually a fear of humans, not bears. Humans use doors, not bears. In fairness to MBM, she might not have been aware of any threats faced by DM and she may have believed a bear had been hanging around. We know of DM’s own admitted drug use, which it seems he kept hidden from MBM for a time (Globe and Mail Aug 8) so its not a stretch to believe he might have kept a threat hidden as well. I am pretty naive to the ways of the criminal drug world, but I do believe it is possible DM could have had interactions with unsavory types, or potentially owed money he could not repay.

Unless cadaver dogs discover something, it looks less likely to me that the children went into the woods. The adults in the home passed polygraphs. One remaining possibility is foul play. A good question LE would ask is, do you have any enemies?

IMHO

I understood the wrench to be more of an alarm (making noise when it fell) for them if the kids tried to open the door (therefore keeping them safe from bears outside).

 

[MistyWaters]

Um, no.
Putting items that satisfy court orders/warrants/whatever and leaving out information not directly related is not lying.

Yes they could redact but why put any information in that position if it wasn’t required?

Why would investigators not believe the case was criminal in nature as at July 16th if that wasn’t the complete truth? What information was left out? It seems to be a clear and complete statement that doesn’t require additional interpretation.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/extensive-rcmp-scrutiny-of-missing-children-s-mother-stepfather-suggests-no-criminal-involvement-1.7615551

“The redacted records, which were released at the request of CBC News, the Globe and Mail and the Canadian Press, include 12 record-access orders filed by RCMP and reveal that as of July 16 investigators did not believe the case was criminal in nature.”

 

[Absoluterubbish]

I was reviewing some of the info that came out from the released court documents (around Aug 22 iirc)
It got me thinking about the wrench on the door. Apparently DM would place a wrench atop the front door (ie not the sliding glass door) because there has been a bear hanging around.

I live rurally in AB, it would not surprise me to have a black bear thru my yard, I’ve already seen one, scared the liver out of me! We had a mama and her 2 cubs hanging around 2 years ago, caught on our neighbors security cams. On both these occasions, I spent the next couple weeks escorting my dog outside, making a ton of noise, with my trusty bear spray in hand, until I felt sure they’d moved on and were hibernating.

What I know is that bears don’t come to the door. So I question if the wrench above the door was intended for bear detection, or to detect another threat, say, human?

Second, if a bear was hanging around, it surprises me they had garbage outside. Indeed, my garbage is in my garage at the moment, and afaik, I don’t have a bear hanging around. If I couldn’t keep garbage inside, like when I back country camp, I would string it up in a way that bears couldn’t get into it, couldn’t get habituated to dining on my trash, until the trash can be carted away.

Third, if a bear was hanging around, it surprises me the house is not locked down in a way small children could not open a door and get outside. If the sliding door was not lockable I would have a heavy barrier in front of that door, especially given that it is the door leading to their play area.

It’s puzzling to me. It makes me wonder again if there was actually a fear of humans, not bears. Humans use doors, not bears. In fairness to MBM, she might not have been aware of any threats faced by DM and she may have believed a bear had been hanging around. We know of DM’s own admitted drug use, which it seems he kept hidden from MBM for a time (Globe and Mail Aug 8) so its not a stretch to believe he might have kept a threat hidden as well. I am pretty naive to the ways of the criminal drug world, but I do believe it is possible DM could have had interactions with unsavory types, or potentially owed money he could not repay.

Unless cadaver dogs discover something, it looks less likely to me that the children went into the woods. The adults in the home passed polygraphs. One remaining possibility is foul play. A good question LE would ask is, do you have any enemies?

IMHO

Interestingly in his latest interview when asked about the door, there was no mention of the wrench.

He said he knew with 100% certainty they didn't exit the front door as when he first ran out looking for them he tried to come back in the front door to get car keys and it was locked so he had to come back in the sliding door.

 

[Slebby]

I understood the wrench to be more of an alarm (making noise when it fell) for them if the kids tried to open the door (therefore keeping them safe from bears outside).

Yikes, I hope it wasn’t for the kids. Imagine a wrench coming down on a little skull???

 

[LadyL]

Yikes, I hope it wasn’t for the kids. Imagine a wrench coming down on a little skull???

yeah it's strange and hard to make sense of

 

[MistyWaters]

Does anyone recall the source of the “wrench”? It just so happens there’s a door hinge adjusting tool that apparently aligns the door hinges if it doesn’t close properly. The tool is called a “hinge wrench” says Amazon.ca.

I’m having difficulty imagining how a wrench could be balanced above a closed door. Only way I can think of is if the casing above the door was far thicker than the average 5/8”, and why not just install a good deadbolt?

 

[TMich6811]

Why would investigators not believe the case was criminal in nature as at July 16th if that wasn’t the complete truth? What information was left out? It seems to be a clear and complete statement that doesn’t require additional interpretation.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/extensive-rcmp-scrutiny-of-missing-children-s-mother-stepfather-suggests-no-criminal-involvement-1.7615551

“The redacted records, which were released at the request of CBC News, the Globe and Mail and the Canadian Press, include 12 record-access orders filed by RCMP and reveal that as of July 16 investigators did not believe the case was criminal in nature.”

Okay.

 

[OneLove]

I understood the wrench to be more of an alarm (making noise when it fell) for them if the kids tried to open the door (therefore keeping them safe from bears outside).

As a former social worker dealing with endangered children, my first thought about that wrench was that it would likely kill or maim for life a young child if it fell from that height on their heads. We would very quickly be looking for other signs of such lapses concerning the children's welfare and also cues for what might be causing those lapses.

 

[LadyL]

As a former social worker dealing with endangered children, my first thought about that wrench was that it would likely kill or maim for life a young child if it fell from that height on their heads. We would very quickly be looking for other signs of such lapses concerning the children's welfare and also cues for what might be causing those lapses.

yeah I'm just trying to figure out its purpose

 

[OneLove]

yeah I'm just trying to figure out its purpose

Yeah, there's several different possibilities.

There's a known subset of folks who keep cash money they do not want documented traces to, so no bank accounts, etc. Such folks tend to be a bit paranoid about break ins because they know similar people for similar or same reasons would know they keep cash on the premises. Same with "goods" worth cash or combination of both. In certain regions, it's not uncommon to see pit bulls guarding auch homes and vehicles.

Some ppl are just very paranoid from drug and/or alcohol induced brain changes.

Some ppl do not feel secure with whatever locks/security they have on their doors and windows. This is not uncommon in more poverty ridden places where break in crimes tend to be higher.

For whatever reason, DM had reason to believe he needed more security than his door lock offered. Maybe he just couldn't afford to do better. Maybe he just couldn't pull himself together enough to do better. Either way, it endangered the children.

Very unlikely it was bears he was concerned about. If so, there would have been more sign of bear mitigation efforts around the home and property and more efforts to never have the children out alone with predator bears. Even IF bears might have been a danger to the children, clearly the children's safety was not a high concern.

 

[Colleen Donnelly]

If this case has become a criminal investigation OR has been all along, there is MUCH harm stating so, especially publicly. There is no better way to clamp down investigative leads in a case than doing that.

100% this. And I believe that that is what's happening now.

The end goal is solving the case. The end justifies the means where no harm is done other than bringing guilty parties to justice. Thats why law enforcement is granted leeway to mislead the public.

They can 100% mislead the public on cases like this. And hey, whatever it takes to find out what happened to these babes.