NY - UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Midtown. #11 *Arrest*

[Friday Fan]

DBM....

 

[ChatteringBirds]

So true. Mystifies me.When he could be safe and warm celebrating Christmas with his loving family. Now sleeping on a slab in MDC. MOO.

I don't think he was planning to visit family for the holidays, because he had not been in touch with them. IMO he had been mentally unraveling (not insane, but unhealthy and irrational) when he planned this murder, didn't think through every detail, and particularly dropped the ball with his getaway.

But I think he thought he'd possibly get away with it (most murderers do), at least for much longer than he did, and he couldn't really imagine incarceration, or maybe "didn't care."

An example of mental and emotional isolation leading to extreme and tragic choices.

 

[citygirl]

I’m curious if LE has deeper info about whether he had threatened the victim?
His ex-wife did mention that, allegedly.

 

[BrianJohnson]

I’m curious if LE has deeper info about whether he had threatened the victim?
His ex-wife did mention that, allegedly.

Unlikely as he was never a UHC customer, if I remember rightly the threats were bomb threats too whereas LM shot him, doubt the threats were from him, but strange how he seemingly refused bodyguards in NYC

 

[citygirl]

Unlikely as he was never a UHC customer, if I remember rightly the threats were bomb threats too whereas LM shot him, doubt the threats were from him, but strange how he seemingly refused bodyguards in NYC

I hadn’t heard all that. Just remember the wife being quoted about threats he mentioned.

 

[al66pine]

Threats. BT's Ex-Wife?

I’m curious if LE has deeper info about whether he had threatened the victim?
His ex-wife did mention that, allegedly.

@citygirl Thx for your post.
I'm also curious about any earlier threats LM may have made against BT.

I've read on MSM (IIRC, so no ref's or links) that BT & wife (described as mother to his 2 sons, & who is phys. therapist) -
- were "estranged"
- had lived "separately" for four years.

Have NOT run across source stating BT & ^ wife were DIVORCED and nothing re an earlier marriage which would cause MSM to use "ex-wife" term.

@citygirl A LINK pls? Anyone else? TIA

 

[BrianJohnson]

Threats. BT's Ex-Wife?

@citygirl Thx for your post.
I'm also curious about any earlier threats LM may have made against BT.

I've read on MSM (IIRC, so no ref's or links) that BT & wife (described as mother to his 2 sons, & who is phys. therapist) -
- were "estranged"
- had lived "separately" for four years.

Have NOT run across source stating BT & ^ wife were DIVORCED and nothing re an earlier marriage which would cause MSM to use "ex-wife" term.

@citygirl A LINK pls? Anyone else? TIA

I am not convinced there were threats, if there were then his ex wife would be demanding extra security as they had shared custody of the children, presumably she had them in the week and him at weekends

 

[MassGuy]

There are many many many that are arguing his guilt. It's everywhere. Personally, I believe he is the shooter.
We haven't seen what his lawyer is or isn't going to argue yet.
Yah, before she was retained when she had the same early outsider information that we had, she mentioned a mental health related defense... Time has passed, complaint docs have been filed and she will be way more privvy now to the case at its centre than we are, she will also get discovery where I'm sure she will find more to work with as a defense attorney. It is HER JOB now to argue for what's in the best interests of her client and to do that to the best of her ability, guided by how he wishes to plead.

As I see it anyway <3

That's the issue, what he wants to do.

I know you're not saying he's innocent, but anyone arguing against his guilt is the type of person I'd lose all respect for. If you cant' figure this one out, then your brain ain't right.

I'm convinced she has a single goal; to mitigate any punishment and get her client out of prison before he's an old man. She can't win, because that just doesn't happen with these facts. A victory to her is seeing a 60 year old Luigi Mangione a free man.

I could live with that, but I don't think she has any chance.

This was all for nothing with a mental health defense, so she needs to get him on board with that. God knows if he'll do that.

 

[al66pine]

Wife or Ex-Wife?

I am not convinced there were threats, if there were then his ex wife would be demanding extra security as they had shared custody of the children, presumably she had them in the week and him at weekends

@BrianJohnson
The point of my ^ post above was not about whether there were/were not any threats made to BT. It was about MARITAL STATUS.
Sorry for any confusion so I'll rephrase a bit.

I've missed any MSM stating they were divorced so posted to ask @citygirl or anyone for a link re DIVORCE.

IF BT & & woman (described as mother to his 2 sons, & who is phys. therapist) -
- were "estranged"
- had lived "separately" for four years.
then at time of his death, she was STILL his WIFE not EX-wife.

ETA: What is the source verifying that they were divorced?
I have not seen it but entirely possible that I've missed it.

 

[LinasK]

It's been used for hundreds of years, the matching clothes. I believe it was the defense lawyer who made it happen as she will have many times in the past, as will many other lawyers. It's not a new psychological tactic, but it's a good one... I mean look at how we're all talking about it and even those that aren't talking about it, subconsciously (and whether they like it or not) their brain will have processed it as a unity.

I fail to see how it helps. His lawyer believes in him. So what? It's what defense attorneys are paid to do.

 

[BrianJohnson]

Wife or Ex-Wife?

@BrianJohnson
The point of my ^ post above was not about whether there were/were not any threats made to BT. It was about MARITAL STATUS.
Sorry for any confusion so I'll rephrase a bit.

I've missed any MSM stating they were divorced so posted to ask @citygirl or anyone for a link re DIVORCE.

IF BT & & woman (described as mother to his 2 sons, & who is phys. therapist) -
- were "estranged"
- had lived "separately" for four years.
then at time of his death, she was STILL his WIFE not EX-wife.

ETA: What is the source verifying that they were divorced?
I have not seen it but entirely possible that I've missed it.

Far as I am aware, I may be wrong, they were legally married, but living apart for some time, and had joint custody of the children

I have no idea as to her job but am guessing with his, and the demands of it, he had them at weekends

 

[LinasK]

Another question, will he be tried for state and federal at the same time or will there be 2 different trials with 2 different juries?

Oh, oh, pick me! I know the answer to this one- two different trials with two different juries- at least that's how it worked in CA with David DePape.

 

[MassGuy]

Oh, oh, pick me! I know the answer to this one- two different trials with two different juries- at least that's how it worked in CA with David DePape.

Yup. My prediction is the gets a second degree murder conviction in New York, and a Federal first degree murder sentence of life.

 

[LinasK]

Yes, there's a difference. Nullification involves being found not guilty, he can't be tried again. Hung jury = mistrial, he can be. Not sure how many jurors it takes to nullify, ie be found not guilty. I'd think it must be the same standard, ie number, required for guilty but I don't know.

Reisch, in that video I posted, used the example of juries just saying no to felony marijuana charges. The juries basically said they didn't agree with the law. Per Reisch. Not sure if they have to put the reason for nullification in writing or if it's self evident.

I think an acquittal if that's what the term "jury nullification" means requires a unanimous verdict- all 12, otherwise it's a hung jury and can be retried.

 

[MassGuy]

Yes, there's a difference. Nullification involves being found not guilty, he can't be tried again. Hung jury = mistrial, he can be. Not sure how many jurors it takes to nullify, ie be found not guilty. I'd think it must be the same standard, ie number, required for guilty but I don't know.

Reisch, in that video I posted, used the example of juries just saying no to felony marijuana charges. The juries basically said they didn't agree with the law. Per Reisch. Not sure if they have to put the reason for nullification in writing or if it's self evident.

I can’t stand that guy. Fortunately, I always have a post for him whenever he opines.

Scott Reisch is the same guy who concluded after the prelim in the Berreth case, that the prosecution had made a deal with the wrong person, and that things went well for the defendant. It was like he was following a completely different case.

I laughed hard at that, and I laughed harder when Frazee was convicted in record time. Scott is a no talent *advertiser censored* clown.

 

[LinasK]

Polls show LM has strong support in the public, especially the younger folks, so I suppose a jury pool will resonate that support. Of course, the attorneys will do their best to weed it out during voir dire.

But, like you, I'm not sure why pulling from a larger demographic would make a difference.

My understanding is from political leanings, how law-and-order different areas are. The issue has come up with some of the Election Interference defendants trying to get state cases moved to federal courts for that reason.

 

[citygirl]

Threats. BT's Ex-Wife?

@citygirl Thx for your post.
I'm also curious about any earlier threats LM may have made against BT.

I've read on MSM (IIRC, so no ref's or links) that BT & wife (described as mother to his 2 sons, & who is phys. therapist) -
- were "estranged"
- had lived "separately" for four years.

Have NOT run across source stating BT & ^ wife were DIVORCED and nothing re an earlier marriage which would cause MSM to use "ex-wife" term.

@citygirl A LINK pls? Anyone else? TIA

Thanks for the correction. Hate to get facts wrong.

 

[citygirl]

I am not convinced there were threats, if there were then his ex wife would be demanding extra security as they had shared custody of the children, presumably she had them in the week and him at weekends

Maybe they do? We just don’t know.
Both families have been quiet.
Smart move, IMO.

 

[Arkay]

Well I think we all here know that's how it works tbh, my point I was trying to make is that their single pieces of evidence and corroborating evidence doesn't seem enough in a way, even stacked. Like I personally believe that it's LM and him alone. I believe that he wanted to be found and he wanted to be found with exactly what he had on him, but there's a lot that can be argued and reasonable doubt brought in imo. The surveillance footage they have shown, it's all very hmmm and you've got every tom dick and harry saying that it's not the same person in the released footage and I can't think how they can possibly prove BRD that it was visually from CCTV. The DNA, I'm yet to see anything concrete from LE/Feds regarding it, but as far as I'm aware it's DNA on the kind bar wrapper and water bottle found NEARBY to the crime scene, some have said it was on top of the bin near the Starbucks, so again every tom dick and harry is saying is it a crime to have a snack and bin your rubbish? The fingerprints, again not much concrete that we have seen from the officials, but what's been said is that there are partial on the rubbish... nothing about the shell casings that I've seen (unless anyone has an official source) We have the 'letter to the feds' found on him, yah very condemning I think, though, nowhere in the letter does it detail the crime or the victim, it simply expresses a huge chew on and could be argued that it's not an admittance of guilt of the crime of murder. The notebooks, I think these are the best bits of evidence the prosecution has, they name UHC and the conference but not the victim (that we know of yet). The fake ID, weapon and silencer, the fake ID is the same one used in the hostel they say, ok seems sus but that's ties into the CCTV mentioned above. The gun and silencer are naughty, like why would a lad be in a McDonald's with a gun he made on a printer? I hate to say this but it's America and almost every tom dick and harry has a firearm... Like I said they will have all kinds of ballistics run and they may very well match the spent rounds to the gun found with him, it's how the courts and jury take it as many believe certain types of ballistics is "junk science"... Now add on that there's no view of the shooters face on CCTV committing the crime ... Now to remember that the juries will be filled with your everyday tom dick and harry. I'm just not 100% sure that they have enough beyond a reasonable doubt. Ofc they will have kept a bunch back, they always do so I'll say, they wanna hope they have a slam dunk bit of irrefutable evidence in their back pockets as I don't think they're going to have as easy of a time as some people on here think they are with this one.

Again, I think the shooter is LM

MOO

I ask, with complete respect for your views, why you surmise that LM is indeed the killer when you believe you see all the evidence could be contradicted?

I’d have to disagree with some of your theories.

Female Tom, Dick, Harry here——most of us New Yorkers do not have guns. Here it is primarily the criminal element who carry guns illegally.

Not a crime to throw away your snack in the garbage, but that was major evidence since LE has it recorded on camera. They know which bottle and wrappers were his and therefore evidence of his fingerprints on them helped to sort out his identity.

Personally, I don’t think LM wanted to be found. If that were true, he could have surrendered at any police station, he wouldn’t have worn a mask for the majority of the time, and he wouldn’t have followed such a complicated and circuitous means of escape.

I put much credence into his letters and notebook. To me they both are evidence of intent, prove motive, and are a confession, although he’s defensive and not repentant about the murder.

I also don’t agree that every “Tom, Dick and Harry” thinks the videos and photos of LM are of different people, nor that the videos are “hmm.” Rather, I see the videos as “whoa!” He’s caught; the matter was in finding him and thanks to the good people of Altoona, he was.

All naturally just my opinion.

 

[al66pine]

Wife or Ex-Wife?

Thanks for the correction. Hate to get facts wrong.

@citygirl Thx for your response.

IDK that my post was a correction, as it was and still is a QUESTION:
Has any MSM outlet said they were divorced?

Haven't seen it but coulda missed it.