NY - UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Midtown. #4

[armchairagatha]

He might think he’s in the clear and think the NYPD is bs-ing to make him nervous.

I am wondering if the mayor is BSing. No official word from the NYPD or the FBI?

 

[Synergizer Bunny]

I laughed when i saw Timothee this morning too!

Yeah. My husband is a college football fanatic. He was very impressed with Timothee.

I of course was just comparing his looks to the UHC murder suspect. My husband commented that Timothee was now in disguise with the mustache!

JMO.

 

[x_files]

My feeling is the guy is Russian, looking at his pic he doesn’t look American to me

My feeling is he came into the country, possibly some time ago to kill BT and has probably left the country now or is lying low for a few days before leaving the country, he was probably not working alone

Russians have to do military service when young so that would explain his skill as a marksman when he is early 20’s at most

Having been to Moscow a few times young Russians love designer clothes out there

Plus if he was American someone would recognise him, a coworker, an ex partner, a family member, someone

My feeling is he is Russian mafia, they, and other eastern European gangs don’t use uzi’s, glock’s etc but very discreet weapons that can’t be traced

Did BT get on the wrong side of Russian’s, hmmmmm

This also crossed my mind. A son of a Russian oligarch? Did he owe money to the Russians or anger them somehow?>
Did someone at United pay to have him killed?
I wonder if BT may have indicted he'd whistleblow or start talking at his DOJ meeting?
People often start talking to save their own hide from prison time.
BT looked like a kind, man, but his job was to do the unthinkable, to deny lifesaving procedures.
I'm not sure how a good person could sleep at night knowing people could suffer and die because they implemented AI to deny claims.

 

[Deleted member 306806]

Yeah, saying we have the name is pretty much a tip to the shooter, don't cha think?

A tactic to make him get nervous and commit a mistake while keeping the public at an arm’s distance so they don’t make things harder.

MOO

I don't think this shooter would be be either tipped off or nervous. He probably assume they are on the trail and has planned accordingly.

 

[getthefax]

Unfortunately, AI isn't infallible.

Humans are fallible. AI is what we make it—it is trainable. It’s just the technology, not an omniscient presence…

I ride in driverless taxis now in my city. Took years to train the models but now they’re better at driving in crazy SF than most drivers on the road. MOO

 

[CHEL]

That's what I asked my husband when I saw the two photos from the Hostel. S/he looks female in one and male in the other. My husband says that it is definitely a male (and he is always right - according to him!) I even think that the guy at Starbucks might be different than the guy/girl at the Hostel (and so did one of the guys on CNN). Now, that I saw Timothee Chalamet on ESPN picking the college teams, I agree with those posters who says the suspect (at the Hostel) looks him. Timothee is 28 years old. So, I am guessing the suspect around the same age.

eta: Both my husband and I think the Missy Bevers' killer is female.

JMO.

When that picture got released I texted my mom that he looks like Timothee Chalamet!

 

[whitelilac]

The mayor claims that they have the name of the suspected killer

Thanks, but not stated by the NYPD or FBI? Hope this wasn't a no no on mayor's part if the FBI wants to keep that under wraps.

 

[x_files]

It's not viable. No one like that would have access to all his information. Period.

Unless he is a hacker or also works for United.

 

[Synergizer Bunny]

Thank you….I feel the same.
He looks surly in the Starbucks picture and in the other hostel pic.

I posted somewhere far back that I believed he only showed his face because otherwise he wouldn’t be allowed to stay there. He had to match the (fake) I.D.

Then he, for the second it took, pulled out a disarming smile. No proof naturally, but it seemed to me that his smile has worked for him before.

It’s to his disadvantage that the camera was inevitably going to record him, but he did his best to minimize his resemblance to any “murdery” looking guy.

Of course only my opinion.

Agree. I posted the same thing. I surmised that he wasn't really flirting. He was making a joke about having to remove his mask. He knows that he is good looking. I'm sure that he uses it to his advantage.

JMO.

 

[snarast]

Well, that's because Chanel has millions of dollars worth of stock in store.

A hotel (however exclusive it may be) doesn't.

Yes, it may have ultra-high net worth individuals staying there, but the hotel doesn't own them, nor if financially responsible for them, like a store with its stock.

Plus the hotels are probably used to these CEOs and execs sorting out their own security.

That's not to say the Hilton wouldn't have a doorman there to shoo away vagrants, etc. But I can't see it being much more than that.

I read somewhere that most if not all presidents had stayed at this particular hotel. Of course they come with their own entourage but…..maybe those in charge of this hotel could have picked up a thing or two from this process?

I think the mere sight of one or two big beefy armed guards standing at the entrance would have stopped this attack. That depends on the exact lay of the land, which I am not privy to.

There are plenty of people in need of a decent paying job, so why not?

 

[x_files]

Totally with you on this. BT was actually not the big fat cat in this scenario as CEO…he’s kind of just the face of this big machine with the actual big money guys doing their bidding behind the scenes. I think BT was being leveraged to rat out some people.

The stock sales, the ransomware attacks, the public announcement of a DoJ antitrust probe relevant to the product that suffered the attacks, all occurred within 2 weeks of each other. I don’t think there’s anything accidental about it.

This happened on the day of the investors conference. All of the above is relevant to investors and trading. Could be a foreign assassin—all of this could very well include foreign investors, look at the story of Duetsche Bank. There’s much, we the general public, don’t know. One last thing on my mind, incoming new administration has major implications for the healthcare industry.

Agreed, lots of strange coincidences.

 

[getthefax]

It’s not as bad as Diane Feinstein with the Nightstalker, but it’s less than ideal.

I continue to *facepalm*

 

[lonewanderer]

I'm not seeing lots of others, and not seeing any ambiguity in this case either, there are witnesses that shared a room with him.
The Forence murders were commited by a man, he was arrested but not convicted. He wasn't dressed as or mistaken for a woman. Lane Bryant had a surviving witness/victim and audio of the male suspect, there was no confusion about him being male.

Each of these had speculation

 

[nhmemorymaker]

He might think he’s in the clear and think the NYPD is bs-ing to make him nervous.

ha ha!! Yeah..... I might think that too!!!

 

[wibbleflea]

Very long post – sorry. Please skip if these are not your thing.

The shooter shows three distinct types of behaviour* and the more time passes, the more it seems that his apparent carelessness may have been part of his approach – that he didn't care about longer-term consequences. He cared only about getting out of NYC before being linked to the killing. Why? I don't know. But if that was his goal, he achieved it.

Behaviour 1: careful, detailed planning
Arrives 24th November, stays at a hostel knowing he can pay in cash. No deposit, fake ID, no card. Spends many days scouting and staking out the locations: familiarisation of routes, gaining use of a bike and a distinctive backpack used only on the day of the shooting. Part of this involves his checking out of the hostel and checking back in a day later, for reasons still unknown. Throughout, he is careful to hide his face from anyone who would associate him with the murder – no one at the scene of the shooting could identify him and it's likely that no one on the streets could, either. People who saw his face wouldn't associate him with the murder – linking the face with the shooting would take days of work and he'd be gone by then

Behaviour 2: showmanship
In this post, @caradana uses the word 'swagger' and that seems right. The choice of gun and clothing items (distinctive but and easy to track on surveillance footage as he moved between cameras), the plan to shoot someone in midtown Manhattan with several people nearby (including a terrified woman just a few yards away, who sees him and flees as the first shots are fired), a pre-shoot visit to Starbucks for water and energy bars. The decision to simply walk away from the murder scene and then switch to… a bicycle. He used public transport and a taxi. He chose a highly distinctive, unusual gun (possibly an expensive B&T VP9, possibly the newer and cheaper B&T Station Six) that needed clearing after every shot, the delays creating a significant risk for someone carrying out a public, multiple-shot assassination. Yes, it was a quiet gun but there are other quiet guns that with silencers that would have been quicker and less distinctive. He never once prioritised the obvious things in a street shooting: simplicity, speed, discretion. He chose memorability and spectacle. This was a performance.

The third aspect of his approach contrasts with the first.

Behaviour 3: doesn't care about the long-term investigation
He may have left a water bottle with DNA on it. He may have discarded his burner phone. I don't think we know for sure that the phone and water bottle were his but it's possible. (And I don't think the phone records will tell us anything useful: he will have used Signal or an equivalent if calling an accomplice or he'll have called his victim, which tells us nothing because we already know both their locations.) In full view of a camera, he carefully placed something on a garbage pile. In Central Park, he discarded the backpack, surely knowing that it and its contents would likely be found. He apparently discarded other items, too. He showed his face at the hostel in front of CCTV, quite possibly knowing he'd have to and that the footage wouldn't be linked to the murder till he was out of NYC. He moved about on public transit, Greyhound bus, taxi and bicycle knowing full well that the surveillance footage would take days to be linked to him. The police may find out where he got the gun, the bike, the phone and the backpack. They may already know. They may find out other things. He surely knows all this – DNA, fingerprints, items traced.

So: why? This post by @azure describes the puzzle.

Perhaps he's expecting to end his own life in his own way and not at the hands of LE. Perhaps he's safe for reasons we don't know – he lives somewhere in the world where he knows he won't be turned or is protected by the organisation he works for or with. It's even possible that the shooter's identity is significantly different from what we imagine, despite the clear face shot. DNA analysis might tell us more about that.

So it's possible (not certain, just possible) that none of the aspects of this third type of behaviour came from panic or slip-ups and that they came instead from not caring about being identified after leaving NYC. As long as got out of the city after carrying out his highly cinematic murder, he would consider the project a success.

I could be wrong – perhaps he's much less accomplished and overconfident, couldn't predict what would happen, tried his best and just messed up. Would like to hear your thoughts that explain this third type of behaviour. Unintended carelessness that he now regrets or acceptance of the investigation and what it will reveal? If the latter, why?

As I post this, recent posts suggest that Eric Adams claims LE have a name. If that's true and it turns out that it's the shooter, on American soil, perhaps that means unintentional carelessness. We'll see.

* UK spelling and punctuation throughout, I'm afraid.

 

[kaen]

Not sure why the mayor needs to weigh in like this, but he does. Saying but not saying but wants to make sure he says it first, I guess.

“We don’t want to release that now,” the mayor said when asked if police have the killer’s name. “If you do, you are basically giving a tip to the person we are seeking and we do not want to give him an upper hand at all. Let him continue to believe he can hide behind the mask. We revealed his face. We’re going to reveal who he is and we’re going to bring him to justice.”

The mayor also commended the “tri-state law enforcement partnership” for the ongoing investigation.

“And the manner in which they were able to follow his footsteps to recover evidence – some of it is known, some of it is unknown – but the net is tightening and we’re going to bring this person to justice,“ Adams said. ‘The net is tightening’ on UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson’s suspected killer, NYC Mayor Adams says

 

[armchairagatha]

This also crossed my mind. A son of a Russian oligarch? Did he owe money to the Russians or anger them somehow?>
Did someone at United pay to have him killed?
I wonder if BT may have indicted he'd whistleblow or start talking at his DOJ meeting?
People often start talking to save their own hide from prison time.
BT looked like a kind, man, but his job was to do the unthinkable, to deny lifesaving procedures.
I'm not sure how a good person could sleep at night knowing people could suffer and die because they implemented AI to deny claims.

Foreign organized crime is my guess. I posted the reasons why this fits here:

This also crossed my mind. A son of a Russian oligarch? Did he owe money to the Russians or anger them somehow?>
Did someone at United pay to have him killed?
I wonder if BT may have indicted he'd whistleblow or start talking at his DOJ meeting?
People often start talking to save their own hide from prison time.
BT looked like a kind, man, but his job was to do the unthinkable, to deny lifesaving procedures.
I'm not sure how a good person could sleep at night knowing people could suffer and die because they implemented AI to deny claims.

foreign (Russian?) organized crime is my guess. I posted why this could fit here: NY - UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Midtown. #4

 

[CityKid]

I don't know why people question BT not having a coat. He was going only half a block and a coat is a pain to keep up with. And he lives in MN so NYC might feel warm to him.

Even if he ended up walking further for whatever reason, if he got cold, he could duck into any place along his route (he's in NYC for pete's sake so probably multiple businesses per block he could step into) to get warm and as a rich white guy, he's not likely to be questioned about it. Or he could easily afford to hop in a cab (probably on UHC's tab since it's a business trip). I really can't see him needing a coat unless he was going to be outside for an extended time. If he ended up going out immediately after the conference and he might want his coat, an admin could probably run get it from his room.

I still wonder if his business phone wasn't hacked and perhaps that's how the perp knew his movements.

All MOO.

I wouldn't question him not having a coat. If I'm walking just a few blocks I don't wear a coat either. It's just extra weight and too warm if I'll be on the subway or going to a restaurant or something. I do question why a man, who according to his wife was receiving threats before this trip, was wearing a jacket that really makes him identifiable and didn't have security (even if he had to pay for it himself, after threats I'd think he'd find it worthwhile).

 

[Elley Mae]

Authorities have the name of the suspect who assassinated United Healthcare CEO Brian Thompson and are closing in, Mayor Adams said Saturday.

‘The net is tightening’ on UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson’s suspected killer, NYC Mayor Adams says

Authorities are closing in on the suspect who assassinated UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson in Manhattan, Mayor Adams said Saturday.

nypost.com

“We don’t want to release that now,” the mayor said when asked if police have the killer’s name. “If you do, you are basically giving a tip to the person we are seeking and we do not want to give him an upper hand at all. Let him continue to believe he can hide behind the mask. We revealed his face. We’re going to reveal who he is and we’re going to bring him to justice.”

 

[ElizaKate]

Being on the West Coast, and getting up late is a pain when you're following a crime on the east coast.

Rather than thoroughly reading some 25 pages to catch up (while needing to work), are there any major updates or are things still in limbo like last night?
CNN is not doing their updates anymore, neither NBC.

Identity?
Backpack contents?
New sighting or travel?
etc?

TIA

All you've missed is a lot of commentary about male vs female suspect.

And the major making a statement that they know the name of the suspect. Currently not reiterated by LE.