NY - UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Midtown.

[MassGuy]

Question because I basically know nothing about guns and their physics: can a jam happen just completely randomly, or can it be indicative of the gun being loaded improperly?

In this case, the jam was likely a result of the suppressor. They have other causes, but I think it’s irrelevant here.

 

[Jcm2293]

I don't know anything about guns either, so I have no idea. But it appears this guy could handle the jamming without getting flustered.

Have posted multiple times. He was likely using sub sonic ammunition. Significantly quieter. But also doesn’t generate enough negative pressure to clear the chamber, leavening to jams. In video, he seems to expect these jams and deal with quickly. Seems he anticipated the jams, hence likely using sub sonic ammunition

 

[clearskies1]

In this case, the jam was likely a result of the suppressor. They have other causes, but I think it’s irrelevant here.

The way the shooter reacted, seemed like he expected the jam from the suppressor.

 

[helix527]

I suspect it's a man with an axe to grind, possibly due to a health treatment that wasn't covered under his UHC plan. It could also be a hired gun working on behalf of the patient.

 

[Irish1]

The shooter looks like he could be Eastern European or Russian flown in specifically for this. I wasn’t aware of the ransomware attack but it could an interesting angle. Provides another reason to do the crime in NYC. Guaranteed to make world news if that is what the perpetrators were going for. A la 9/11.

If this was an experienced hit, they would not go to Starbucks and drop cell phone and water bottle. He panicked and it appears to be disgruntled employee or customer.

 

[MassGuy]

If this was an experienced hit, they would not go to Starbucks and drop cell phone and water bottle. He panicked and it appears to be disgruntled employee or customer.

Yeah, law enforcement has already said as much. They do not believe this guy to be any sort of professional, for multiple reasons.

 

[Columbo Was The Best]

If this was an experienced hit, they would not go to Starbucks and drop cell phone and water bottle. He panicked and it appears to be disgruntled employee or customer.

I don't think he panicked at all. I think he was simply not worried because they are not going to find his fingerprints on file.

 

[clearskies1]

If this was an experienced hit, they would not go to Starbucks and drop cell phone and water bottle. He panicked and it appears to be disgruntled employee or customer.

Yes, some parts seem well planned and some parts don't.

 

[armchairagatha]

There are only a few different things it could be (in my decreasing order of preference)
1. Terrorist attack (ransomware attack on UHC could be a contributing factor). Supporting factors: shooter looks like he could be Russian and that also explains why NYC was chosen as the spot for the killing.
2. Business dealings gone wrong: someone had a business reason grudge against Thompson and ordered the hit.
3. Domestic issues on the home front (affair on either side etc. Or other family disputes). Ordered hit.
4. Disgruntled insurer (whose family member was denied healthcare coverage) acting singly or hired a hitman. Least likely in my opinion. Disgruntled insurers don’t have the money to hire a hitman and are also unlikely to hold the CEO personally responsible unless he personally denied the claim.
5. (From another thread) mentally ill loner who wanted to take out any “suit” not specifically Thompson.

Any other possibilities?

 

[TexLil]

I am thinking someone was telling him the suspect is on the way during that phone call. imo

jmo

And what he was wearing? That blue jacket was quite visible if you were looking for it. MOO

 

[Seni]

Those who can check.. have United shares plummeted or risen in last hours?

 

[Warwick1991]

If you’re killing someone in this manner, you’re not concerned about the legality of a silencer.

When silencer/suppressor possession is illegal, it's the difficulty obtaining it, not necessarily the legality, that would be shooter's concern. They aren't usually sold in gun shops, and buyers set up trusts to own them legally. They come in different sizes and diameters for different weapons, and that could be problem for an illegal buyer.

 

[Bridger]

There is something that just doesn’t work about these scenarios so many are spinning regarding a targeted hit. This gunman came very, very close to missing his opportunity if Thompson was indeed his target, because he was buying two power bars and a water bottle. He shot Thompson five minutes after he arrived at the Hilton. He came very, very close to missing his chance entirely!

I don’t think this was targeted at all—at least toward the United Healthcare CEO. I think he was targeting either the Hilton, or the “suits” or just midtown NY in general. No way this guy is a hired hitman—hired hitmen flown in from Eastern Europe don’t appear on camera at Starbucks, drop their phone, water bottle and a candy wrapper on the street, and fire with a gun that jams repeatedly. And the silencer makes him look like he’s cosplaying.

I think this is the usual disaffected loner who wanted to use the cover of darkness to take out a suit—and he didn’t really care which one he took out. But time was getting short as he mustered up his courage—now or never. It was just luck of the draw that the person he killed was a CEO, rather than a big time lawyer, or a hedge fund manager or a business owner. This is midtown NY after all—the place is crawling with high net worth individuals. Pick a “suit”!

Somewhere in NY or NJ, I’d bet, there’s a person or two thinking—“damn! That looks like that weird kid of Mrs. Johnson’s down the street who always keeps to himself.” I bet we’ll know soon.

 

[MesquiteO21]

In this case, the jam was likely a result of the suppressor. They have other causes, but I think it’s irrelevant here.

Ah interesting thank you

 

[BUF]

Per CNN, they found an earlier video of the shooter around 5:15 am on the west side of Manhattan carrying something…possibly an e-bike battery that he was charging.

 

[MassGuy]

New:

Police have video of the suspect in uptown Manhattan prior to the shooting​

From CNN's John Miller
Police have video of the suspect early in the morning, prior to the shooting, on Manhattan’s Upper West Side carrying what appears to be a battery for an electric bike, according to law enforcement officials briefed on the investigation.

Investigators believe that the suspect may have taken a subway from the Upper West Side to Midtown. They are also looking into whether he had an electric bike pre-positioned in that area.

https://www.cnn.com/us/live-news/unitedhealthcare-brian-thompson-death-12-04-24/index.html

 

[Bounceycat]

The shooter looks like he could be Eastern European or Russian flown in specifically for this. I wasn’t aware of the ransomware attack but it could be an interesting angle. Provides another reason to do the crime in NYC. Guaranteed to make world news if that is what the perpetrators were going for. A la 9/11.

My thoughts are along the same line. And if he went straight to the airport and got on a plane to Russia, that would explain not being fastiduous about not leaving behind trash with his potential DNA on it.

 

[Snoopster]

I am not fully caught up on this thread, but I thought I'd add a few comments since I probably won't have time to read every post so far.

I worked in the investment area of a large life insurance company for decades. The company had various divisions, including a group insurance division (providing plans to companies and associations).

The group health/disability side of the business is fraught with challenges and angry client group members. There's no way around it.

First: A major one is that an employer buys a plan for their employees, The employer decides what specific plan to buy, including the level of coverage. Are they going to cover 'similar occupation' or just 'any occupation'? The latter means that the poor injured/sick employee will be kicked off insurance if they can do ANY job whatsoever. So if you had a professional engineer who suffered from major depression, once they are capable of carrying a broom at any company then they don't qualify for insurance payment anymore. The poor engineer, is aghast at what the insurance company is doing to him/her, in their depressed state, once they've recovered a bit, but the insurance company is delivering the financial product that the employer purchased. It's the employer's 'cheapness' that causes many problems. The employee blames the insurance company.

Second: (Lest you think I'm just defending the insurance company) there are certainly pressures at the insurance company to keep business profitable. (Capitalism anyone?) And that can lead to pressures on insurance company employees to get long-term, particularly-expensive payees off of their plate. The original employer tosses the sick employee over the transom to make it solely the insurance company's problem. And then the employer often doesn't want the employee back so they don't offer reasonable jobs and the employee remains unemployed.

So, many individuals (and their families) feel abandoned at a very terrible and vulnerable time in their personal lives. And some are mentally unstable. Understandably this fosters considerable anger. As a result, the people who work in disability claims usually work in unidentified and secure locations. They often get death threats. They are simply trying to work with the clients, who often are in no position to understand their employer's contract.

And all of this is beside the point that group health insurance is in fact a valuable product. It helps keep people employed and financially secured during challenging times. But for some....

Of course in this particular case it might not be related to this health insurance business, but it is definitely a business rife with angry 'clients'.

As an aside, I don't think this murder is related to the 'investor' motive. I just don't see enough of a motive there. I've never seen that in the business, when markets aren't in massive turmoil, other than for major pyramid schemes and other frauds.

 

[YouWho]

My current thoughts.

I am leaning away from professional hitman. I am not sure where that leaves me at the moment.

I do believe this was planned and not a pure impulse or random killing.

Someone previously stated this (please let me know if it was you) that well planned is different than well executed. That is a very good observation.

The reasons I am leaning away from a professional hitman:

• Going to public place (Starbucks) in the vicinity of the killing.
• Not wearing gloves. Not in Starbucks. Not in street video minutes before the killing.
• Returning to same street just a few blocks from the killing for escape.
• He seemed to be young for a professional. Of course, everyone seems young the older I get.

Other observations:

• Confident with shooting handgun but not precisely accurate.
  • Where did he obtain that experience? Gun club in NYC? (Someone likely could recognize him.) Outside NYC in a more rural area? (Plenty of areas to shoot by yourself).
• Why not wearing gloves?
  • Not in any LE database?
  • Careful enough to put coffee cup in backpack?
  • Likely prints on the casings and the live rounds left behind.
• Starbucks is north of the shooting and he escaped north.
  • Had car parked near Central Park?
  • Used subway near Central Park?
• The backpack
  • Not the usual NYC black
  • If it has not been found, did he have a slightly larger black backpack to conceal in Central Park?

Is there such thing as a reversible backpack I wonder.

 

[armchairagatha]

There is something that just doesn’t work about these scenarios so many are spinning regarding a targeted hit. This gunman came very, very close to missing his opportunity if Thompson was indeed his target, because he was buying two power bars and a water bottle. He shot Thompson five minutes after he arrived at the Hilton. He came very, very close to missing his chance entirely!

I don’t think this was targeted at all—at least toward the United Healthcare CEO. I think he was targeting either the Hilton, or the “suits” or just midtown NY in general. No way this guy is a hired hitman—hired hitmen flown in from Eastern Europe don’t appear on camera at Starbucks, drop their phone, water bottle and a candy wrapper on the street, and fire with a gun that jams repeatedly. And the silencer makes him look like he’s cosplaying.

I think this is the usual disaffected loner who wanted to use the cover of darkness to take out a suit—and he didn’t really care which one he took out. But time was getting short as he mustered up his courage—now or never. It was just luck of the draw that the person he killed was a CEO, rather than a big time lawyer, or a hedge fund manager or a business owner. This is midtown NY after all—the place is crawling with high net worth individuals. Pick a “suit”!

Somewhere in NY or NJ, I’d bet, there’s a person or two thinking—“damn! That looks like that weird kid of Mrs. Johnson’s down the street who always keeps to himself.” I bet we’ll know soon.

If this was an amateur loner, they will catch him soon enough. If he is not caught soon, we can likely rule out that possibility. But yes, for now, this is a possibility.