Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #205

[m00c0w]

If RA was using a burner phone that day on the platform would it show up in the Geofence data?

Yes, the issue would be attribution. If they successfully put all of the phones in peoples’ hands, then it becomes much less of an issue to say his phone wasn’t present. They’ve excluded all of the present phones, so if someone said their phone was there but they never found a phone linked to that person, that’s not great for the story that requires that person to have a phone.

I suspect we’ll hear facts about this later this week.

ETA: The exclusion of all phones is a hypothetical scenario, I’m not saying it happened.

JMO

 

[m00c0w]

Kept the car state says he drove. home in, states witness says he looked like he had slaughtered an animal, so his car would have loads of blood in it, he could have (if one believes states witness) cleaned up noticeable blood but DNA lingers for years, and he would have both Abby and Libby DNA in was quantity in his car, again reliant on one believing states witness,

Source that DNA “lingers for years” in someone’s uncontrolled car environment?

 

[sunshineray]

So Abby was found in Libby’s clothes. Libby was found nude. The purpose of that I guess will forever remain in the mind of a twisted murderer.

Unless he spoke of it in his confessions and incriminating statements.

 

[ClearAhead]

Yes! That is what retired senior fbi profiler Mary Ellen O'Toole mentioned in the Down the Hill documentary. She believes the offender is local and familiar with the bridge. She thinks the location was chosen first, then the victims are chosen based on opportunity. This means the offender might not know the victims.

I posted about it last night, I'll link here..

Post in thread 'Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #205'

Oct 27, 2024

Sharing now because even though we've probably all seen this, I watched again last week it was a good reminder/visual of the trails and bridge. I watched on Max, but it's on other paid platforms as well.

Down the Hill: The Delphi Murders | TV Special | 2021

Watch Down the Hill: The Delphi Murders | Max

Watch Down the Hill: The Delphi Murders on Max. Plans start at $9.99/month. In 2017, the senseless murders of Abby Williams and Libby German left Delphi, Indiana, residents shaken. Four years later, investigators are still searching for the killer.

play.max.com

For those who cannot watch, here are my main takeaways.

• "The far-side of the bridge has no trail. The woods have taken over that part of the abandoned rail line, so the kids that walk the bridge to the far-end commonly discover that the excitement ends...

• smamda

• 
• 
• 

Yes I could believe that. The location chosen, a fantasy builds, then eventually opportunity arises as he’s scouting and sees the girls. Not unlike someone who’s an avid hunter or fisherman, he’s patient. MOO

 

[Salah11]

Kept the car state says he drove. home in, states witness says he looked like he had slaughtered an animal, so his car would have loads of blood in it, he could have (if one believes states witness) cleaned up noticeable blood but DNA lingers for years, and he would have both Abby and Libby DNA in was quantity in his car, again reliant on one believing states witness,

How does anybody know he didn’t lay down plastic before he left home in the car to protect the seats?

He went prepared so he knew what he was planning imo

 

[joe jones]

Well, he is missing his 2017 phone. Maybe just a coincidence that he seems to save his most all of his old phones, iPads, etc, but that one is gone. Kind of reminds me of KK microwaving one of his phones.

From the SW he has phones missing from other years

 

[sunshineray]

From the SW he has phones missing from other years

Or he just kept certain phones longer?

 

[arielilane]

KS brought this case forward, out of storage. She is all these and more, courageous. driven. determined.
moo


Stashed in a box of tips from the public, Allen's note said he saw three girls as he walked along the Monon High Bridge Trail between 1:30 and 3:30 p.m. on February 13, 2017.


In September 2022, as volunteer receptionist Kathy Shank filed the tip in an online database, she realized the time Allen said he was on the trail matched the time the girls were thought to have gone missing, according to CNN affiliate WLFI.

Volunteer found file with information regarding Delphi double murder after case went cold

With the trial underway, more of the Delphi double murder story is beginning to come to light. Here's what we've learned about the case in the first full week of the trial.

www.wpbf.com

 

[m00c0w]

Snipped:


"Bozinovski also testified she did not find evidence that the teens were sexually assaulted. She said she tested samples taken from the girls, including vaginal swabs and fingernail scrapings, and did not find semen or other types of male DNA.

There was some male DNA from the samples taken from the girls, but she said the amount she detected was not unusual and could have been passed on from normal, day-to-day contact."


Delphi murders trial of Richard Allen calls DNA expert to the stand

Was RA excluded from this DNA? Because that’s all that really matters. If it was an insufficient amount to test, it could very well still be his…

JMO

 

[FromGermany1]

One could go through list of seized items & see.

I would imagine since he cleaned up so well at CS he would have taken off the gloves well before getting to the car. They would easily float downstream & be tough to locate. Unsure of how fast current might be there. Other possibility is gloves were shoved in jacket pocket. Once he’s out of there, fingerprints are of little consequence, it’s the blood transfer about which he’d need to worry.

JMO

ETA first sentence

He may have cut the gloves into little pieces with his boxcutter, quick done at the end of his murder session, and scattered them into the creek.

Apropos "quick - quickly": Do you all remember, that LE (DC?) said at the time, that the murderer "quickly came around"? How was it meant, when we now think of RA? No alibi, but somewhere he must have been without knowing by LE, that it was him?? Ruminating a bit ....

 

[joe jones]

How does anybody know he didn’t lay down plastic before he left home in the car to protect the seats?

He went prepared so he knew what he was planning imo

The witness said the blood was on the bottom of his jeans so it would have been falling off his clothes as he drove, if one believes the witness who testified to the amount of blood, he would have had to have vacuum sealed the interior of car to not leave DNA off both girls, even 5 years post the murder I wouldn't be at all surprised if the girls DNA was present

 

[arielilane]

I would hope they have examined all his seized devices and nothing has been testified about anything found on phones, and he has no other charges except those relating to the murders, so I don't think they found anything, they have mentioned that on a device (I'm not sure what device) that was seized somebody in that house has done searches relating to murders, don't know if what timeframe murder searches were as it's hard to find all the details from court

The Murder Sheet podcast [I believe episode five] mentioned that RA did a few searches about the Delphi double murder.

 

[BUF]

Update on WISHTV….

Delphi Murders trial: Day 9 live blog

Follow the trial of Richard Allen, accused of the Delphi murders, as it continues in the Carroll County Courthouse. Stay updated with WISH-TV's live blog.

www.wishtv.com

 

[shonyakay]

I will apologize right now as this has likely been answered many times in earlier threads but I cannot remember the answer. LE mentioned a backpack when these murders occurred. What happened to the backpack? Was it first believed the girls might have had one but actually they didn't? OR was the killer believed to be carrying a backpack? My mind is no steel trap but I distinctly remember a backpack was mentioned by LE. No, I don't believe this backpack has anything to do with the case nor the trial... but I would love additional info if anyone remembers. (It's the little things that stick with me, sometimes) TIA!

I remember this. There was an article way back and in it LE asked if anybody saw anybody throw a backpack away and that they would be interested in this.

 

[steeltowngirl]

The Murder Sheet podcast [I believe episode five] mentioned that RA did a few searches about the Delphi double murder.

If he’s innocent, he’s a slacker of a true crime watcher.
I’ve done several hundred thousand searches about the Delphi murders.

 

[Dhighsmith]

Exactly. I simply can't make a targeted attack work based on these facts. Allen came prepared to kill, but he didn't know who it was he would be killing.

He didn't meet up with them; he stumbled upon them. They saw him coming, but it was too late.

We have no idea of knowing how many times he previously visited the area lookin for opportunity. As horrific as the acts were, it didn’t require a lot logistical pre-planning- place iPhone on airplane mode or whatever action needed to hide phone location and carrying of weapons, gun and boxcutter hidden away into pocket areas.

 

[joe jones]

Source that DNA “lingers for years” in someone’s uncontrolled car environment?

https://www.sciencedirect.com/journal/forensic-science-international

 

[Yemelyan]

On cross-examination, this was testified:

According to News 8’s Kyla Russell, Auger began by asking Bozinovski to explain what technology extracts DNA from hair strands without a root. Auger and Bozinovski spoke back and forth about the tech, which the expert said is being expanded and still not in full force. “(It’s) only being used for unidentified human remains,” Bozinovski said.

Auger asked about strands of hair being held at Bozinovski’s lab that have not been tested yet, and asserted that the testing should happen now as “Richard Allen is on trial and this is potential evidence.” Auger also asked if any hair samples from Allen have been submitted. The expert said no.

Bozinovski later said the lab did not develop a DNA profile from an unknown male based on rape kits, despite mentioning they “had reason to believe from the case information that was provided that it was a male perpetrator.”

This means that Richard Allen is included in the profile.

Delphi Murders trial: Day 9 live blog

Follow the trial of Richard Allen, accused of the Delphi murders, as it continues in the Carroll County Courthouse. Stay updated with WISH-TV's live blog.

www.wishtv.com

 

[SeattleStew]

Kept the car state says he drove. home in, states witness says he looked like he had slaughtered an animal, so his car would have loads of blood in it, he could have (if one believes states witness) cleaned up noticeable blood but DNA lingers for years, and he would have both Abby and Libby DNA in was quantity in his car, again reliant on one believing states witness,

We have no idea if RA was wearing "the coat" when he entered his vehicle after killing Abby and Libby.

 

[Yemelyan]

More info plus jury questions:

Bozinovski said regarding the samples, the “majority of results can’t determine the amount of people contributing to DNA on the items.” Auger then questioned the contamination standards, referring to a black hoodie that was contaminated by a male. The expert said she had no male assistants and no one except from her touched it during her autopsy.

She said she reviewed DNA from items belonging to Richard Allen, and said she did not find any connection between Allen and the two girls. She also said there was not enough DNA on the unspent cartridge, or “magic bullet” found at the scene, to develop a DNA profile for anyone.

Following a few questions from prosecution and defense, the jury chimed in with questions about protocol was in place at the lab and how evidence is stored.

Delphi Murders trial: Day 9 live blog

Follow the trial of Richard Allen, accused of the Delphi murders, as it continues in the Carroll County Courthouse. Stay updated with WISH-TV's live blog.

www.wishtv.com