CANADA Canada - Jack, 4 & Lilly Sullivan, 6, Vulnerable, wandered from home 10am, Gairloch Rd, Landsdowne Station, Pictou County, NS, 2 May 2025 #7

[RandyMcDonald]

Yesterday I came back from a short trip to PEI. My last trip two years ago I saw that many of the trees knocked over by Fiona were still leaning over, even in cities like Charlottetown. My impression was that, two years later, between natural decay and human repair, the downed trees have been mostly removed from inhabited areas. Even in hedgerows, though, there are still plenty of broken and uprooted trees.

Northern Nova Scotia is much less developed than the "million acre farm" on the other side of the Northumberland Strait. If the children are in the forests, it would be a surprise if they were easily found.

 

[Twistinginthewind]

I wouldn’t call it lying or mistruth.

I would call it strategic

It could also be some potential evidence is discussed verbally between LE / their legal support while getting ready to alert the judge who it's being put in front of for a decision on approval, to make sure they have all their t's crossed and i's dotted, before it's all put down in court documents, e.g., a search warrant.

So it's airtight and will meet probable cause to justify it -- called a Probable Cause Affidavit [PCA] in some court systems -- and sometimes required for warrants of both kinds (search and arrest), it depends on the laws and jurisdictions.

So after an overview is discussed verbally they then agree to decide what they're going to include or leave out or redact or un-redact after they have more info.

So there could be some knowledge or potential evidence LE has not put in writing in court documents which is germane to their investigation.

And that could change and it gets put into writing down the road once it's vetted or eliminated as things evolve.

LE has to tell the truth but they don't have to tell the whole truth/all they know or suspect in court documents, to protect the integrity of their investigation.

[Edited]

JMO

 

[Sillybilly]

It could also be some potential evidence is discussed verbally between LE / their legal support / while getting ready to alert the judge who it's being put in front of for a decision on approval, to make sure they have all their t's crossed and i's dotted, before it's all put down in court documents, e.g., a search warrant.

So it's airtight and will meet probable cause to justify it -- called a Probable Cause Affidavit [PCA] in some court systems -- and sometimes required for warrants of both kinds (search and arrest), it depends on the laws and jurisdictions.

I don't know if this is the case in NS, maybe it's more straightforward in this situation, "two missing siblings" investigation, with urgency prioritized.

Perhaps some of the potential evidence that could go into a search warrant is discussed verbally with the judge as a "warm up", e.g., something along the lines of:

"While drafting the X of X search warrants for X, we think we have X pieces of evidence or knowledge of likely places to search that are solid and justify the warrant, but Y and Z may not be solid yet or may be seen to implicate certain individuals who are protected as potential victims or witnesses, and we just don't know yet where Y and Z might lead."

So after an overview is discussed verbally they then agree to decide what they're going to include or leave out or redact or un-redact after they have more info.

Again, it varies by locale, but the strategy and discussions behind what ends up going in to court documents such as a search warrant can originate from verbal discussions with a judge before or while they are being presented for approval, even by phone in the middle of the night.

So there could be some knowledge or potential evidence LE has not put in writing in court documents which is germane to their investigation that a judge could be aware of.

And that could change and it gets put into writing down the road once it's vetted or eliminated as things evovle with the investigation.

IANAL and don't know how it goes in Canada.

Maybe someone who is an attorney can correct me if I'm wrong...

Just pointing out a potential aspect of what LE puts in writing in court documents such as a search warrant could have a "verbal history with the court" that is a "read between the lines" subtlety.

LE has to tell the truth but they don't have to tell the whole truth/all they know or suspect IN WRITING in court documents, to protect the integrity of their investigation.

JMO

We don't have any verified Canadian lawyers at WS, and although I'm not a lawyer, I do have a legal background in Canada from many moons past. IMO, this would be highly unethical if not outright judicial misconduct. Judges have to maintain integrity and remain impartial.

Snippet from "Ethical Principles for Judges"

JMO

 

[Twistinginthewind]

We don't have any verified Canadian lawyers at WS, and although I'm not a lawyer, I do have a legal background in Canada from many moons past. IMO, this would be highly unethical if not outright judicial misconduct. Judges have to maintain integrity and remain impartial.

Snippet from "Ethical Principles for Judges"

JMO

Thank you! I edited my post accordingly to remove references to the court potentially being aware of anything that goes into decisions by LE on documents which are submitted.

 

[agent902]

"Understanding the Prevalence of Human Trafficking
corridor in Atlantic Canada,

The high rate of human trafficking in Nova Scotia comes from a very specific source. North Preston's Finest grooms teenage girls from group homes, via the "boyfriend game". (Happened to my best friend a few decades ago, and they're still at it.) They're brutal, ruthless, amoral trafficking pimps of the worst order. But trafficking kidnapped children has never been on their rap sheet, or even an accusation. They don't sell small children. They "work" their "girls" in strip clubs and escorting.

The wrench is weird to me. I feel like the wrench was a noise alert, not to be used for weapon possibly.

Why a wrench for protection (from bear or man or whatever) and not a baseball bat? Or crowbar?

Baseball bat is a more common protective weapon in a home I'd think. But if it was a matter of means at hand, then a wrench might suffice. The whole wrench thing doesn't make sense to me MOO...

The way it makes sense, is if you think of it not as a weapon but as a booby trap. It's a poor man's alarm system.

When I lived with someone who was running a cash business out of home, they worried about their own customer base breaking in to steal. They were always dreaming up weird booby trap ideas, for the cash and the doors. They wanted to be woken up if someone tried to break in at night.

Hi Su5ie, can you repost the court documents that show timeliness and redacted info, or tell me where I will find it. Thanks

Lilly and Jack Sullivan Documents - 1 — the Canadian Gothic

searcn and seizure application related to telephones belonging to Daniel and Malehya

thecanadiangothic.com

 

[Serononin]

The high rate of human trafficking in Nova Scotia comes from a very specific source. North Preston's Finest grooms teenage girls from group homes, via the "boyfriend game". (Happened to my best friend a few decades ago, and they're still at it.) They're brutal, ruthless, amoral trafficking pimps of the worst order. But trafficking kidnapped children has never been on their rap sheet, or even an accusation. They don't sell small children. They "work" their "girls" in strip clubs and escorting.




The way it makes sense, is if you think of it not as a weapon but as a booby trap. It's a poor man's alarm system.

When I lived with someone who was running a cash business out of home, they worried about their own customer base breaking in to steal. They were always dreaming up weird booby trap ideas, for the cash and the doors. They wanted to be woken up if someone tried to break in at night.

Lilly and Jack Sullivan Documents - 1 — the Canadian Gothic

searcn and seizure application related to telephones belonging to Daniel and Malehya

thecanadiangothic.com

Thanks for sharing this, that document definitely clears some things up. The information from MBM's mother about Thursday is particularly interesting IMO, since it confirms that the children definitely made it home from New Glasgow that day.

Has the existence of the "nearby swamp" been discussed here before? Does anyone know how easy a swamp would be to comprehensively search compared to, say a lake? I'm wondering if there's any possibility that Jack and Lilly could have ended up in there and been missed during the searches

 

[Bigditch]

Thanks for sharing this, that document definitely clears some things up. The information from MBM's mother about Thursday is particularly interesting IMO, since it confirms that the children definitely made it home from New Glasgow that day.

Has the existence of the "nearby swamp" been discussed here before? Does anyone know how easy a swamp would be to comprehensively search compared to, say a lake? I'm wondering if there's any possibility that Jack and Lilly could have ended up in there and been missed during the searches

dbm

 

[su5ie]

I think this is very, very important. From that longer interview at the 9:30 time stamp:

Reporter: So to be clear, it's currently not a criminal investigation?

Staff Sgt. Rob McCamon: No it's not. We don't have any, we haven't collected any evidence or facts or information that suggests criminal investigation or charges or anything like that. So we are still investigating a missing person's act.

So the disappearance is being investigated under the missing person's act which I'm presuming all missing persons in Canada are investigated under .

The RCMP stated its not criminal and also they have assumed from the day of the disappearance that it is not an abduction.

So we have those two statements as fact and I'm sure I can safely assume that is bona-fide truth , yes ?

So why did they also say at one point that the disappearance was being viewed as suspicious. ( not exact wording and from memory) if anyone can find a link that states this it would be greatly appreciated as while I do recall it written but I cannot find the article atm .

I'm just confused as to what it means by the officers are investigating other theories. What could the other theories be ,besides wandering , abduction or criminality? I just don't see any other avenue . Am I just not thinking outside of the box ?

 

[Bigditch]

So the disappearance is being investigated under the missing person's act which I'm presuming all missing persons in Canada are investigated under .

The RCMP stated its not criminal and also they have assumed from the day of the disappearance that it is not an abduction.

So we have those two statements as fact and I'm sure I can safely assume that is bona-fide truth , yes ?

So why did they also say at one point that the disappearance was being viewed as suspicious. ( not exact wording and from memory) if anyone can find a link that states this it would be greatly appreciated as while I do recall it written but I cannot find the article atm .

I'm just confused as to what it means by the officers are investigating other theories. What could the other theories be ,besides wandering , abduction or criminality? I just don't see any other avenue . Am I just not thinking outside of the box ?

I think that comment dates back to May, June. I will look.

 

[su5ie]

The high rate of human trafficking in Nova Scotia comes from a very specific source. North Preston's Finest grooms teenage girls from group homes, via the "boyfriend game". (Happened to my best friend a few decades ago, and they're still at it.) They're brutal, ruthless, amoral trafficking pimps of the worst order. But trafficking kidnapped children has never been on their rap sheet, or even an accusation. They don't sell small children. They "work" their "girls" in strip clubs and escorting.




The way it makes sense, is if you think of it not as a weapon but as a booby trap. It's a poor man's alarm system.

When I lived with someone who was running a cash business out of home, they worried about their own customer base breaking in to steal. They were always dreaming up weird booby trap ideas, for the cash and the doors. They wanted to be woken up if someone tried to break in at night.

Lilly and Jack Sullivan Documents - 1 — the Canadian Gothic

searcn and seizure application related to telephones belonging to Daniel and Malehya

thecanadiangothic.com

Thank you so much for posting the documents link , what an eye opener .

I have to digest all that information contained in them as its a lot . But it certainly for me anyway poses many questions as well as answers

 

[Serononin]

I'm just confused as to what it means by the officers are investigating other theories. What could the other theories be ,besides wandering , abduction or criminality? I just don't see any other avenue . Am I just not thinking outside of the box ?

I guess there's also the possibility of a combination of factors, e.g. that they wandered away from the house voluntarily but met with some kind of foul play after that

 

[LadyL]

The wrench is weird to me. I feel like the wrench was a noise alert, not to be used for weapon possibly.

Why a wrench for protection (from bear or man or whatever) and not a baseball bat? Or crowbar?

Baseball bat is a more common protective weapon in a home I'd think. But if it was a matter of means at hand, then a wrench might suffice. The whole wrench thing doesn't make sense to me MOO...

I'm catching up only now from days ago so likely missed the whole discussion, so sorry to repeat any thoughts

that's what I thought too