NY - UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Midtown. #11 *Arrest*

[LinasK]

They saw the items he bought, saw on camera where he put them, and then recovered those items. Any evidence she wasn't privy to when she made those comments is only going to get exponentially stronger, I'd bet the farm on that.

Law enforcement never stated the gun he was believed to have used. Anonymous sources close to the investigation made those claims to the media. All that matters is the weapon on him matched the rounds found at the scene. The video is by far the least important piece of evidence there.

He talked about whacking the CEO of health insurance company at his investor conference. If I recall, the name of the company was redacted, but that's a confession regardless.

I mean, the CEO of a health insurance company was "whacked" at his conference.

He also talked about it coming together back in October, which shows the planning needed to further the Federal charges. That's a much easier first degree murder conviction, and the real one he should be concerned about.

No need to prove terrorism, just that he traveled interstate and stalked his victim. That notebook buries him.

From the little bit I've read, a quirk of NY law is that the terrorism charge is what allows it to be First Degree murder. It's a "Special Circumstance". I think it's why the rest of us in the rest of the country don't understand.

 

[LinasK]

Going off your penal codes and laws that define it, no, I do not think this meets the charge of terrorism that America itself put into stone. Aren't a large percentage of standard homicides targeted? How were the civilian population in this case intimidated, coerced or fearful as a result of the act any more than when any of the other dozens of people were shot in the streets of NY this year were? I'd argue less so in this case. UHC doesn't fall under government as they're a private company. They don't even fall under the umbrella of essential infrastructure either as they're an insurance company.

In terms of the fed charges, yah I can see why you are logically rallying for those over state as the terrorism spew is a reachy overkill that they won't get, and I think everyone agrees that NY's weird murder guidelines are mental, but my point and opinion is that why does this one deserve federal murder 1 just because it doesn't meet NY's standards, when there are so many other horrific NY crimes that don't get the fed treatment (even when in actual reality, the feds could find an in)? I get that in the world of law and justice, things aren't always dealt with similarly, but here it's like a big kick in the hoop to so many victims of serious crime and to me it's elitist, especially as it's blatantly obvious just how hard they're trying to prove points here with all of the circus show and the gazillion charges thrown at the wall y'know?

I stick to my guns and they are murder 2 & firearm charges is justice in my eyes... That's if they can even find a jury now after the catwalk show!

Oh they'll be able to find a jury. Not everyone watched the perp walk, not everyone has sympathy for this killer, and the trial is probably a year or more off.

 

[MassGuy]

From the little bit I've read, a quirk of NY law is that the terrorism charge is what allows it to be First Degree murder. It's a "Special Circumstance". I think it's why the rest of us in the rest of the country don't understand.

Exactly. In pretty much every other state (if not every other state), they could simply charge first degree murder based on the premeditation, which is the most obvious thing in the world.

 

[Eaglette]

The perp walk would never have happened if the perp had not stalked & pulled the trigger.

End of.

 

[Luna20]

Delete: wrong thread

 

[DizzyB]

The perp walk would never have happened if the perp had not stalked & pulled the trigger.

End of.

True. And for me, the perp walk wasn’t about innocence or guilt. It was about Adams trying to take the heat off of his administration, and making it about himself. I watched when a shackled Kohberger boarded the plane across the country. This felt the same.

 

[detective.moon]

Luigi Mangione’s sweater sells out at Nordstrom one day after court appearance

Mangione appeared for his arraignment hearing on December 23

www.independent.co.uk

Luigi Mangione’s sweater sells out at Nordstrom one day after court appearance​

i have to say, it’s a nice sweater. have there been any other murder suspects who became an influence on fashion, i wonder?

 

[girlhasnoname]

Is it right to 'cut the head off the snake' in furtherance of a highly debated topic that has been ongoing on for YEARS? I have been on the inside of Healthcare and been the biggest opponent of their practices. It's terrible how the need for profit outweighs patient care in many instances. If you knew my friends IRL and asked them what pushes my hot button the most, they would all tell you - It's the HealthCare Industry. Hospitals, Big Pharma and Insurance Companies.

If this was your husband, or partner, would their death be okay for LM to spread his 'supposed' message? Brian was gunned down by LM claiming to further a politically charged and highly emotional issue, but Brian was wasn't just calling the shots at UHC. There is a whole Board and an Executive Staff making these decisions together. Should they also be gunned down?

There are thousands of Brian's out there in the world working as CEO's of Companies with unpopular practices or policies that affect all of us negatively. It's not just the HealthCare Industry. I hope your significant other isn't the CEO of one of them.

Violence, and certainly cold blooded murder, solves nothing. Celebrating this will solve nothing in the long run either. It has gained LM a groupie following until he's locked away and they move on to the next 'big thing'. Meanwhile an innocent family grieves the loss of a husband and father, son, brother, uncle, etc.

It's a disgusting cowardly act, and I'm shocked quite frankly at the people who think this is a good thing.

JMO

 

[girlhasnoname]

Tell that to the the NY mayor and his cronies who seem to just love giving him utterly nutso attention when they're surrounding him parading him about when they're in swat gear like he's Hannibal Lecter

I agree that was a bad call. JMO

 

[girlhasnoname]

This is why, in my opinion, we're seeing so much sympathy for LM. The health insurance system in this country is broken, and while I do not condone shooting CEOs, I do hope this event will open hearts and minds to our fundamentally flawed insurance system and lead to positive changes.

LM was angry and he (symbolically) severed the head of the serpent.

LM must be held accountable for killing BT. There's no way around that.

But who do we hold accountable for patients who suffer and die because they are denied lifesaving care? Someone has killed them, too. Or, at least contributed to their deaths.

Who in our country gets to decide the value of a life?

Good place to start is here:

Agencies create regulations (also known as "rules") under the authority of Congress to help government carry out public policy. Learn about HHS' top regulations and how you can make your voice heard.

https://www.hhs.gov/regulations/index.html

 

[GRT]

Good place to start is here:

Agencies create regulations (also known as "rules") under the authority of Congress to help government carry out public policy. Learn about HHS' top regulations and how you can make your voice heard.

https://www.hhs.gov/regulations/index.html

Thank you.

That's a positive step, and some may find the information helpful.

 

[Trino]

Is it right to 'cut the head off the snake' in furtherance of a highly debated topic that has been ongoing on for YEARS? I have been on the inside of Healthcare and been the biggest opponent of their practices. It's terrible how the need for profit outweighs patient care in many instances. If you knew my friends IRL and asked them what pushes my hot button the most, they would all tell you - It's the HealthCare Industry. Hospitals, Big Pharma and Insurance Companies.

If this was your husband, or partner, would their death be okay for LM to spread his 'supposed' message? Brian was gunned down by LM claiming to further a politically charged and highly emotional issue, but Brian was wasn't just calling the shots at UHC. There is a whole Board and an Executive Staff making these decisions together. Should they also be gunned down?

There are thousands of Brian's out there in the world working as CEO's of Companies with unpopular practices or policies that affect all of us negatively. It's not just the HealthCare Industry. I hope your significant other isn't the CEO of one of them.

Violence, and certainly cold blooded murder, solves nothing. Celebrating this will solve nothing in the long run either. It has gained LM a groupie following until he's locked away and they move on to the next 'big thing'. Meanwhile an innocent family grieves the loss of a husband and father, son, brother, uncle, etc.

It's a disgusting cowardly act, and I'm shocked quite frankly at the people who think this is a good thing.

JMO

It was a terrible violent act, but it certainly brought health care insurance to the surface. Question: are LM followers supporting LM as a person, or are they supporting LM's stance on health care?

 

[GRT]

It was a terrible violent act, but it certainly brought health care insurance to the surface. Question: are LM followers supporting LM as a person, or are they supporting LM's stance on health care?

Good question. And it's hard to tell.

Most seem to support his stance on healthcare, but some seem to support him as a killer, as in a David & Goliath scenario.

I see two extremes in this case. MOO

1) Those who see LM as some savior of the downtrodden and warrior against the insurance industry.
2) Those who see the shooting of BT as something more dangerous than an ordinary NYC shooting and are calling it "terrorism."

Then, there are those in the middle who see the shooting as murder but also see the big problems inherent in the insurance industry.

 

[girlhasnoname]

It was a terrible violent act, but it certainly brought health care insurance to the surface. Question: are LM followers supporting LM as a person, or are they supporting LM's stance on health care?

I believe they are supporting LM in a Martyr role unfortunately. JMO

 

[detective.moon]

It was a terrible violent act, but it certainly brought health care insurance to the surface. Question: are LM followers supporting LM as a person, or are they supporting LM's stance on health care?

it seems to me that many people do support LM’s stance on health care, i just wonder - what will happen with that support? will people come together for change, in an effective way? how would that even work? i think many people felt like things wouldn’t ever change, and now feel a spark of change in the air, with something unimaginable like this happening, the killing of a ceo being the symbol of “this system is not untouchable”.

 

[citygirl]

A Very Happy Christmas to all the great posters on this board.

 

[Arkay]

A Very Happy Christmas to all the great posters on this board.

Merry Christmas and Happy Chanukah to everyone!

 

[snarast]

it seems to me that many people do support LM’s stance on health care, i just wonder - what will happen with that support? will people come together for change, in an effective way? how would that even work? i think many people felt like things wouldn’t ever change, and now feel a spark of change in the air, with something unimaginable like this happening, the killing of a ceo being the symbol of “this system is not untouchable”.

BBM

Now the system has to change drastically because if there was ever a copy cat-inducing murder, it is this one.

Attractive assassin? Check
Successful assassin throwing away his own life for the benefit of others? Check
Ivy league? Check
Extremely wealthy family? Check
Snuff film? Check
Cold execution similar to First Person Shooter games? Check
Martyrdom and EMO appeal? Check

The good news is an increased need for conscientious security detail, thus generating some more jobs.

The bad news is that there will be far more people shielded completely from the ills in our world - and that is very bad because then their capability to empathise, such as it is, will more or less evaporate.

So IMHO this was a short sighted approach from a man who could actually instead have made a long lasting positive impression on society. It’s sad.

 

[acutename]

Luigi Mangione’s sweater sells out at Nordstrom one day after court appearance

Mangione appeared for his arraignment hearing on December 23

www.independent.co.uk

Luigi Mangione’s sweater sells out at Nordstrom one day after court appearance​

i have to say, it’s a nice sweater. have there been any other murder suspects who became an influence on fashion, i wonder?

this is weird. It is a plain colored sweater- how do they know its exact origin? Reminds me of the fashion folk following M. Obama, Amal Clooney, etc.

 

[Charlot123]

Yes, it's alarming. And, shocking. But, it's also fascinating.

I've been trying to wrap my head around it since the killing took place, and T-shirts appeared with the words, "Defend, Delay, Depose."

I don't know if it will reach the level of becoming a "movement," but it's a sociopolitical powder keg.

Ultimately, it is still economical, my question is how to predict when "one of such cases" will turn sociopolitical. As of today, it signals a deepening chasm between “the haves” and “have nots.”

In the minds of the people who agree with LM, BT belongs to 1% in wealth. That is all.

this is weird. It is a plain colored sweater- how do they know its exact origin? Reminds me of the fashion folk following M. Obama, Amal Clooney, etc.

So Nordstrom, a monopoly, made a big deal before Christmas, lol!