4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #98

[Megnut]

I didn't go to lawyer school, but I'm pretty sure yer sposta have some relevant case law when yer wantin' the judge to rule in yer favor.

Law 101.

JMO

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

BK commit the perfect conviction.

JMO

This one is good @Megnut …. real good! I guess too, it is a good thing that all that forensic science and investigative technique training has served the defendant well. MOO

 

[Megnut]

What did we learn today?

Surviving roommates were texting, corroborating the timeline. DM didn't trust her perception, understandably. She noted additional sounds and movements we hadn't previously heard about (on the staircase, crying coming from a bathroom). Extended barking. Murphy was not in a room with a closed door.

BK's phone was turned off.

BK did leave his campus around 2:42/2:44. In his white 2015 Hyundai Elantra. And apparently was captured on camera with his car nosed away from the direct route to Moscow. Proving what, I don't know.

It's his DNA on the sheath. But we knew that.

(BK was a student of criminal psychology. At the PhD level. No way he thought he could leave DNA at a quadruple murder scene AND enjoy privacy of the same. No, he intended to enjoy his privacy precisely because he intended to LEAVE NO DNA behind.)

My analysis of today: AT isn't afraid that BK can't get a fair trial; she's afraid he'll GET a fair trial. Which will result in his certain conviction.

JMO

 

[Megnut]

I'm wondering how long before BK elbows AT aside, and says "Step aside lady, I'll take it from here".

Like an unwelcome tickle.

 

[mickey2942]

This was a large house, with lots of people who came in and out. Random male DNA may be in places in the house. College students are not generally known to be overly sensitive about maintaining an immaculate home.

But, that still does not provide the answer to why BK's DNA was found on a knife sheathe, under a victim. That needs to be explained. Not any other DNA found in the house.

 

[iamshadow21]

So, tl;dr, today's hearing was basically the Defense saying it wasn't fair that LE were allowed to take DNA samples from their own crime scene because it matched the defendant and he didn't consent to them doing that?

Wow.

MOO

 

[Megnut]

So, tl;dr, today's hearing was basically the Defense saying it wasn't fair that LE were allowed to take DNA samples from their own crime scene because it matched the defendant and he didn't consent to them doing that?

Wow.

MOO

I'm surprised she didn't ask if BK could have his sheath back.

Presumptions of innocence and privacy and all.

Maybe put his DNA back in his mouth too.

But really, what can she do when all the evidence implicated her client?

All she's got is pounding the judge with her table.

 Jmo

 

[Cool Cats]

Point noted.

What difference does it make which way BK's Elantra was pointed over an hour before the crime was committed?

Wasn't there an unrelated police presence at his complex that night? Who knows what round about approach he used to get from Pullman to Moscow? Same with his return trip. Just because it's not mapped inch by inch doesn't preclude him from doing it.

JMO

I think his alibi is one of the dumbest alibis I have heard because it shows the jury he was out on those roads that night which was absolutely necessary for the killer to do to get back and forth between Pullman and Moscow. BK puts himself out on these roads at the time of the murders and it doesn't matter the exact inch by inch description .... I totally agree with your assessment.

2 Cents

 

[INfisherman]

I didn't go to lawyer school, but I'm pretty sure yer sposta have some relevant case law when yer wantin' the judge to rule in yer favor.

Law 101.

JMO

"Every day of the week & twice on Sunday."

 

[Cool Cats]

I'm surprised she didn't ask if BK could have his sheath back.

Presumptions of innocence and privacy and all.

Maybe put his DNA back in his mouth too.

But really, what can she do when all the evidence implicated her client?

All she's got is pounding the judge with her table.

 Jmo

She can try to keep him from getting the death penalty by being honest with him that if the DNA is allowed into his trial it could be overwhelming evidence towards conviction. A plea of guilty could take off the DP.

If he ends up on death row the blame falls on her.

If she can get his DNA thrown out then he has a better chance or if she can get his arrest thrown out he can walk, etc...But if not, she needs to level with him that this DNA is very overwhelming in my opinion.

2 Cents

 

[Sor Juana]

It's his DNA on the sheath. But we knew that.

(BK was a student of criminal psychology. At the PhD level. No way he thought he could leave DNA at a quadruple murder scene AND enjoy privacy of the same. No, he intended to enjoy his privacy precisely because he intended to LEAVE NO DNA behind.)

RSBM. Even experts can make mistakes or overlook details, especially under stress. Overconfidence, unforeseen circumstances, stress, poor lighting.. JMO

 

[Cool Cats]

Maybe it was BF. Ran upstairs with the doordash for Xana. Ran back downstairs.

And possible the door dash driver actually handed the food to a person at the door and can identify this person. We do not know if the door dash driver left the food outside the door or handed the food to an actual person in the house.

2 Cents

 

[INfisherman]

RSBM. Even experts can make mistakes or overlook details, especially under stress. Overconfidence, unforeseen circumstances, stress, poor lighting.. JMO

That burden of proof falls on the defense & from what I saw today, I’d bet the words plea deal are crossing BKs mind, if he has any brains behind those woolly worms. AT needs a refresher course in Probable Cause 100 & I’m betting much more as things unfold. Complete deer in the headlights when the judge magistrate (heh) was explaining to her how PC works.

JMO

 

[Cool Cats]

RSBM. Even experts can make mistakes or overlook details, especially under stress. Overconfidence, unforeseen circumstances, stress, poor lighting.. JMO

I think he did not expect there to be a second person in M M's bed and it threw him off. Also, I believe KG surprised him by fighting back if I remember correctly. She was sitting up in the corner and had fought back I think her parents said. This would not be something the coward killer expected. He thought he could stab a single sleeping victim and his plans went awry and this is why he left his sheath.

My opinion if I am remembering correctly.

 

[INfisherman]

So, tl;dr, today's hearing was basically the Defense saying it wasn't fair that LE were allowed to take DNA samples from their own crime scene because it matched the defendant and he didn't consent to them doing that?

Wow.

MOO

Maybe I’m overreacting a bit but I found her argument to be quite reckless IMO. What if the judge bought it & agreed & set a precedent? Could you imagine the repercussions? Like you mentioned a couple of months back in the Delphi thread, just unlock the prisons & let ‘em all out.

MOO

 

[LinasK]

Maybe I’m overreacting a bit but I found her argument to be quite reckless IMO. What if the judge bought it & agreed & set a precedent? Could you imagine the repercussions? Like you mentioned a couple of months back in the Delphi thread, just unlock the prisons & let ‘em all out.

MOO

I highly doubt that the judge will buy it and set precedent. At least I sure hope not! It could lead to the overturning the conviction of my cousin's killer and many others.

 

[iamshadow21]

Maybe I’m overreacting a bit but I found her argument to be quite reckless IMO. What if the judge bought it & agreed & set a precedent? Could you imagine the repercussions? Like you mentioned a couple of months back in the Delphi thread, just unlock the prisons & let ‘em all out.

MOO

These things are always argued on a backbone of case law, and it doesn't sound like she had any. I don't think there are many, if any judges who will throw out a crucial piece of evidence just because a defense attorney says 'but it's not fair!' Every single one of them says that for every case about something, and nobody gets a freebie, they have to prove their point to the judge's satisfaction with a proper foundation. She didn't.

MOO

 

[INfisherman]

I highly doubt that the judge will buy it and set precedent. At least I sure hope not! It could lead to the overturning the conviction of my cousin's killer and many others.

Oh I’m with you. It speaks to some attorneys character to even toe that line. Seems a bit irresponsible to me. You just never know what a judge will do or how a trial may turn out (new judge) before it’s all said & done. Check out what just happened in the Pike County massacre trial. New judge & 1 of the murderers of 8 people went from life to ~30-35 years & he’ll be out before he’s 60.

ETA JMO

 

[gremlin444]

Ashley J/prosecution didn't respond to that substantively, though maybe I missed it? I believe because they deemed it unnecessary, moo. I think we'll find out in due course that the blood was so degraded and aged that as we already know, the DNA extracted from it didn't qualify for CODIS upload. That is my guess/speculation.

Also noting, the inside, unknown male profile was on the hand rail ( of the stairs I'm guessing jmo) so not what you would call in proximity to the victims. If railing does refer to stair railing makes perfect sense that forensics swabbed there. Jmo

The presence of a small amount of blood on a common shared touch surface in a rental college apartment/house (esp one known for parties) is one of the least surprising pieces of evidence to me. I remember the places I lived in college...those landlords were not known for their in depth cleaning between residents. *shudder*

 

[wendy44]

I think AT is rightfully pissed that the FBI apparently violated terms of service of at least one site where users can upload DNA, and apparently also violated their own guidelines. She's right to be angry about that. I think she struggled more than usual today though because this judge can really cut to the heart of the matter. The question is, was it unconstitutional, and he made the point that it's not. He didn't say that IGG in general is not unconstitutional, just that what the FBI did is not. She also argued right to privacy and I didn't think she did all that well with that. She just kept coming back to public perception of expectation of privacy and I think it's way more complicated than that due to the nature of familial DNA. The judge also made the point that BK lacks standing since he didn't upload his own DNA--again, the facts of familial DNA I think can complicate that but she didn't argue it.

With the Franks, he again cut to the heart of the matter--she needs to convince him that if all this other information she was bringing up had been included in the PCA the magistrate would have made a different decision. With a familial match of the father's DNA from the trash to the DNA on the sheath, there is virtually no chance the magistrate is not going sign off. Would conflicting statements of a traumatized witness change the decision if included? Would a car pointed in the opposite direction as Moscow an hour before the crime change the decision if included? I don't think so, just my opinion.

I honestly thought the Deputy DA was awful today and I hope she's better prepared for trial.

There's a lot to pick apart from today's hearing and I'm sure we'll dissect every sentence for pages on end since we've had so little info so far lol.
JMO