4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #98

[mickey2942]

It will be interesting. I think that the defense should just leave it open, in regards to trying to identify the perpetrator. It reminds me of the disgusting defense in the "Molly Tibbets" trial, when the defense completely tried to shift the blame on the boyfriend of Molly Tibbets. It alienated the jury.

If not BK, then who?! Have there been any unsolved murders in the United States, that involved multiple victims? That is a possibility.

 

[MassGuy]

I think the poster was saying that without the DNA, they don't have anything. In other words, were it not for the DNA, would there be a case? IMO, no there would not. Poster can correct me if I misinterpreted.



Off or out of range? Was that ever settled? And I'm sure the phones of many others in the area was off or out of range too.



The same car they misidentified at least once before they had a suspect. This will hurt the prosecution, IMO.



No, it didn't. The phone data had him using wifi in an area close to the crime scene, it never actually placed him at the crime scene. This is important because their house isn't the only thing in that area, IIRC.



Do you mean the WSU parking attendant? I'm not sure what you're saying here.



I say it's painfully thin without DNA.

MOO

Police found an Elantra on video, and put out a bulletin to other law enforcement agencies in the area to see what they could find in regards to that vehicle, during the timeframe in question. WSU police did just that, and came up with Bryan Kohberger. So the car led police to him.

Later on, thanks to IGG, DNA led them to the same man. That's what I mean by two independent lines of inquiry, coming up with BK.

That idea that investigators couldn't pin down the year of the car is absolutely meaningless when you put those two things together. It proves that they were initially wrong about the year, not that it wasn't his car.

His phone had no business being in the area on those 12 of so occasions prior. If it was the daytime, that's one thing. The late night/early morning trips show that this was a scouting mission, just what you'd expect from a guy who wanted to commit the perfect crime. He would have wanted to not only get a lay of the land, but get a lay of the land during the time in which he'd be committing the crime.

This WIFI thing is new to me, but his phone magically going out of service during the precise time in question, a time that fits perfectly with his car's movements and the phone data they do have, is ridiculous on its face. No one is going to believe that's a coincidence, not with the rest of it.

Again, I believe slam dunk. By the time we hear the rest of it, it'll be a solo slam dunk contest.

 

[CKS]

I think the poster was saying that without the DNA, they don't have anything. In other words, were it not for the DNA, would there be a case? IMO, no there would not. Poster can correct me if I misinterpreted.

MOO

Yes that's what I meant. Without the touch/transfer DNA they have nothing in my opinion that factually links BK to this crime from what we've seen. Who knows though? Maybe they have a lot more they're saving?


All MOO

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

Small amount of evidence? They have nearly nothing on BK to prosecute him?

I have never heard anyone say that about this case. There is so much evidence that AT had mentioned having someone help her organize it. This is a 3 month trial because of all the evidence and hundreds of witnesses, AT mentioned 400 witnesses but then lowered that amount.

SBMFF.

Information does not equal evidence. It's important we separate the two. You are right, there is a ton of information that was provided. But the only evidence we know of is what's been made public and multiple posters, myself included, have said repeatedly that we don't think that's much evidence. It was when they literally disassembled his vehicle and found nothing that I came to that conclusion. Add in that there wasn't a shred of evidence (that we know of) in his apartment as well, and I maintain that the evidence is very weak with the exception of the DNA. The DNA is king here. If that is disputed, thrown out, or cast shade on, the state's case is in trouble, IMO.

MOO

 

[mmeynstyn]

I think the poster was saying that without the DNA, they don't have anything. In other words, were it not for the DNA, would there be a case? IMO, no there would not. Poster can correct me if I misinterpreted.



Off or out of range? Was that ever settled? And I'm sure the phones of many others in the area was off or out of range too.



The same car they misidentified at least once before they had a suspect. This will hurt the prosecution, IMO.



No, it didn't. The phone data had him using wifi in an area close to the crime scene, it never actually placed him at the crime scene. This is important because their house isn't the only thing in that area, IIRC.



Do you mean the WSU parking attendant? I'm not sure what you're saying here.



I say it's painfully thin without DNA.

MOO

<Statement above bolded by me for emphasis>

IMO it will not hurt the prosecution. From linked article below and bolded by me for emphasis:

"Though police had realized Kohberger, with his 2015 Elantra, was a person of interest by Nov. 29, they issued a news release on Dec. 7 asking for the public's help in finding a white 2011-13 Elantra.
It wasn't clear why police issued that request, but law enforcement agencies sometimes use such public statements to throw off suspects and keep them from learning they're under suspicion.

Search for white Hyundai was key in Bryan Kohberger case

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

Police found an Elantra on video, and put out a bulletin to other law enforcement agencies in the area to see what they could find in regards to that vehicle, during the timeframe in question. WSU police did just that, and came up with Bryan Kohberger. So the car led police to him.

Yes, the car led police to him. But that isn't convincing because the police misidentified the year and if early media reports are to be believed (many threads ago), they thought it might have been a Nissan, IIRC at first. We've all seen the videos. It's very blurry and unclear, and more importantly, did they ever place that car at the actual crime scene? I don't remember them doing that.

Later on, thanks to IGG, DNA led them to the same man. That's what I mean by two independent lines of inquiry, coming up with BK.

But that's the point. If the DNA is thrown out, everything else is weak. Guilty or not, the white car, his "weirdness," phone being off, and wifi in the neighborhood, by itself will not convict this guy. I would bet all of those things could apply to scores of others in the area. It's the DNA that's most important. If that is thrown out for whatever reason, the cases collapses, IMO.

That idea that investigators couldn't pin down the year of the car is absolutely meaningless when you put those two things together. It proves that they were initially wrong about the year, not that it wasn't his car.

There is no doubt that he drives a white Elantra. It casts doubt on whether the white Elantra in the video is his white Elantra. If the DNA is thrown out, this becomes so much weaker.

His phone had no business being in the area on those 12 of so occasions prior. If it was the daytime, that's one thing. The late night/early morning trips show that this was a scouting mission, just what you'd expect from a guy who wanted to commit the perfect crime.

This doesn't make sense to me. He had no business in that area at night? Wasn't it at 10 pm that his phone used the wifi in the neighborhood? Weren't there grocery stores in that area? Wasn't there a shopping hub of some sort there? But even if it was later and everything was closed, we have no evidence (that we know of) that puts him in the neighborhood for any length of time prior to the murders. He could have been driving through on the way to some place else. Heck, he could have just been driving around, which he has every right to do. To say he had no business being there is an overstatement that is factually biased as we all have a right to be in whatever public area we want, regardless of time of day.

He would have wanted to not only get a lay of the land, but get a lay of the land during the time in which he'd be committing the crime.

This WIFI thing is new to me, but his phone magically going out of service during the precise time in question, a time that fits perfectly with his car's movements and the phone data they do have, is ridiculous on its face. No one is going to believe that's a coincidence, not with the rest of it.

His phone was out for hours, not "during the precise time in question." Those hours happened to have included the time of the murder, but it was also out hours before, wasn't it? We also don't know if his phone was out the night before or the night before that or the night before that. All we know is that his phone was off the night of the murders for several hours. All that proves is that his phone can't exonerate him. It doesn't prove he did it.

MOO.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

<Statement above bolded by me for emphasis>

IMO it will not hurt the prosecution. From linked article below and bolded by me for emphasis:

"Though police had realized Kohberger, with his 2015 Elantra, was a person of interest by Nov. 29, they issued a news release on Dec. 7 asking for the public's help in finding a white 2011-13 Elantra.
It wasn't clear why police issued that request, but law enforcement agencies sometimes use such public statements to throw off suspects and keep them from learning they're under suspicion.

Search for white Hyundai was key in Bryan Kohberger case

That's just speculation. Until someone testifies that that's what happened here, I maintain it'll hurt the prosecution. MOO

 

[mmeynstyn]

SBMFF.

Information does not equal evidence. It's important we separate the two. You are right, there is a ton of information that was provided. But the only evidence we know of is what's been made public and multiple posters, myself included, have said repeatedly that we don't think that's much evidence. It was when they literally disassembled his vehicle and found nothing that I came to that conclusion. Add in that there wasn't a shred of evidence (that we know of) in his apartment as well, and I maintain that the evidence is very weak with the exception of the DNA. The DNA is king here. If that is disputed, thrown out, or cast shade on, the state's case is in trouble, IMO.

MOO

I also agree that the DNA is king here. However, IMO, they still have a case. The Delphi Murder suspect was convicted with no DNA. And, IMO, the circumstantial evidence in that case was much weaker than this case. JMO

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

I also agree that the DNA is king here. However, IMO, they still have a case. The Delphi Murder suspect was convicted with no DNA. And, IMO, the circumstantial evidence in that case was much weaker than this case. JMO

I didn't follow that case, but I think it's asking two much for 12 objective people to come to the conclusion of guilt based on driving a white car and his phone being off or out of range on the night of the murders. I've never seen a case convicted on that kind of thing. They can't even place him at the scene of the crime, that night or any other night.

MOO.

 

[MassGuy]

I also agree that the DNA is king here. However, IMO, they still have a case. The Delphi Murder suspect was convicted with no DNA. And, IMO, the circumstantial evidence in that case was much weaker than this case. JMO

His devices will talk, and I’m convinced we haven’t heard the half of it.

That DNA is absolutely coming in, and in the not too distant future any discussion in that regard will become moot.

I look forward to that.

 

[CKS]

Police found an Elantra on video, and put out a bulletin to other law enforcement agencies in the area to see what they could find in regards to that vehicle, during the timeframe in question. WSU police did just that, and came up with Bryan Kohberger. So the car led police to him.

Later on, thanks to IGG, DNA led them to the same man. That's what I mean by two independent lines of inquiry, coming up with BK.

That idea that investigators couldn't pin down the year of the car is absolutely meaningless when you put those two things together. It proves that they were initially wrong about the year, not that it wasn't his car.

His phone had no business being in the area on those 12 of so occasions prior. If it was the daytime, that's one thing. The late night/early morning trips show that this was a scouting mission, just what you'd expect from a guy who wanted to commit the perfect crime. He would have wanted to not only get a lay of the land, but get a lay of the land during the time in which he'd be committing the crime.

This WIFI thing is new to me, but his phone magically going out of service during the precise time in question, a time that fits perfectly with his car's movements and the phone data they do have, is ridiculous on its face. No one is going to believe that's a coincidence, not with the rest of it.

Again, I believe slam dunk. By the time we hear the rest of it, it'll be a solo slam dunk contest.

All MOO

The 12 times you reference I'm wondering what you mean by 'area'?

His phone pinged to a cell phone tower which most likely is at least a 10 mile radius. These 12 pings very easily could of been shopping at the Walmart when his phone pinged in my opinion.

With all due respect you act as if these pings are him in the driveway of the house which just isn't the case.


All MOO

 

[jepop]

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[MassGuy]

All MOO

The 12 times you reference I'm wondering what you mean by 'area'?

His phone pinged to a cell phone tower which most likely is at least a 10 mile radius. These 12 pings very easily could of been shopping at the Walmart when his phone pinged in my opinion.

With all due respect you act as if these pings are him in the driveway of the house which just isn't the case.


All MOO

I said “area,” for a reason. I look forward to the defense presenting information that Kohberger made those trips in the late evening/early morning to shop at the 24 hour Walmart.

The fact that the Walmart closes at 11, notwithstanding.

Maybe they’ll just claim that area provided the best view of the sky, so he could look at the stars as he frequently did.

Or something.

 

[sassyblue]

Hearing is live.

 

[MassGuy]

Hearing is live.

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[Megnut]

AT coming in loaded for bear --

Asking for suppression of evidences due to lack of warrant.

Moving DNA to Othram.
IGG developing ca strand.
Removal of trash.

Judge asks if there are any cases to support to position.

No....

JMO

 

[jepop]

I said “area,” for a reason. I look forward to the defense presenting information that Kohberger made those trips in the late evening/early morning to shop at the 24 hour Walmart.

The fact that the Walmart closes at 11, notwithstanding.

Maybe they’ll just claim that area provided the best view of the sky, so he could look at the stars as he frequently did.

Or something.

Not forgetting too, BK's phone never pinged again in the area ( "near the house" was actually how the defense worded it in their Motion for Change of Venue -see relevant Court Doc- possibly somewhat of a slip up there? we shall see) after Nov 14th 2022. So after the murders he no longer found late night shopping or whatever in heck he was doing in the area necessary. Yeah, another incredible coincidence. Jmo

 

[DizzyB]

Judge is asking tough questions.

 

[MassGuy]

His attorney is getting creamed by the judge here. To say he’s skeptical of the defense arguments regarding the IGG is a massive understatement.

There’s just nothing here, for those who say she must have some smoking gun or something.

He’s asking for case law, and she just doesn’t have any. This is tough to watch.

 

[Megnut]

Judge distilled the issue.

No case law, no warrant required to test DNA found at a crime scene.

JMO