Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #199

[joe jones]

They’re witnesses, there’s just no way they’d be excluded. The sketches being excluded is no surprise, as they are considered hearsay. You call those witnesses and ask them if Richard Allen looks like the guy they saw.

It simplifies things and avoids confusion.

If the evidence the state has is confusing then that's what they have to live with, RA nor his defence team are not the ones who made the sketches confusing, and the witnesses gave descriptions of what they saw that day, and I don't agree they are hearsay, if they are allowed to describe the boy/man they saw them they should be allowed to say is this the sketch you and the LE sketch artist made IMO

 

[Seattle1]

They should be evidence IMO as they have been the one thing LE has relied on from 2017 as to what he looked like, well the first one was then the second one was revealed but they couldn't quite decide whether it was no 1 or no 2 or a mixture of both,
And if we go by the rule that the only evidence the state can use is what the prosecutor was involved in them they will be severely lacking in evidence,
I wonder if the witnesses who gave the description for the sketches will now testify, I think they are both good witnesses for the state on the timeline as one was at the beginning and one is at the end so it gives the state two independent witnesses who can provide the times they were on or near trails, what they saw or equally as important what they didn't see,

Excellent point about how police relied on composites for years that were wrong! They pulled Sketch #1 and replaced it with Sketch #2. Glad they relied on actual evidence to make the arrest.

 

[sunshineray]

When do they break for lunch? Gotta be come up soon!

 

[SouthEnd]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1847306377112203430

Absolutely no surprises in the opening statements, IMO. Lets see how each side will go about laying their cases. Thank you for sharing!

 

[iamshadow21]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1847306377112203430

FOUR journalists banned! And one tried to film the juror's van!

Wow, we're really seeing the press at their worst, here. I'm hoping these folks weren't MSM.

MOO

 

[girlhasnoname]

This boggles the mind. I have been critical of the draconian handling of the press, and yet the PRESS pulls something like this off, and oof. I guess they are doing their best to justify JG's tone.

All MOO

The circus tone and utter lack of respect for the Court in this case is what led to JG's decision, and it has been proven to be correct IMO.

 

[MassGuy]

FOUR journalists banned! And one tried to film the juror's van!

Wow, we're really seeing the press at their worst, here. I'm hoping these folks weren't MSM.

MOO

They said one was a wire service, so at least one was MSM.

 

[tlcya]

They should be evidence IMO as they have been the one thing LE has relied on from 2017 as to what he looked like, well the first one was then the second one was revealed but they couldn't quite decide whether it was no 1 or no 2 or a mixture of both,
And if we go by the rule that the only evidence the state can use is what the prosecutor was involved in them they will be severely lacking in evidence,
I wonder if the witnesses who gave the description for the sketches will now testify, I think they are both good witnesses for the state on the timeline as one was at the beginning and one is at the end so it gives the state two independent witnesses who can provide the times they were on or near trails, what they saw or equally as important what they didn't see,

I disagree with the Bolded By Me portion of your post. A rendering based on hearsay descriptions to a sketch artist cannot be considered evidence. Also, we cannot know what LE had and when and we surely cannot state as fact that the sketches were the ONE thing LE has relied on as to what he looked like. LE likely put very little stock in what their perp looked like. They were more focused on finding evidence connecting a perp to the crime IMO. The sketches were for the benefit of the public, in effort to generate more tips and not something I believe LE relied upon.

I believe the eyewitnesses will testify to what they saw and defense will have an opportunity to question them on the stand as well.

 

[iamshadow21]

They said one was a wire service, so at least one was MSM.

Shameful.

I know that journalists were annoyed at her restrictions, but it's her court, and if they're used to reporting on criminal cases, then they should know better than to pull nonsense like trying to photograph the jurors.

MOO

 

[Seattle1]

If the evidence the state has is confusing then that's what they have to live with, RA nor his defence team are not the ones who made the sketches confusing, and the witnesses gave descriptions of what they saw that day, and I don't agree they are hearsay, if they are allowed to describe the boy/man they saw them they should be allowed to say is this the sketch you and the LE sketch artist made IMO

More important, the witnesses who were present will be available to testify and can tell the jurors who/what they saw, and whether or not it was somebody who looked like RA. They can also be examined by the defense. Can't get better than this.

 

[Purdue19]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1847308692292518090

Our Russ McQuaid says, Allen was unshackled and in normal clothing, clean-shaven, and appeared more “bright-eyed” than usual. He was accompanied by corrections officers who were also in normal clothing, as Allen is not meant to look like a prisoner in front of the jury.

 

[joe jones]

Wow, judge is moving the trial along, and 4 people already banned for trying to take pictures of jury van, I have long held the view that the amount of money people can make from true crime channels will start to have issues with trials, the need to be the first to get the information, the lack of ethics so they just do what they please to make sure they get clicks and views, let's hope this is the only time they break the rules as this judge is prepared to give consequences, there really is no cure for stupidity

 

[MiniMoo]

I predict the next Motion in Limine from the prosecution will be to exclude their testimony altogether.

As always, JMO.

Im beginning to be a little concerned.

JMT

 

[Seattle1]

Officers in Delphi confiscate journalists' cameras at courthouse

Special Judge Frances Gull made it clear during Thursday media orientation that photographs or video of the jurors was forbidden.

www.indystar.com

10/18/24

Special Judge Frances Gull made it clear Thursday during a media orientation session that photographs or video of jurors was forbidden. On Friday morning, Gannett photographer Alex Martin said he saw two vans approach the shrouded fences on the west side of the courthouse and put his camera on his hip, then set the second camera on the ground.

After the jurors were unloaded, officers arrived and confiscated the cameras, Martin said.

“I wasn’t taking pictures of jurors,” he said, and he was standing in an approved area outside of the courthouse. Martin said four or five other photographers also had their cameras taken.

It has yet to be determined whether the cameras, which included both still photo cameras and video cameras, will be returned, Martin said.

 

[joe jones]

More important, the witnesses who were present will be available to testify and can tell the jurors who/what they saw, and whether or not it was somebody who looked like RA. They can also be examined by the defense. Can't get better than this.

I disagree, those sketches goes to part of his defence, that LE were making mistakes, that they appeared to have no idea what they were doing and made mistakes and they are arguing they are mistaken in thinking RA did it,
We can agree to disagree we all see things differently and today is day 1 and I am sure we will find other things we agree or disagree as the trial continues

 

[tlcya]

The defense’s opening statement focused on inconsistent witness descriptions, their client’s mental health and added bullet testing is inconclusive. They added the girls were likely abducted on Monday afternoon, driven away from the bridge, and killed somewhere else.
The defense told the jurors they believe Abby and Libby’s bodies were then placed near the bank of Deer Creek early Tuesday morning.

Allen's attorneys said law enforcement can not explain the hair found intertwined on Abby’s hands that doesn’t match Richard Allen. The defense asked jurors to consider there is no DNA linking Allen to the murders.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1847306377112203430

So the DT is still going with the girls removed from the area taken elsewhere and killed only to be returned to the location they were found at the following morning, while the woods and trails were crawling with LE and search volunteers, friend and family of the missing girls.

I think this is a mistake on their part and maybe why they decided at the eleventh hour to withdraw their field trip to monon high bridge I suspect a trip to the scene of the crime would only serve to highlight how very unlikely it is that events happened as they describe.

As Always - JMO

 

[sunshineray]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1847306377112203430

This is nuts, IMO. WHAT killer(s) is going to come back to a scene they've successfully escape from undetected to bring two dead bodies back to a place that's crawling with LE, FD and scores of searchers with flashlights!? Makes NO sense at all. The defense just sunk their own boat with yet another fantastical tale. AJMO

From your link...

"The defense’s opening statement focused on inconsistent witness descriptions, their client’s mental health and added bullet testing is inconclusive. They added the girls were likely abducted on Monday afternoon, driven away from the bridge, and killed somewhere else.The defense told the jurors they believe Abby and Libby’s bodies were then placed near the bank of Deer Creek early Tuesday morning."

 

[sunshineray]

FOUR journalists banned! And one tried to film the juror's van!

Wow, we're really seeing the press at their worst, here. I'm hoping these folks weren't MSM.

MOO

Two of them were.

 

[MassGuy]

The defense’s opening statement focused on inconsistent witness descriptions, their client’s mental health and added bullet testing is inconclusive. They added the girls were likely abducted on Monday afternoon, driven away from the bridge, and killed somewhere else.
The defense told the jurors they believe Abby and Libby’s bodies were then placed near the bank of Deer Creek early Tuesday morning.

Allen's attorneys said law enforcement can not explain the hair found intertwined on Abby’s hands that doesn’t match Richard Allen. The defense asked jurors to consider there is no DNA linking Allen to the murders.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1847306377112203430

So the DT is still going with the girls removed from the area taken elsewhere and killed only to be returned to the location they were found at the following morning, while the woods and trails were crawling with LE and search volunteers, friend and family of the missing girls.

I think this is a mistake on their part and maybe why they decided at the eleventh hour to withdraw their field trip to monon high bridge I suspect a trip to the scene of the crime would only serve to highlight how very unlikely it is that events happened as they describe.

As Always - JMO

lol. Driven away, killed somewhere else, and kindly returned to the most dangerous location to a perpetrator; the place the victims disappeared from, and the place where people would be looking for them.

They should go with literally anything but this. It’s not just stupid, it’s insane.

 

[scapa]

This boggles the mind. I have been critical of the draconian handling of the press, and yet the PRESS pulls something like this off, and oof. I guess they are doing their best to justify JG's tone.

All MOO

Welp. I guess they figured the possible gains were worth the risk. Especially if you're a photographer who's limited to pencil/ paper -- why even bother with a long day in the courtroom?

I think there's a better balance between court decorum and public interest access than is being allowed by JG -- but egregious flouts like the ones here deserve swift and sure sanction, IMO.