CANADA Canada - Jack, 4 & Lilly Sullivan, 6, Vulnerable, wandered from home 10am, Gairloch Rd, Landsdowne Station, Pictou County, NS, 2 May 2025 #7

[Curiousraccoon]

There are also some discrepancies in his story with MBM (he said he saw Lily pop into the room) and in the documents published she said that he was sleeping all morning while she saw Lily.

The same goes for accounts of who the grandmother saw outside and who told her that the kids were missing (DM or MBM).

Then, the car, there is an interview of him saying he drove "my vehicle" to search for the kids and in some other source supposedly it was MBM's car.

This all was mentioned and quoted above, but if there are doubts, let me know and I will do my best to find the sources.

All in all, either the reporting in MSM is really extra sloppy, or their stories contradict.

And we have no reasons to think that the neighbours are lying.

And, then MBM moved out immediately, which tells me something is wrong, there is a level of mistrust as a minimum between them.

 

[Ontario Mom]

There are also some discrepancies in his story with MBM (he said he saw Lily pop into the room) and in the documents published she said that he was sleeping all morning while she saw Lily.

The same goes for accounts of who the grandmother saw outside and who told her that the kids were missing (DM or MBM).

Then, the car, there is an interview of him saying he drove "my vehicle" to search for the kids and in some other source supposedly it was MBM's car.

This all was mentioned and quoted above, but if there are doubts, let me know and I will do my best to find the sources.

All in all, either the reporting in MSM is really extra sloppy, or their stories contradict.

And we have no reasons to think that the neighbours are lying.

And, then MBM moved out immediately, which tells me something is wrong, there is a level of mistrust as a minimum between them.

I think overall, the reporting has been mostly consistent. Some outlets add a bit more detail than others but again, overall it's pretty much been the same story since day 1.

I don't think it was his car he jumped in to drive around and look for the kids (since his car wasn't there). I think it was M's car and he just said "my car". Same way he says "my house" when his mom actually owns it.

I think the neighbors likely did hear something. I don't think what they heard was DM's car.

jmo

 

[EspressoBean]

There was no active CPS investigation underway. In fact, there isn't even an organisation called CPS in Nova Scotia.

Update: Multi-agency search for missing children in Pictou County scales back

As of today, a multi-agency search for two missing children, six-year-old Lilly Sullivan and four-year-old Jack Sullivan, will be scaled back.Lilly and Jack were reported missing on May 2, at approximately 10 a.m. It's believed they wandered away from their home on Gairloch Rd. in Lansdown...

rcmp.ca

Child Protection FAQ's | Nova Scotia Family Law

www.nsfamilylaw.ca

FYI: CPS is the generic term used for Child Protection Services. The names of the organizations responsible for this change province to province and community to community so the general term is CPS that describes this, a ministry (government) run organization for a community that oversees child protection.

 

[Dreamcherry]

First, he wouldn't. Second, hasn't it already been established his vehicle was undriveable and sitting in his dad's garage?

A few comments back, sunspun has an excellent post regarding this! The Cliff's Notes version is that yes, it seems that his vehicle was in his dad's garage at some point, but Daniel is also quoted as saying that his car never left the property that night (in response to the allegation that neighbours heard it repeatedly). I would take that to mean that his vehicle was in fact at their property the night in question, and then later ended up at his dad's. If you think about it, if it were at his dad's that night, he would have said that, as it makes a better alibi than him insisting it was there, but he didn't use it. I hope I'm making sense!

I'm not suggesting that any of this means anything nefarious or that he definitely used his car that night. If he was up to no good, he would have used the much quieter car, surely. I do believe the neighbours heard something, though, seeing as though it's not just one person alleging it, but two. I don't even know where I stand with anything anymore, honestly!

 

[musicaljoke]

FYI: CPS is the generic term used for Child Protection Services. The names of the organizations responsible for this change province to province and community to community so the general term is CPS that describes this, a ministry (government) run organization for a community that oversees child protection.

Yes, I am aware of that, as could be noted from the link I provide. The O.P. stated as a fact that there was an ongoing investigation by CPS. It is the "ongoing investigation" portion of the claim that I am disputing. There is no MSM, CWS, or RCMP reports that make this statement.

There was a quote posted in the Globe and Mail which suggested that several months ago the CWS looked into the living arrangements for the children. There has been no claim that the investigation was current or ongoing. Neither was there any suggestion that the children's disappearance is related to their living conditions.

The problem with posting such unsubstantiated claims is that it casts shade on the family in a way that can be harmful to the work of trying to find the children. It can lead into all manner of conspiracy theories. It can turn the general public away from providing support by making it seem as though the family somehow deserved this great tragedy because of faults of their own.

Missing Nova Scotia children were assessed by child welfare agency months before disappearance

Lilly and Jack Sullivan have been missing since early May, and a police investigation is under way

www.theglobeandmail.com

 

[Dreamcherry]

FYI: CPS is the generic term used for Child Protection Services. The names of the organizations responsible for this change province to province and community to community so the general term is CPS that describes this, a ministry (government) run organization for a community that oversees child protection.

This is the correct answer. Child Protection/Child Welfare are used to refer to the services/programs that operate under the mandate of a provincial department. I've never worked in NS, just NB, but it's the same deal. Here, the department is called Social Development, and it's divided into various divisions, which also branch off into units and sections. The units that deal with child protection are actually called child protection, and there are a bunch of them with different functions in all regions.

 

[Ontario Mom]

The problem with posting such unsubstantiated claims is that it casts shade on the family in a way that can be harmful to the work of trying to find the children. It can lead into all manner of conspiracy theories. It can turn the general public away from providing support by making it seem as though the family somehow deserved this great tragedy because of faults of their own.

<RSBM> unfortunately I think that's where this case has been since nearly the beginning, in the court of public opinion.

 

[Slebby]

Yes, I am aware of that, as could be noted from the link I provide. The O.P. stated as a fact that there was an ongoing investigation by CPS. It is the "ongoing investigation" portion of the claim that I am disputing. There is no MSM, CWS, or RCMP reports that make this statement.

There was a quote posted in the Globe and Mail which suggested that several months ago the CWS looked into the living arrangements for the children. There has been no claim that the investigation was current or ongoing. Neither was there any suggestion that the children's disappearance is related to their living conditions.

The problem with posting such unsubstantiated claims is that it casts shade on the family in a way that can be harmful to the work of trying to find the children. It can lead into all manner of conspiracy theories. It can turn the general public away from providing support by making it seem as though the family somehow deserved this great tragedy because of faults of their own.

Missing Nova Scotia children were assessed by child welfare agency months before disappearance

Lilly and Jack Sullivan have been missing since early May, and a police investigation is under way

www.theglobeandmail.com

We know that not one but two memos were generated by NS’s child protection dept. after the children disappeared. I believe the file is not closed on them.

Grandmother of Jack and Lilly Sullivan calls for public inquiry into children’s disappearance

Belynda Gray says child protection service needs to reveal how Nova Scotia government responded to concerns about missing kids’ home life

www.theglobeandmail.com

DM said the reason for the visit was related to learning disabilities.

Months after Nova Scotia children vanished, a clearer picture emerges of their lives before their disappearance

DM said they were to see a doctor later in May for their suspected autism.

If DM is correct and this is the reason for the CWS visit, I guess it’s possible the case manager made a “suggestion” the children see a doctor for assessment for autism, then closed the file. I, however, personally believe it more likely that the case worker ended the visit with an expectation of follow up on the assessment. If a follow up was planned, in my personal opinion, this speaks to a file that remained open.

I’m not promoting conspiracy theories, and I’m not casting shade. I’ve no reason to disbelieve DM.

IMHO

 

[otto]

There are also some discrepancies in his story with MBM (he said he saw Lily pop into the room) and in the documents published she said that he was sleeping all morning while she saw Lily.

The same goes for accounts of who the grandmother saw outside and who told her that the kids were missing (DM or MBM).

Then, the car, there is an interview of him saying he drove "my vehicle" to search for the kids and in some other source supposedly it was MBM's car.

This all was mentioned and quoted above, but if there are doubts, let me know and I will do my best to find the sources.

All in all, either the reporting in MSM is really extra sloppy, or their stories contradict.

And we have no reasons to think that the neighbours are lying.

And, then MBM moved out immediately, which tells me something is wrong, there is a level of mistrust as a minimum between them.

There were financial and child welfare issues in the months leading up to the disappearance.

The mother lost child support for the two older children when their father lost his job. The $1900 monthly government cheque she received for the children was stopped in May because the father did not file taxes on time. Child protective services opened a file in early 2025 based on reports from the children's school. The children were scheduled for a related medical assessment in May. Both children had a black eye between December 2024 and the day they vanished.

In general, the family had no money, and there was a chance that the children would be temporarily removed from their care.

On May 2, two neighbours heard and saw vehicle activity during the night at the home. The mother's initial statement is that she alone saw her oldest daughter in the morning, she did not see her son. The father was asleep, he saw nothing.

The children's maternal grandmother arrived at the home on May 2. The mother and infant daughter left, and have not returned. The father has had no contact with his infant daughter.

A relative of the mother has said that he believes the children were removed by a relative of the mother. He has not provided details or evidence.

August 2025

Months after Nova Scotia children vanished, a clearer picture emerges of their lives before their disappearance

There are still few answers about missing siblings Jack and Lilly Sullivan, but trauma and stigma have left their families and community farther apart

www.theglobeandmail.com

October 2025

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/lilly-jack-sullivan-missing-children-court-documents-car-vehicle-9.6943179

 

[otto]

I'm curious about their financial situation. The typical monthly income included child support for the two older children, plus $1900 government child benefit money, plus income from the father when he was working full time. That must have been at least $4000+ per month during the past 3 years. Their overhead costs must have been minimal with a wood stove, and living on his mother's property. At the same time, his vehicle needed major repairs and they don't appear to have any savings. His father assisted with groceries, the school assisted with Winter clothing.

"Inside the mobile home, a large wood-stove filled up most of the living room.​

...​

​

Daniel’s father said he bought the couple groceries and gas, and provided firewood to heat their home.​

​

... there were signs the children’s home life was strained. They were developmentally behind other children, and arrived at school grubby and without appropriate Winter clothing, prompting staff to provide it for them."​

That income was reduced to the father working one shift per week in May, so he was home all the time. There was significant change in circumstances during the few months prior to the children vanishing.

"Other means of cash flow had also been cut off. In recent months, child support payments from Jack and Lilly’s biological father had stopped after he lost his job. Malehya’s monthly Canada Child Benefit cheque, or baby bonus – which under federal guidelines would be about $1,900 per month – was halted because Daniel hadn’t filed his taxes which were due by April 30.​

...​

​

The family was under pressure – a confluence of financial woes left the couple turning to relatives for help. Like many lower-tier workers at the mill, Daniel had been cut back to one shift a week during the spring thaw, because of an annual ban on heavy logging trucks on soggy local roads."​

Months after Nova Scotia children vanished, a clearer picture emerges of their lives before their disappearance

There are still few answers about missing siblings Jack and Lilly Sullivan, but trauma and stigma have left their families and community farther apart

www.theglobeandmail.com

 

[Slebby]

We know that not one but two memos were generated by NS’s child protection dept. after the children disappeared. I believe the file is not closed on them.

Grandmother of Jack and Lilly Sullivan calls for public inquiry into children’s disappearance

Belynda Gray says child protection service needs to reveal how Nova Scotia government responded to concerns about missing kids’ home life

www.theglobeandmail.com

DM said the reason for the visit was related to learning disabilities.

Months after Nova Scotia children vanished, a clearer picture emerges of their lives before their disappearance

DM said they were to see a doctor later in May for their suspected autism.

If DM is correct and this is the reason for the CWS visit, I guess it’s possible the case manager made a “suggestion” the children see a doctor for assessment for autism, then closed the file. I, however, personally believe it more likely that the case worker ended the visit with an expectation of follow up on the assessment. If a follow up was planned, in my personal opinion, this speaks to a file that remained open.

I’m not promoting conspiracy theories, and I’m not casting shade. I’ve no reason to disbelieve DM.

IMHO

Yes, I’m replying to myself because it’s too late to edit and add…

It occurred to me, another reason we know the child welfare investigation is ongoing is because DM told us - he told the media that he was taking courses in anger management and other courses recognized by child protection officials. He said “I have to clear my name for CPS”.

This, in my opinion, speaks to an ongoing investigation.

- August 8th Globe and Mail

Months after Nova Scotia children vanished, a clearer picture emerges of their lives before their disappearance

There are still few answers about missing siblings Jack and Lilly Sullivan, but trauma and stigma have left their families and community farther apart

www.theglobeandmail.com

 

[Greenestdays]

This article from a few days ago says there were 2 different neighbors who heard vehicle or car activity during the night before Lilly and Jack disappeared:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/lilly-jack-sullivan-missing-children-court-documents-car-vehicle-9.6943179

Why is everybody ignoring the sentence under the title that says:

RCMP say review of surveillance footage found no evidence of vehicle activity

 

[OneLove]

I'm curious about their financial situation. The typical monthly income included child support for the two older children, plus $1900 government child benefit money, plus income from the father when he was working full time. That must have been at least $4000+ per month during the past 3 years. Their overhead costs must have been minimal with a wood stove, and living on his mother's property. At the same time, his vehicle needed major repairs and they don't appear to have any savings. His father assisted with groceries, the school assisted with Winter clothing.

"Inside the mobile home, a large wood-stove filled up most of the living room.​

...​

​

Daniel’s father said he bought the couple groceries and gas, and provided firewood to heat their home.​

​

... there were signs the children’s home life was strained. They were developmentally behind other children, and arrived at school grubby and without appropriate Winter clothing, prompting staff to provide it for them."​

That income was reduced to the father working one shift per week in May, so he was home all the time. There was significant change in circumstances during the few months prior to the children vanishing.

"Other means of cash flow had also been cut off. In recent months, child support payments from Jack and Lilly’s biological father had stopped after he lost his job. Malehya’s monthly Canada Child Benefit cheque, or baby bonus – which under federal guidelines would be about $1,900 per month – was halted because Daniel hadn’t filed his taxes which were due by April 30.​

...​

​

The family was under pressure – a confluence of financial woes left the couple turning to relatives for help. Like many lower-tier workers at the mill, Daniel had been cut back to one shift a week during the spring thaw, because of an annual ban on heavy logging trucks on soggy local roads."​

Months after Nova Scotia children vanished, a clearer picture emerges of their lives before their disappearance

There are still few answers about missing siblings Jack and Lilly Sullivan, but trauma and stigma have left their families and community farther apart

www.theglobeandmail.com

Thank you for this actual realistic and factual synopsis of the overall real day to day living situation of Jack and Lily's caregivers. As a former child protective social worker, I can say that *this* is the picture we look for when care of children goes amiss.

Multiple school employees confirmed that Jack and Lily's care had gone amiss.

The adults on which they depended were under multiple stresses and their situation was being monitored which most likely added greatly to that stress.

This does not necessarily mean that any of the adults on which Jack and Lily depended directly disappeared them by whatever means but Jack and Lily did disappear, overnight, apparently without a trace from either their house or their property while under their care and jurisdiction.

The immediate search done to find living "lost" children confirmed their scent in the yard but no living scent leaving their yard.

These are the *facts* as we know them to date.

Someone knows what happened to Jack and Lily. That is also a fact.

 

[Serononin]

Why is everybody ignoring the sentence under the title that says:

RCMP say review of surveillance footage found no evidence of vehicle activity

I missed that - I wonder how much surveillance coverage there is on that road? Enough to fully rule out what the witnesses described? Enough to rule out any theory involving the children travelling (voluntarily or otherwise) on the road? That could certainly explain why the police were so quick to say there was no evidence of abduction

 

[Megnut]

,ko

Why is everybody ignoring the sentence under the title that says:

RCMP say review of surveillance footage found no evidence of vehicle activity

No surveillance footage isn't necessarily one and the same with no vehicle activity.

Possibly there's just no vehicle activity on the cctv available.

Because no vehicle went that way.
It went another way. Where there were no cameras.

Does this include no footage of vehicle activity, including when the step-dad was driving around, while looking for the children? Same principle? No CCTV on the routes taken? And no confirmation of a vehicle where one would have been?

I want to know more.

JMO

 

[TMich6811]

Yes, I’m replying to myself because it’s too late to edit and add…

It occurred to me, another reason we know the child welfare investigation is ongoing is because DM told us - he told the media that he was taking courses in anger management and other courses recognized by child protection officials. He said “I have to clear my name for CPS”.

This, in my opinion, speaks to an ongoing investigation.

- August 8th Globe and Mail

Months after Nova Scotia children vanished, a clearer picture emerges of their lives before their disappearance

There are still few answers about missing siblings Jack and Lilly Sullivan, but trauma and stigma have left their families and community farther apart

www.theglobeandmail.com

Thank you for the reminder.

I believe his discussion of entering narcotics anonymous l came from a G&M article too but I cannot access them

 

[Serononin]

,ko


No surveillance footage isn't necessarily one and the same with no vehicle activity.

Possibly there's just no vehicle activity on the cctv available.

Because no vehicle went that way.
It went another way. Where there were no cameras.

Does this include no footage of vehicle activity, including when the step-dad was driving around, while looking for the children? Same principle? No CCTV on the routes taken? And no confirmation of a vehicle where one would have been?

I want to know more.

JMO

Agreed, I'd be super interested to know what surveillance there was, and what area it covered. From the documents, it sounds like the RCMP verified the family's comings and goings in the days before the disappearance using M and D's phone data. Whether that's because there weren't enough cameras in the area that they could have driven to and from the property without being seen by one, or just because it would have taken a lot longer to go through all the footage than to look at their GPS records, I don't know, although the fact that the CCTV from the store was mentioned does seem to suggest that they corroborated the GPS data with video footage where it was available

 

[tlcya]

Why is everybody ignoring the sentence under the title that says:

RCMP say review of surveillance footage found no evidence of vehicle activity

IMO this is the exact same sort of nothingburger statement as:

“The dogs are highly trained to detect and indicate the scent of human remains, therefore, if the dogs did not alert their handlers, it suggests the dogs were never in the presence of human remains odour,” said Staff Sgt. Stephen Pike with the RCMP Police Dog Services’ Training Centre.

“However, this doesn’t definitively rule out the presence of remains in the areas that were searched. It means either the odour is there and couldn’t be detected or the odour isn’t there.”
Cadaver dogs fail to find human remains in search for missing Nova Scotia children

JMO

Similar to if a bear s in the woods but nobody was there to witness it, did the bear still in the woods? The answer is yes, it did.

 

[MistyWaters]

Why is everybody ignoring the sentence under the title that says:

RCMP say review of surveillance footage found no evidence of vehicle activity

It puzzles me how some people can presume a published tip is automatically 100% accurate and truthful beyond any doubt.

BBM

N.S. missing kids: Court documents provide details on Lilly and Jack Sullivan case | Globalnews.ca

Included in several documents are confirmation that investigators found a second piece of a pink blanket they say belonged to Lilly, in the trash.

globalnews.ca

“None of the tips so far have led to Jack and Lilly’s location or has any information that has been corroborated by the investigation,” a document notes.

 

[Slebby]

Agreed, I'd be super interested to know what surveillance there was, and what area it covered. From the documents, it sounds like the RCMP verified the family's comings and goings in the days before the disappearance using M and D's phone data. Whether that's because there weren't enough cameras in the area that they could have driven to and from the property without being seen by one, or just because it would have taken a lot longer to go through all the footage than to look at their GPS records, I don't know, although the fact that the CCTV from the store was mentioned does seem to suggest that they corroborated the GPS data with video footage where it was available

I have to wonder how much info could have been gleaned from the cellular data. If I remember right, the cellular coverage was sketchy in the area. This is, I believe, the reason MBM used the texting app - it gave her more reliable texting using WiFi. I assume their WiFi was stronger than their cell coverage. This is sometimes the case for me, I live rurally, and there are cell phone dead areas on my property.

As for the camera data, it would be interesting to also know the reliability of the cameras sourced by LE. On my property, I have motion activated solar cameras, with so-so reliability. I also have a motion activated wifi camera which is about 75% accurate. Sometimes it can just miss movement, not sure why.

I would love to be a fly on the wall. And observe the investigative process, piecing together the data from various cameras in the area, and the timelines. I am so hopeful this case is solved, and the elements of the case we have discussed will be made clear.

IMO