Russia Attacks Ukraine - 23 Feb 2022 #12

[UK Girl]

I know I was referencing the opinion in the article, discussing "plans". George Patton was a great military leader. His plan was simple keep moving forward. Great inspiring book, PATTON. Moo

At the London security summit, European leaders on Sunday presented plans for security and peace in Ukraine. With France, the United Kingdom will also initiate a peace plan, an alternative to a deal between the US and Russia.

But according to Bondarev, that doesn't impress the Kremlin at all. The plans are not concrete enough. Europe remains too dependent on America, he thinks. According to him, it only shows that Europe is not prepared for anything. "We are entering the fourth year of the war and Europe has no vision. Europe has no plan. Europe has no strategy."

It seems to me that Russia wants to tear America from Europe right now or to isolate America.

 

[UK Girl]

I'm unsure how to interpret this post?

Britain meets it's NATO spending requirements (exceeds them actually).

Or are you taling about "total dollars spent" vice GDP? If "total dollars spent", it's important to realize that Britain has a population of 69 million compared to the US' 350 million.

.

Either way we have spent more than 2 mill in weapons.

 

[JennieM]

In pictures: Russian strike on Kharkiv leaves buildings smoking​

09:47​

We can now bring to you some images from that Russian strike in Kharkiv that we reported on a bit earlier.

The drone attack, which hit an apartment complex in the north-eastern Ukrainian city, left three houses damaged and around 150 windows shattered.

An 80-year-old man and a seven-year-old boy were among the eight people injured, the city's mayor says.

IMAGE SOURCE, EPA

IMAGE SOURCE, EPA

IMAGE SOURCE, EPA

Zelensky ready to work under Trump's 'strong leadership' after 'regrettable' showdown

The Ukrainian president says last week's fiery Oval Office meeting "did not go the way it was supposed to", adding Kyiv is ready to sign a minerals deal.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[STAGNUM]

It certainly saved them money on defense spending. It was great to see the UK donating the $2 million in weapons.

I do believe this will bring the European countries closer together and much stronger as a unit.
Moo

The US has never been terribly concerned about military spending and foreign aid. Both parties GOP and DEM, have been more than willing to spend huge sums of money and US lives fighting (losing) conflicts around the globe. Money no object. Look at the 20+year war in Iraq and Afghanistan. Now suddenly faced with confronting our worst enemy, PUTIN, knees are buckling in the Whitehouse and now feigned concern about money. I recall Trump announcing in his first campaign that the US nuclear weapon systems were defective. If so, why would he have announced that publicly? If not, why the lie? It is not hard to see that we are taking a stance of weakness. Trump has no respect here or abroad. Even if he is not complicit with Putin, he is seen as a weak fool by Putin. At least with Biden, the support of the US was seen as a constant threat, even if weak.

 

[keek]

Apparently the Bughatti thing is not true:

Fact Check: No evidence Ukraine’s first lady bought Bugatti sportscar in Paris

There is no evidence that Ukraine’s first lady Olena Zelenska bought a Bugatti Tourbillon sportscar during her June 2024 visit to Paris, despite such claims online including fake photos of a Bugatti invoice and a video that an expert told Reuters has signs of being a deepfake.

www.reuters.com

Absolutely not true. There will massive amounts now of 'stories' like this circulating around the world against Ukraine and it's leader and other democracies. Guess by who, like the one above.

 

[Sarahlou]

Absolutely not true. There will massive amounts now of 'stories' like this circulating around the world against Ukraine and it's leader and other democracies. Guess by who, like the one above.

They really are playing certain people like a fiddle.

 

[STAGNUM]

This part is also untrue. imo

To be clear, I was directly quoting Trump and his many lies..

 

[Vern]

Either way we have spent more than 2 mill in weapons.

Oh, I know.

 

[Vern]

Absolutely not true. There will massive amounts now of 'stories' like this circulating around the world against Ukraine and it's leader and other democracies. Guess by who, like the one above.

Propaganda by any other name. IMO.

 

[STAGNUM]

Exactly.

Without security guarantees, the deal heavily favors the U.S. and private companies. Ukraine would be offering access to its valuable resources—potentially one of its strongest economic assets—without any assurances.

The main benefit for Ukraine should be economic growth and investment, but without security, it’s a risky gamble. If Russia invades the mining sites, companies could simply pull out, leaving Ukraine with nothing but more occupied land.

This is why Zelenskyy is pushing for clear security guarantees—without them, Ukraine risks giving away its resources with no real protection in return.

IMO

Yeah, I can't see what economic value a mining operation in a war zone would possibly be. Afghanistan has that same problem. They have rare earths as well. Nobody can exploit them. The entire deal is a shell game. It is just an accounting trick to deceive American voters into thinking Trump heroically recouped the billions in aid given to Ukraine. It would also potentially wipe out any war debt that Russia owes to Ukraine (on paper). A big win for Putin. It won't provide any reconstruction benefit to Ukraine, because once again who wants to invest in a war zone? So without security in the form of US backstop in Ukraine, it really brings nothing to the table.

 

[Simply Southern]

I'm unsure how to interpret this post?

Britain meets it's NATO spending requirements (exceeds them actually).

Or are you taling about "total dollars spent" vice GDP? If "total dollars spent", it's important to realize that Britain has a population of 69 million compared to the US' 350 million.

Over and above the EU numbers (Britain is not part of the EU), Britain has also contributed billions directly to Ukraine and billions to the World Bank as security guarantees to Ukrainian loans.

The original article discusses individual non-related NATO spending. This is the paragraph that I initially referenced. I wasn't able to link the original post but it's pretty easy to follow back, UK Girl #901 post

The age of European overreliance on the United States in which we opt for the cosy life of the welfare state over economic growth and co-dependence over self-sufficiency is well and truly over.

It is time for the UK to follow the lead of Donald Trump and follow our eternal and perpetual interests.


I'm sorry, I should have clarified. I was referring to individual spending per country. I assumed, European countries spend funds on defense in addition to NATO.

I know the US spends in addition to NATO funding. I know we spend non related NATO funding for Naval ships and multiple bases, air defence , NORAD (US/Canadian partnership) are a few that come to mind, located within US borders. In times of need, we are able to pull/shift troops and resources from within our internal US resources that would not involve NATO.

 

[branmuffin]

Trump to discuss potential suspension, cancellation of military aid for Ukraine on March 3

An unnamed administration official told NYT that Trump will meet on March 3 with his top national security aides, including Marco Rubio and Pete Hegseth.

kyivindependent.com

U.S. President Donald Trump will discuss on March 3 the possible suspension or complete cancellation of military aid to Ukraine, including weapons pledged by the Biden administration, The New York Times (NYT) reported, citing an undisclosed source.
....
An unnamed administration official told NYT that Trump will meet on March 3 with his top national security aides, including Secretary of State Marco Rubio and Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth, to review and potentially act on a range of policy options for Ukraine.

Now I know why Hegseth suspended offensive cyber operations into Russia in late February. Everything is starting to make sense. The only people who are going to be privy to the deals between the US and Russia are those in Trump's inner circle, not some nameless, faceless Americans who have spent their whole careers working to protect the country from enemies foreign and domestic using cyber operations.

 

[Simply Southern]

Either way we have spent more than 2 mill in weapons.

I was referring to the $2 bllion donated this weekend, at the European meeting held in the UK. This was a direct donation, not through NATO, to Ukraine. The missiles that they are purchasing is made in a European country.

Certainly they have given more than 2 billion.

@UK Girl , thanks...I corrected the million to billion
Moo...

 

[UK Girl]

I was referring to the $2 million donated this weekend, at the European meeting held in the UK. This was a direct donation, not through NATO, to Ukraine. The missiles that they are purchasing is made in a European country.

Certainly they have given more than 2 million.
Moo...

This is what was donated this weekend U.K.'s Keir Starmer pledges $2 billion to help Ukraine buy missiles

 

[Betty P]

It seems to me that Russia wants to tear America from Europe right now or to isolate America.

Yes, and they're using a lot of propaganda in the effort. Both Russia and US conservatives have strong propaganda programs in play, though not always well coordinated. The same thing happened in Europe with Hitler's rise to power.

 

[Simply Southern]

This is what was donated this weekend U.K.'s Keir Starmer pledges $2 billion to help Ukraine buy missiles

I know, that's what I've been referring to. I stated it was great! I'm sure it will help. It's great they're being made in a European country.

 

[UK Girl]

I know, that's what I've been referring to. I stated it was great! I'm sure it will help. It's great they're being made in a European country.

Hmm you said two million not two billion which is what confused me

 

[Simply Southern]

Hmm you said two million not two billion which is what confused me

I'm so sorry, I need to watch my m and b.

I was able to go back, note and edit on the last post but not the original. Thanks for bringing it to my attention, there is a big difference in 2 million and 2 billion weapons.

 

[tarabull]

I don’t think anyone can trust him 100% but I think we need to keep trying. What are the other options? Funding the war is not sustainable forever for any country.

People hate that Trump is on good terms with Putin (I get it) but I’m thanking God that he is. We need an open door and I believe other world leaders might agree this isn’t a bad thing.

All imo

Either T is REALLY on good terms with P, or at least HE THINKS he is.......time will tell.

 

[Simply Southern]

Sad day for Ukraine...180 souls lost

Ukraine’s Top Brass Seeks Accountability After Russian Strike on Training Base

Syrsky removed some top commanders pending criminal investigations after Russia’s deadly strike and ordered a review of missile threat protocols.

www.kyivpost.com

Commander-in-Chief of the Ukrainian Armed Forces (AFU) Oleksandr Syrsky dismissed some unit heads pending a criminal investigation and ordered his commanders to review missile threat alert procedures following a Russian missile strike on a Ukrainian training base.

In a midday attack on Saturday, March 1, the Russian struck a training base in the Dnipropetrovsk region, reportedly using a cluster-munitions-equipped Iskander-M ballistic missile.

According to the Russian Defense Ministry, its strike claimed the lives of “up to 150 Ukrainian soldiers and 30 foreign instructors.”