4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #108

[gremlin444]

I wonder if it's too much to hope for that sometime down the line BK decides to follow in the footsteps of Edmund Kemper and help the FBI learn more about criminal psychology. If I was in the BAU, that would be my wildest dream.

 

[Boxer]

I wonder if it's too much to hope for that sometime down the line BK decides to follow in the footsteps of Edmund Kemper and help the FBI learn more about criminal psychology. If I was in the BAU, that would be my wildest dream.

After he is convicted, while on death row a crime literature celebrity, yikes.

 

[LetsSolvIt]

FYI: Joseph Scott Morgan has a different take on the May 9 Dateline documentary. I tend to agree with him. OMO.

Is Kohberger the New "OJ"? Did Defense Find The "Real Killer"?

Podcast Episode · Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan · 06/04/2025 · 44m

podcasts.apple.com

 

[mmeynstyn]

Anyone familiar with the area around Cup of Joe in Clarkston? Is there a car wash over there by chance? GH has BK stopping for 4+ minutes over there.

18 minute video
GH walks through BK's trip to Clarkston. LE has cctv of BK going through the self check out at Albertson's. What did he buy?

Kates Cup of Joe? Albertsons is a 4 minute drive to Kate's Cup of Joe.

I do not see any car washes on the route between Albertsons and Kate's using street view in Google Maps. What I did notice is that Kate's Cup of Joe is a 2 minute drive to the bank of the Snake River. Kate's is off the beaten path, I mean, there is a Starbucks right in the Albertsons. Why did he go to Kate's?

 

[Jw192]

It's so hard to know what the truth is in jail / prison as some stories make it sound like an endless noisy hell of banging doors and screaming fights or wails. I've seen footage of people taken out in chain gangs, marched mercilessly in the blazing sun.

Other documentaries sometimes depict prisoners peacefully reading and making artwork or studying the bible, growing plants in a garden, or attending acting classes and working sewing mail bags for a few dollars. As if it's some idyllic secure retirement village. So... which one is it?

It can be both tbh and depends on the area of a facility.

You'll find new inmates will struggle for a while. Prisons are obviously louder than it is in your home and of course gang/group behaviour occurs in every jail/prison. After a while though, as you can imagine, they adapt. Inmates get used to the noise, the environment etc... Many often gain the ability to be able to, for example, read peacefully whilst being surrounded by noise that would drive an unincarcerated person nutso.
It also depends on the wing/unit. Some are quieter or louder than others due to size/category/inmate level. Some units have more things available to inmates, such as gardens/workshops/employment opportunities etc...

So in a nutshell, it can be all of your description above. I'm not sure what unit manky skeletor is bunked up in but I hope he's in a naughty unit where his life is a living hell, however the reality will likely be that he's in a protective unit as they wouldn't want to risk any "accidents" with a case and trial this big

 

[LetsSolvIt]

Kates Cup of Joe? Albertsons is a 4 minute drive to Kate's Cup of Joe.

I do not see any car washes on the route between Albertsons and Kate's using street view in Google Maps. What I did notice is that Kate's Cup of Joe is a 2 minute drive to the bank of the Snake River. Kate's is off the beaten path, I mean, there is a Starbucks right in the Albertsons. Why did he go to Kate's?

View attachment 592843

Kate’s (anybody) has got to cost less than StrBks. But I’m not sure GH said he bought a coffee, did he? Just that he drove through there?

The bank is a good idea since we heard that after the murders he started using cash instead of charge cards. Bank would be closed on a Sunday, but perhaps he used their ATM.

Just my thoughts.

 

[SteveP]

Kate’s (anybody) has got to cost less than StrBks. But I’m not sure GH said he bought a coffee, did he? Just that he drove through there?

The bank is a good idea since we heard that after the murders he started using cash instead of charge cards. Bank would be closed on a Sunday, but perhaps he used their ATM.

Just my thoughts.

Not the OP, but I think the poster was referring to the bank of the Snake River, as in the actual riverbank, which might be a great place from which to toss evidence, not a financial institution near the river. JMO

 

[Jw192]

I wonder if it's too much to hope for that sometime down the line BK decides to follow in the footsteps of Edmund Kemper and help the FBI learn more about criminal psychology. If I was in the BAU, that would be my wildest dream.

Whilst it's of course helpful in ways for criminal behaviour analysis as a whole to study incarcerated individuals convicted of serious crime, the issue with this is, the general likes of creepburger are grandiose and very self serving which makes it difficult to get accurate or reliable data from them. What you described above is likely his wet dream. He would buzz his head off to get the whole Bundy/Kemper/Rader... treatment, squirming in his duds over the thought that HE will have interview footage on YouTube, just like the ones he himself has watched of all the infamous serial murderers.
I don't believe for a moment that BK can offer any professional entity anything that they aren't already aware of in terms of psychology/psychiatry/criminology. He is a temu Bundy wannabe fanboy who despite his extensive doctorate level studying and education of criminology and forensics, he was a terrible criminal - ordered the weapon on Amazon, got his car caught on CCTV, left the sheath of the weapon with his stinky DNA on it AND left an eye witness! He's nothing special, in fact, he isn't even the first criminology PhD student to let the abyss that they're studying pull them in, thinking they'll make the "hall of fame" 2009-2010 Bradford, England - Stephen Griffiths murdered 3 women (suspected of more) whilst studying for a PhD in homicide studies/criminology... he even gained himself the catchy nickname of 'the crossbow cannibal' and will spend the rest of his cruddy life in Full Sutton, getting battered by other inmates and attempting to starve himself to death. BK has had enough spotlight as it is, he offers nothing which would educate or bring about future prevention of serious or serial crime.

MOO

 

[Arkay]

He is a temu Bundy wannabe fanboy who despite his extensive doctorate level studying and education of criminology and forensics, he was a terrible criminal

lol @ Temu!

I agree. He wants to be a star. A name that will live in infamy in the annals of notorious criminals.

I do believe that some prison psychologist may perhaps want to delve into Bryan’s psyche, and maybe that will be moderately helpful in some fashion. But IMO that should stay between that person, BK and whatever paper is written about him, without using his name. Just “Subject X” or similar.

Feeding his ego as a sought-after criminal is not helpful, and can lead to copycat crimes.

I truly believe he did not want to get caught, at all. I think he intended and believed he’d get away with it. However, having actually been caught, I do think he wants his name in lights.

JMO as a layperson.

 

[Megnut]

Kates Cup of Joe? Albertsons is a 4 minute drive to Kate's Cup of Joe.

I do not see any car washes on the route between Albertsons and Kate's using street view in Google Maps. What I did notice is that Kate's Cup of Joe is a 2 minute drive to the bank of the Snake River. Kate's is off the beaten path, I mean, there is a Starbucks right in the Albertsons. Why did he go to Kate's?

View attachment 592843

He didn't go TO Kate's Cup of Joe. He was captured by the camera AT Kate's Cup of Joe.

There's a Walmart near there.

The real question, why was he so far from home? There are stores closer to home.

Odd place to be.

JMO

 

[Fleur-de-lis]

Even if they do show a large number of sheaths ordered, the only DNA found on the sheath at the crime scene was BK's. And that is the only reason that it is so incriminating that he did, in fact, order a Kabar and matching sheath.

Yes, I agree. I am just wondering if they are so common as to boost the defense idea that SODDI that may be trotted out to confuse a juror. When I served on a jury, some of the others were easily confused about "beyond a reasonable doubt" and interpreted it to be "beyond any doubt."

 

[Fleur-de-lis]

It's so hard to know what the truth is in jail / prison as some stories make it sound like an endless noisy hell of banging doors and screaming fights or wails. I've seen footage of people taken out in chain gangs, marched mercilessly in the blazing sun.

Other documentaries sometimes depict prisoners peacefully reading and making artwork or studying the bible, growing plants in a garden, or attending acting classes and working sewing mail bags for a few dollars. As if it's some idyllic secure retirement village. So... which one is it?

I taught inmates. The lights blazed 24/7. It was noisy when the gang leaders wanted it noisy, and quiet when they wanted it (control of "their" gang). It stank, was cold in winter and hot in summer, filthy, medical care was wholly inadequate, and the food was basically inedible. The mentally ill among them made it much worse. But it depends on the facility. MOO

 

[Sundog]

I think she is trying to call in witnesses from DeSales to testify that he was a nice, normal student. One witness on the list is a former professor who once called him a brilliant student. Another potential witness is someone he trained with at the boxing gym.

I don't see how those would be very helpful though. Pointing out that he was a very good criminology student and a very good boxer, might be problematic?

I wonder if BK's legal team will want his DeSales professor to testify that the survey he posted on social media was a normal assignment for students in the graduate criminology program at DeSales. I think they would only do this if the prosecution tried to use that survey against BK at the trial. They could then call the DeSales professor to normalize the survey. Otherwise, I don't think the defense would want to introduce the survey into the trial at all.

 

[gremlin444]

lol @ Temu!

I agree. He wants to be a star. A name that will live in infamy in the annals of notorious criminals.

I do believe that some prison psychologist may perhaps want to delve into Bryan’s psyche, and maybe that will be moderately helpful in some fashion. But IMO that should stay between that person, BK and whatever paper is written about him, without using his name. Just “Subject X” or similar.

Feeding his ego as a sought-after criminal is not helpful, and can lead to copycat crimes.

I truly believe he did not want to get caught, at all. I think he intended and believed he’d get away with it. However, having actually been caught, I do think he wants his name in lights.

JMO as a layperson.

This is the kind of thing I meant.

The FBI BAU of today isn't the old FBI of John Douglas, Mindhunter, Rob Ressler, etc. These in depth interviews and evaluations of major criminals are still being conducted by the BAU--but they aren't publishing books about them and releasing interview tapes, etc. anymore.

He also doesn't have the cards to play like many serial killers had--the old "drag the interviews out for years by teasing he'll tell about the locations of other victims" game. If he starts playing games, fine, drop him and stop. Limit them to a specific amount of interviews or period of time, and get what useful information out of him that you can.

He can be interviewed and picked apart and that knowledge used to improve criminal psychology and/or profilling without making it into a public spectacle. It's really not that hard.

He's already infamous, even within the prison. Avoiding studying him professionally isn't going to make him any less so or any more so, provided it is done properly.

 

[LetsSolvIt]

Not the OP, but I think the poster was referring to the bank of the Snake River, as in the actual riverbank, which might be a great place from which to toss evidence, not a financial institution near the river. JMO

Started to react with LOL emoji because I missed the meaning of “bank” but not laughing at you — laughing at dumb me. Thanks for catching my error.

 

[MassGuy]

I wonder if it's too much to hope for that sometime down the line BK decides to follow in the footsteps of Edmund Kemper and help the FBI learn more about criminal psychology. If I was in the BAU, that would be my wildest dream.

I would kill to know what was going on inside his head. He does seem like the type of person who would enjoy being analyzed, as he seems to have enjoyed his interview with that psychologist.

 

[Arkay]

I would kill to know what was going on inside his head. He does seem like the type of person who would enjoy being analyzed, as he seems to have enjoyed his interview with that psychologist.

It’s probably so exhilarating for him.

Before the murders it seems as if very few people, (outside of his professors whose livelihood required it), were interested or invested in whatever thoughts were swirling through the mind of Bryan Kohberger.

After the murders and his arrest, so many people are now anxious to know what he was thinking—-before, during and after the murders.

Though I still believe he didn’t expect to be identified.

JMO

 

[gremlin444]

FYI: Joseph Scott Morgan has a different take on the May 9 Dateline documentary. I tend to agree with him. OMO.

Is Kohberger the New "OJ"? Did Defense Find The "Real Killer"?

Podcast Episode · Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan · 06/04/2025 · 44m

podcasts.apple.com

I'll agree that I don't think Dateline should have put out an episode on the case with information that was definitely covered by the gag order just a few months before before trial.

I disagree with the hosts both thinking that the info could only have come from someone low level in local LE/prosecution and that the people on the episode speaking provided none of it. I think it came from multiple places, probably from both "sides"--heck, even moving the trial from Moscow to Ada County increased the number of people with access to information. Howard Blum, Steve G and his PI, the numerous experts and consultants on both sides, one of the multiple residents of the next door house with the security footage, friends of BK's office mate, etc--so many sources.

What I would like to know, in addition to who, is the when---not in terms of "oh, Dateline got that info b4 the gag order and held onto it this whole time"....but when did they get each piece of evidence in relation to where the case was at certain times in terms of different appeals and judgements.

Now, mini-rant on:

I'll nitpick here--I'm disappointed that it sure seems like JSM and his cohost didn't bother to do a lot of verifying of facts/dates against what they recalled before they recorded and published this episode. I started taking notes of things they were factually wrong about or uninformed about...things that would have taken them seconds on Google to check instead of saying "well, if I remember correctly" or flat out stating something as fact or things that they'd know if they'd read court filings. If you are a well known podcast, stating in the episode that you've followed the case closely since the beginning, I feel you have a responsibility to do your research and fact checking before recording an episode. It's not like he rushed to put this out right after the Dateline episode aired--that was nearly a month ago. And there was no pressing need for this episode to be dropped this week...so, take your time and check your work.

Just off the top of my head--and yes, I went and double checked to be sure (for those who also listened):
--The mattresses weren't just plopped bare in the back of the pickup trucks--they were encased in white bags. Unfortunately, the bag material wasn't very opaque and the bloodstains were visible. Do I wish they had put them in an enclosed truck? Sure. But despite what JSM says, they were not exposed to the elements--they were encased. In two seconds you can find a photo of them and look and see.
--JSM and cohost question whether the times on the security cameras, etc were accurate-
filing from 3/17 pg 28--it goes through and details the accuracy or inaccuracy (and amount) of the timing of each video camera.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/CR01-24-31665/2025/031725-States-Response-Defendants-MiL-12-RE-Make-Model-Suspect-Vehicle.pdf

--the part about AT being XK's mom's former lawyer and whether that was ok. JSM even said he didn't know if any family had objected to that. And yes, it was in the news because XK's mom had gone on Newsnation and said it was wrong--that's pretty much why that was in the public's mind. Heavens knows I'm no fan of AT, but that was gone over in court on 1/27/2023 with Judge Marshall, explained, and Ashley Jennings/BT agreed with the judge and the Idaho Bar that AT had not met the mom . The reason her name was over the actual representing lawyer when the cases were active because she was head of the county's public defender office--that was the situation for one of the mom's cases. In the other case, the lawyer from the public defender's office who had repped the mom had left the office, so the case was reassigned to AT on Oct 20, 2022 (the case had already been sentenced), and they were waiting to be official withdrawn from the case. In the meantime, she had no contact with the mom nor offered her any legal advice (again no need for her to do so, the mom had already been sentenced when it was transferred over to her officially pending withdrawal).This was covered in early March of 2023 by Brian Entin and many others (BE even provides a transcript of that hearing):

https://twitter.com/x/status/1631147203153543170

If JSM and cohost mean their show to be just a chat about things instead of actual coverage and analysis of topics based on JSM's expertise, then no problem. But that's not the impression I had of what they consider their show to be.

 

[MassGuy]

I'll agree that I don't think Dateline should have put out an episode on the case with information that was definitely covered by the gag order just a few months before before trial.

I disagree with the hosts both thinking that the info could only have come from someone low level in local LE/prosecution and that the people on the episode speaking provided none of it. I think it came from multiple places, probably from both "sides"--heck, even moving the trial from Moscow to Ada County increased the number of people with access to information. Howard Blum, Steve G and his PI, the numerous experts and consultants on both sides, one of the multiple residents of the next door house with the security footage, friends of BK's office mate, etc--so many sources.

What I would like to know, in addition to who, is the when---not in terms of "oh, Dateline got that info b4 the gag order and held onto it this whole time"....but when did they get each piece of evidence in relation to where the case was at certain times in terms of different appeals and judgements.

Now, mini-rant on:

I'll nitpick here--I'm disappointed that it sure seems like JSM and his cohost didn't bother to do a lot of verifying of facts/dates against what they recalled before they recorded and published this episode. I started taking notes of things they were factually wrong about or uninformed about...things that would have taken them seconds on Google to check instead of saying "well, if I remember correctly" or flat out stating something as fact or things that they'd know if they'd read court filings. If you are a well known podcast, stating in the episode that you've followed the case closely since the beginning, I feel you have a responsibility to do your research and fact checking before recording an episode. It's not like he rushed to put this out right after the Dateline episode aired--that was nearly a month ago. And there was no pressing need for this episode to be dropped this week...so, take your time and check your work.

Just off the top of my head--and yes, I went and double checked to be sure (for those who also listened):
--The mattresses weren't just plopped bare in the back of the pickup trucks--they were encased in white bags. Unfortunately, the bag material wasn't very opaque and the bloodstains were visible. Do I wish they had put them in an enclosed truck? Sure. But despite what JSM says, they were not exposed to the elements--they were encased. In two seconds you can find a photo of them and look and see.
--JSM and cohost question whether the times on the security cameras, etc were accurate-
filing from 3/17 pg 28--it goes through and details the accuracy or inaccuracy (and amount) of the timing of each video camera.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/CR01-24-31665/2025/031725-States-Response-Defendants-MiL-12-RE-Make-Model-Suspect-Vehicle.pdf

--the part about AT being XK's mom's former lawyer and whether that was ok. JSM even said he didn't know if any family had objected to that. And yes, it was in the news because XK's mom had gone on Newsnation and said it was wrong--that's pretty much why that was in the public's mind. Heavens knows I'm no fan of AT, but that was gone over in court on 1/27/2023 with Judge Marshall, explained, and Ashley Jennings/BT agreed with the judge and the Idaho Bar that AT had not met the mom . The reason her name was over the actual representing lawyer when the cases were active because she was head of the county's public defender office--that was the situation for one of the mom's cases. In the other case, the lawyer from the public defender's office who had repped the mom had left the office, so the case was reassigned to AT on Oct 20, 2022 (the case had already been sentenced), and they were waiting to be official withdrawn from the case. In the meantime, she had no contact with the mom nor offered her any legal advice (again no need for her to do so, the mom had already been sentenced when it was transferred over to her officially pending withdrawal).This was covered in early March of 2023 by Brian Entin and many others (BE even provides a transcript of that hearing):

https://twitter.com/x/status/1631147203153543170

If JSM and cohost mean their show to be just a chat about things instead of actual coverage and analysis of topics based on JSM's expertise, then no problem. But that's not the impression I had of what they consider their show to be.

The thing about the mattresses too, is that it doesn't appear they were tested. This was in a footnote of a recent document (if I recall).

Which of course makes sense, because the bedding (sheets, pillows, etc), is going to have everything the mattresses have and more, in regards to forensic evidence. It is of course possible they cut pieces out for testing, if they thought it was necessary.

 

[Ghostwheel]

Sadly me, especially in a bathroom with fluorescent lights. I think my ancestors lived under rocks. Flash is my enemy.

I resemble that remark.