NY - UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Midtown. #11 *Arrest*

[nhmemorymaker]

I think he truly had pain, but I don't see it relevant to what he did. It likely gave him some free time to read up on "stuff", but I'm pretty sure that's where it ended. MOO

Agree. In the beginning, remember how we kept discussing the motive. What was the big deal that totally changed this individual ? What turns a human being into such a raging machine?

Well, he did sit or lay around for months. Was he just bored? Was he just pissed off that he was put out to pasture by TrueCar?

Maybe, all he wanted was to become famous.

moo moo

 

[MassGuy]

Agree. In the beginning, remember how we kept discussing the motive. What was the big deal that totally changed this individual ? What turns a human being into such a raging machine?

Well, he did sit or lay around for months. Was he just bored? Was he just pissed off that he was put out to pasture by TrueCar?

Maybe, all he wanted was to become famous.

moo moo

Maybe, all he wanted was to become famous.

If that's true, and I think there's a very real possibility that it is, he's exactly like your prototypical assassin. The guy that guns down a famous celebrity or politician, who moves from target to target in his mind before he finds an opportunity to strike someone that will achieve his goal.

He went a little further than many of those guys, taunting authorities while simultaneously spreading his message with the writing on those casings and the Monopoly money in his backpack.

He got what he wanted, but what fun is that when you get to enjoy it from a prison cell?

 

[justpeachy22]

We haven't read that he was/is in constant pain, and he doesn't move like he is in constant pain (jogging, cycling after murder).

He slipped a disc at his first surfing lesson and spend a week on his back while the disc sorted itself out. Then he slipped on a piece of paper a few weeks later and slipped a disc again. Tough luck.

Who left the paper on the floor? He did? Or was it a messy living space with paper all over the floor?

Then, after 1.5 years of conventional treatment, he had spinal fusion surgery. He wrote about how to fake needing the surgery, such as claiming involuntary urination and unable to work. It's not certain that he needed the surgery, or that he read about what to say to be granted the surgery.

Maybe his surgery did not give him what he wanted, but he didn't want to blame public health care - instead blame health coverage after losing his job? Is that what happened - top tier health insurance until he lost his job mere weeks before surgery?

You reminded me here that I too read that LM wrote on his since deleted Reddit acct to another person there with similar back troubles… he suggested that they use the words “I am unable to work”; he found from his experience that those words held more weight to getting the right medical care. Not sure if that relates to insurance or just scheduling a surgery. Is that the convo you were referring to?

 

[Friday Fan]

Was he just pissed off that he was put out to pasture by TrueCar?

Maybe, all he wanted was to become famous.

moo moo

Many years ago (50 years ago) I was out in the dating world and was warned about "red flags" like this. OK...I'm really dating myself here and this seems really old fashioned. But it's entirely possible. His success level at one time was ego sky high. (Valedictorian at an exclusive private school)

I dated an NBA drafted athlete for a short time. Well, there were lies there. Then there was someone else who lied about his college success. (Don't ask me how I found out what he was really up to, but my former life taught me how to "spy on guys"...LOL)

Anyway, "wanting to be famous" can possibly a substitute for real life success.

MOO: Maybe underachiever looking for his ego fix???

 

[Marantz4250b]

I strongly agree. Most of the people who are apparently supporting him, do not think he is a terrorist. If the prosecution brings on a strong case of terrorism, some jurors who were approved because of apparent neutrality regarding the murder, might have a hard time accepting terrorism, when they have to consider 'to what degree were massive numbers of Americans threatened?' Much grayer than did he murder someone or not.

That isn't the definition of terrorism, though.

It's essentially committing crime where your motivation is to change public policy in furtherance of a political or ideological cause. Threatening "massive" numbers of people is not a requirement - although it will usually end up affecting lots of people.

 

[Kapua]

This guy is not a common criminal, as what happened here opens the door to something far larger and much more terrifying.

This is different than every other murder case I’ve ever followed; there’s no comparison other than this guy killed someone.

The broader concern, which I believe to be very real, is that this is going to become the new way of settling scores.

Copycats targeting politicians, business leaders, anyone that people disagree with. Your difference of opinion is a justification for murder.

Your common murder does not have these implications. So you respond by throwing the book at him.

What you do not do, is create a spectacle that undermines what you are trying to achieve. What they are doing is the opposite of what their goal is.

They are turning a cold blooded killer into a martyr with these optics.

I cannot like this post enough. We had another school shooting this past week. School shootings became more common after the Columbine shooting in 1999. So the concern that this murder of a CEO may inspire other lunatics to follow suit is very real. For truly unhinged individuals, having the book thrown at them is the furthest thing from their minds. Many of them kill their victims and then commit suicide to go out in a blaze of (in their minds) glory. I still think that's what LM had in mind.

That perp walk was disgusting. LM was handcuffed, and although there were a team of police officers around him, there were times he appeared to be exposed. Unless he was wearing body armor, a well-placed sniper could have taken him down. So many LE just for show IMHO.

There is zero justification for murder. We are supposed to be civilized, and the law is crystal clear.

I keep thinking about old western TV shows (my dad loved them) and how the good guy and the bad guy would face off in the middle of the street, draw their guns, and shoot at each other. That's the image that pops up in my head when I think about what our country would be like without very clear laws. Oh, and in the wild, wild west days, you were considered a coward if you shot a man in the back. I hope that hasn't changed.

MOO

 

[katsrfun]

I went back and clarified my post, because I realized that if it was an emergency, like a car accident, they may have a policy about treating indigents, but back surgery I'd think would be Elective Surgery.I

I believe that public hospitals have to provide care whether or not you have the ability to pay. A doctor told me that sometimes you get better care without insurance because the doctors don't have to get insurance approval to provide any service you may need. Doctors take an oath to care for sick people with or without the ability to pay. A privately owned hospital is a different story; they may turn you away if you can't pay, but public owned/community hospitals can't. That is why so many indigents use the emergency as if it were their primary care physician. MOO. Katt

 

[Moonchild90]

Even the bloody mayor turned up too, you would think it was a head of state visiting or something or King Charles not a cold blooded murderer, all this farce did was increase his fan base and turn him even more into a cult/celeb

I think that was his aim

 

[BrianJohnson]

I think that was his aim

I think with such a long perp walk they were hoping that a sniper was going to take him out, I have never seen such a long perp walk in my life

 

[Marantz4250b]

Serial killers are terrorists, then. I've never felt comfortable voicing that, but this case brings the issue to the fore.

Another example would be a much more publicized crime - the attempted assassination of Ronald Reagan by Hinckley. It was clearly politically motivated - but as a lone shooter and due to the evolution of the definition of "terrorism," that's not how it was charged.

Hinckley was found not guilty by reason of insanity. He had been writing threatening-type notes/letters and even stalking a previous president (Carter). He was not all there, to be sure. I am not sure LM is all there, either. Hinckley distributed some of his political views at Yale and tried to persuade people to his views. It'll be interesting to hear more of what is in LM's notebooks - it was the nature of Hinckley's odd and threatening attempts to communicate with Jodie Foster (the actress) that made the jury think he was insane.

I guess. LM certainly has excellent representation. The lawyers might also want a plea bargain. I do think he'd have a more pleasant incarceration if he were in federal prison - and he fits the type who might be able to arrange that (he has money of his own, apparently).

Serial killers aren't terrorists. You aren't a terrorist just because you terrify the population.

The legal definitions of "terrorist" are all pretty similar in that it's the motivation behind the crime which defines the word. You have to be commiting the crime because you want to try to force social or legal change, there has to be an ideology behind it.

Serial killers, say Ted Bundy, weren't killing because they wanted society to restrict women's rights, for instance. He was killing because he enjoyed it and was a psychopath. That's not the legal definition of terrorist.

Hinkley wouldn't fall under the definition either as he wasn't doing it further a political or ideological achievement.

 

[Marantz4250b]

"I was at a conference a few days ago with the top CEOs — IBM, Deloitte — it was a room full of CEOs and government officials; and the shooting, the intentional shooting, and the response after, really traumatized the entire industry — not only the CEOs, but the employees."

Eric Adams Explains Why He Joined Luigi Mangione’s Perp Walk: ‘I Wanted to Look Him in the Eye’

New York Mayor Eric Adams on Thursday provided some clarity on why he joined the perp walk for suspected CEO shooter Luigi Mangione.

www.mediaite.com

Sounds like the perfect description of terrorism, to me! An act calculated to force change based on a political or ideological doctrine - or words to that effect.

 

[NuttMegg]

 

[Jade]

"I was at a conference a few days ago with the top CEOs — IBM, Deloitte — it was a room full of CEOs and government officials; and the shooting, the intentional shooting, and the response after, really traumatized the entire industry — not only the CEOs, but the employees."

Eric Adams Explains Why He Joined Luigi Mangione’s Perp Walk: ‘I Wanted to Look Him in the Eye’

New York Mayor Eric Adams on Thursday provided some clarity on why he joined the perp walk for suspected CEO shooter Luigi Mangione.

www.mediaite.com

(…)

I wanted to look him in the eye say that, “You carried out this terrorist act in my city,”

(…)

A top government official making a prejudicial statement with no note of innocence until proven guilty in a court of law to the press.
The defense has some meat to chew on now, imo.

This is Mayor Adams confirming this perp walk of LM was a collusion between the Mayor and LE for the purpose of making a statement, imo. As former LE the Mayor was aware of perp walks and their message:“Show the symbolism of that”

Orchestrated perp walks, that is the parading the defendant by LE and government officials in front of the press with the intention of making a statement, have been challenged for undermining the presumption of innocence.

Since many of his constituents work as CEO and in health care that seems a caring concerned statement but the stated intention of confronting LM face to face in a spectacle of pretrial interference by a Mayor, former LE, in our major city is regrettable, imo.

All imo

 

[GRT]

"I was at a conference a few days ago with the top CEOs — IBM, Deloitte — it was a room full of CEOs and government officials; and the shooting, the intentional shooting, and the response after, really traumatized the entire industry — not only the CEOs, but the employees."

I'm not really surprised; it was more than just one more shooting--it was targeting an industry and the idea that killing a CEO might set an example. The ripple effects will be felt for a while.

And, will it inspire copycats? I think that's what others in positions of authority are wondering now. Are they now at risk?

 

[ChatteringBirds]

I think the federal charges were probably filed in order to put pressure on him/his legal team to make a deal. It sounds entirely possible he will end up pleading guilty to 2nd degree murder and cutting a deal to serve about 40 years in jail

With a deal such as "40 years," can they really ensure he can't get out earlier?
There's no point in paying millions to a lawyer (if this goes to trial) if he ends up with LWOP, IMO. So I do think such a deal with be their aim.

Claims approval rates
UnitedHealthcare approves and pays about 90% of medical claims upon submission.

Is United Healthcare telling the truth or outright lying with this claim that they pay "about 90%" of medical claims?

On another topic -
Was the victim really instrumental in bringing in AI to reject very large numbers of claims, as has been alleged? If so, am I the only one wondering why he, BT, a seemingly decent man, who had the power to stop the AI, went ahead and allowed it? Did he know what he was doing? Did he care?

 

[nhmemorymaker]

Maybe, all he wanted was to become famous.

moo moo

Many years ago (50 years ago) I was out in the dating world and was warned about "red flags" like this. OK...I'm really dating myself here and this seems really old fashioned. But it's entirely possible. His success level at one time was ego sky high. (Valedictorian at an exclusive private school)

I dated an NBA drafted athlete for a short time. Well, there were lies there. Then there was someone else who lied about his college success. (Don't ask me how I found out what he was really up to, but my former life taught me how to "spy on guys"...LOL)

Anyway, "wanting to be famous" can possibly a substitute for real life success.

MOO: Maybe underachiever looking for his ego fix???

@Friday Fan ... Those of us with plenty of decades lived, do have a lot more memories tucked away than others...

Many, many websleuths cases have triggered some great memories for me. And some very very bad memories.

Kindof nice that we can share them in the safety of our websleuths playground, isn't it???

 

[Forest_Wood]

But that still doesn't answer as to why he chose UHC. Why not go after the healthcare company that he had?

It seems that LM's plan came together over time, after he became aware of the investment conference. After months of procrastination and planning, he would choose any CEO of an insurance company at the investment conference. A true windfall implies he had options.

Taken from ABC Nightline

Aug 15, 2024: "The details are finally coming together."
Aug 15, 2024: "I'm glad, in a way, that I've procrastinated, because it allowed me to learn more about (acronym for company)."
Unknown date: "The target is insurance. It checks every box."
Oct 22, 2024: "1.5 months. This investor conference is a true windfall...and most importantly - the message becomes self evident."
Unknown date: The notebook describes the intent to "Wack" the CEO of one of the insurance companies at its investment conference.

 

[Charlot123]

I don’t know if it has been ever posted but here is an interview with Philip Klein who used to be BT’s security on three different occasions. I enjoyed it more than many other such interviews. A no-nonsense guy. I always suspected one of his two versions in answer to why BT had no bodyguard that day was true. Don’t know if we’ll ever get the full answer.

Google Search

 

[GRT]

I'm sorry, I am sure that many people, too many, have had terrible experiences with insurance companies- have experienced pain, denied treatment-- and expectation levels that went "way wrong"- Do you think that is justification to murder an employee, be it a CEO or whomever the angered person decides should pay the price

We are talking murder here for God's sake--- It is distressing that so many people are supporting a cold-blooded killer and have empathy for him. Not only was it murder but this was a cowardly killing- following Mr. Thompson and shooting him in the back!!! it was cowardly! How come nobody is pointing out that LM committed a cowardly killing. He could have gone up to him face to him and shot him, which of course would be horrible, but he shot the man in the back!

It's never "justification," but it is a reason.

It's a heartbreaking situation, and I haven't heard anyone say it was okay to shoot BT. What is bubbling to the surface is a deep resentment of the insurance industry as a whole. Some are seeing this as a David vs. Goliath killing.

Shootings like this--symbolic violence--are intended to open the door to change. It doesn't make the murder okay--it's still murder, no matter what. And I agree, shooting someone in the back is cowardly.

 

[CrimeDawg123]

I’m going to go with Luigi will perform at halftime at the Super Bowl.

I mean, that horrid picture really made it look like he had an entourage, not like he was being perp-walked.

If he weren’t in an orange jumpsuit and wearing handcuffs, I would think he was some European prince surrounded by his bodyguards. With the mayor trotting behind to see if there’s anything Luigi may need.

JMO

How long before we see a music video with the protagonist in an orange jumpsuit and an armed entourage?