Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #210

[minor4th]

There were transcripts of those Hearing that occurred in August so it was actually recorded.

Yes it was recorded by a stenographer. I mean it wasn’t videotaped, and as I mentioned twice now, there is not a full transcript of the hearing. For example, I don’t think you’ll find a transcript of Todd Click’s testimony.

 

[iamshadow21]

Yes it was recorded by a stenographer. I mean it wasn’t videotaped, and as I mentioned twice now, there is not a full transcript of the hearing. For example, I don’t think you’ll find a transcript of Todd Click’s testimony.

I linked to a transcript that included Todd Click's testimony.

 

[girlhasnoname]

Didn't SCOIN overturn her dismissing RA's defense team?

For procedural reasons and an over caution concerning RA's 6th amendment right to counsel, obviously not enough to rise to the occasion of bias or her recusal on the case. IMO

 

[MiniMoo]

Was the white van the info "only the killer would know"? I need to find Wala's previous testimony at the 3-day hearing.

Something doesn't sit right with how the P have used the white van as their bombshell. I'm not seeing it imo.

No details of those confessions came up during the 3 Day Hearing, I believe.

JMO MOO JMT

 

[INfisherman]

RSBM for focus. What makes you think that? How would Baldwin have known in advance that the witness was going to give an unexpected response?

Maybe they tried to serve the subpoena earlier and were unsuccessful; Baldwin wasn't taking any chanced of that happening again. MOO

Discovery? Interviews before trials?

The exchange Baldwin & he had regarding when he worked on the ATM & BW correcting him, saying it was in the morning & he’d dropped off a trailer after work. Don’t recall specifically when BW shouted the NO but I read the exchange as Baldwin didn’t believe the testimony & slapped down the subpoena (accounts vary on how the subpoena was given to BW).

Why would he have a subpoena in his hand all ready to go & wait until after cross to give it to him? If there were issues serving him one might think to give it to him first thing if they didn’t want to take chances.

Whole point of the post was concerning dramatic acting by attorneys not the circumstances that caused the subpoena to be given to BW.

Hope that makes sense.

ETA JMO

 

[iamshadow21]

Discovery? Interviews before trials?

The exchange Baldwin & he had regarding when he worked on the ATM & BW correcting him, saying it was in the morning & he’d dropped off a trailer after work. Don’t recall specifically when BW shouted the NO but I read the exchange as Baldwin didn’t believe the testimony & slapped down the subpoena (accounts vary on how the subpoena was given to BW).

Why would he have a subpoena in his hand all ready to go & wait until after cross to give it to him? If there were issues serving him one might think to give it to him first thing if they didn’t want to take chances.

Whole point of the post was concerning dramatic acting by attorneys not the circumstances that caused the subpoena to be given to BW.

Hope that makes sense.

It's very much a 'pound the table' move.

Sound and fury, signifying nothing.

MOO

 

[Inthedetails]

Discovery? Interviews before trials?

The exchange Baldwin & he had regarding when he worked on the ATM & BW correcting him, saying it was in the morning & he’d dropped off a trailer after work. Don’t recall specifically when BW shouted the NO but I read the exchange as Baldwin didn’t believe the testimony & slapped down the subpoena (accounts vary on how the subpoena was given to BW).

Why would he have a subpoena in his hand all ready to go & wait until after cross to give it to him? If there were issues serving him one might think to give it to him first thing if they didn’t want to take chances.

Whole point of the post was concerning dramatic acting by attorneys not the circumstances that caused the subpoena to be given to BW.

Hope that makes sense.

ETA JMO

If we think it was ridiculous and unnecessary display with empty meaning, so did the jury.

jmopinion

 

[FrostedGlass]

Discovery? Interviews before trials?

The exchange Baldwin & he had regarding when he worked on the ATM & BW correcting him, saying it was in the morning & he’d dropped off a trailer after work. Don’t recall specifically when BW shouted the NO but I read the exchange as Baldwin didn’t believe the testimony & slapped down the subpoena (accounts vary on how the subpoena was given to BW).

Why would he have a subpoena in his hand all ready to go & wait until after cross to give it to him? If there were issues serving him one might think to give it to him first thing if they didn’t want to take chances.

Whole point of the post was concerning dramatic acting by attorneys not the circumstances that caused the subpoena to be given to BW.

Hope that makes sense.

I don't know why he waited; maybe he hoped he wouldn't have to serve the subpoena.

At any rate, I don't have a problem with his method of service. In fact, I liked it.

 

[cherrybier]

B McDonald on Court TV said she'd heard about the van from people in the town, along with LE, years ago.

How do we know RA didn't hear it around town also? JMO.

 

[Inthedetails]

B McDonald on Court TV said she'd heard about the van from people in the town, along with LE, years ago.

How do we know RA didn't hear it around town also? JMO.

And how do we know he didn't see/hear it in person, in the midst of committing a crime? He says he did.

jmo

 

[iamshadow21]

B McDonald on Court TV said she'd heard about the van from people in the town, along with LE, years ago.

How do we know RA didn't hear it around town also? JMO.

We don't, but I'm certain Delphi was a hotbed of rumour for five years. How could he be sure he was picking a rumour with substance, if he picked the van story? He couldn't.

MOO

 

[cherrybier]

And how do we know he didn't see/hear it in person, in the midst of committing a crime? He says he did.

jmo

We don't. I'm offering another point of view though and am open to either scenario.

 

[MiniMoo]

Discovery? Interviews before trials?

The exchange Baldwin & he had regarding when he worked on the ATM & BW correcting him, saying it was in the morning & he’d dropped off a trailer after work. Don’t recall specifically when BW shouted the NO but I read the exchange as Baldwin didn’t believe the testimony & slapped down the subpoena (accounts vary on how the subpoena was given to BW).

Why would he have a subpoena in his hand all ready to go & wait until after cross to give it to him? If there were issues serving him one might think to give it to him first thing if they didn’t want to take chances.

Whole point of the post was concerning dramatic acting by attorneys not the circumstances that caused the subpoena to be given to BW.

Hope that makes sense.

ETA JMO

I think the one to clear this up would be the FBI agent that Judge Gull wouldn't allow to testify remotely as am sure he was the one that dealt with BW initially.

Also, something did come out on Friday about Mullins and BW, I believe, it had to do with Mullins and BW during August of this year. Mullins got caught out.

Mullins or Mullens - have seen it spelt two ways.

When BW takes the stand we will see why he was subpoenaed I'm sure.

JMO MOO JMT

Andrea B covers what occured when Mullins was on the stand...

 

[cherrybier]

We don't, but I'm certain Delphi was a hotbed of rumour for five years. How could he be sure he was picking a rumour with substance, if he picked the van story? He couldn't.

MOO

Well he said a plethora of things in his confessions. It wasn't just the van story. IMO.

 

[shonyakay]

From your own post, do you not see the inconsistencies of descriptions and relative times different witnesses allegedly saw BG? The car backed in does not seem to be RA’s vehicle. One witness described it as a purple PT cruiser; another witness described it as vintage model Mercury(I think) and the camera guy described it as a 90’s movie type vehicle and says it was there early in the morning and later in the afternoon.

Also, why did SC change her description of the man’s clothes from “muddy” to muddy and bloody”? That came out during x-exam.

Also, I thought Betsy Blair initially described seeing only 3 girls on or near the Freedom Bridge.

If RA was there from approx 12:00 pm - 2:00 ish, like he later claimed, that could explain why none of the eyewitnesses give a physical description that matches RA.

Just tossing around some ideas and JMO

All of the witnesses were unaware at the time that they were witnessing a person and a car that would later be significant. They had no reason at the time to examine anything. Except Carbaugh. The first sketch released that she contributed to looks a lot like Richard Allen.

The majority of the witnesses say they saw him in passing or briefly.

That man that mentioned the movie type vehicle did not testify to anything related to the CPS building. The car he saw was parked somewhere else.

SC said she told the police she saw a muddy and bloody man to begin with but that possibly got erased. You can choose whether to believe her or not. I believe her because I feel she had no reason to lie. She didn't want to get involved, didn't want to do the sketch, and still doesn't want to be involved as she stated on the stand.

Betsy Blair saw four girls' walking on the bridge over Old State Road 25 when she went to pass underneath before heading to the trails.

If RA was at the trails at the time you mentioned, then that group of girls' would have seen him at an earlier time and they did not.

 

[abams]

B McDonald on Court TV said she'd heard about the van from people in the town, along with LE, years ago.

How do we know RA didn't hear it around town also? JMO.

The answer is we don't. It's not possible to know. But if the state is hanging its hat on this being a detail only the killer would know, yadda yadda, it's important to point out that assertion is patently false.

 

[iamshadow21]

Well he said a plethora of things in his confessions. It wasn't just the van story. IMO.

True.

And if it is the case that he did all of this confessing completely sane, I think it was probably fun for him to pepper in the truth amid false narrative.

MOO

 

[minor4th]

That man that mentioned the movie type vehicle did not testify to anything related to the CPS building. The car he saw was parked somewhere else.

Yes he did. He saw the car by the child welfare building

 

[steeltowngirl]

That’s not really how it works. There’s not a mini trial to determine whether the defense can prove their theory - the judge wouldn’t consider whether the third party has an alibi, for instance.

The defense would have to make a prima facie showing that a third party has a connection to the crime. For example, if a third party made a confession or made incriminating statements, that would be enough evidence to let the defense point to that third party. And that is what happened in this case by at least one third party potential suspect.

These were not just bald allegations made by the defense.

Can you provide an approved source to reference a third party who made a confession or incriminating statements? TIA

 

[ClearAhead]

<modsnip - quoted post was removed>

The gag order was intended to control leaks of confidential information. How would Dr Wala or anyone be in a position to tell the difference between local rumours and leaks of factual information if RA was being fed extra details to add to his confessions? Any false rumours built into RA’s confessions? Not that I noticed.

Furthermore we are to believe a patient suffering from severe psychosis has the ability to entrench an rumour shared by a doctor into their confession in such a way to precisely correlate to the time and location, later proven to be factually correct? Unbelievable!

Every piece of evidence that incriminates RA cannot possibly be the result of a wide reaching conspiracy to make him appear guilty. The simplest explanation is RA confessed to what occurred that day, knowing firsthand how he got interrupted. JMO