GUILTY Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #217

[Boxer]

this is kind of what annoys me about these softball interviews. they were never pushed in any tough questions like who were the 4 girls Rick saw?

They couldn't push that with questions because the answers strengthen the state's case.

 

[mrjitty]

i was also struck by Baldiwins rehash for the MW situation. Eve if true it still does not explain why MWs true role was not explained to the Judge? I find it hard to believe AB is being entirely honest about this given the text messages we also know about.

 

[mrjitty]

They couldn't push that with questions because the answers strengthen the state's case.

agreed but it kind of illustrates the shortcomings of all these interviews including the MS ones. They never push because it’s all access journalism at best or fanfic at worst.

not saying i don’t find them interesting but it’s a bit of a shame we haven’t had any proper investigative piece ok this yet.

 

[al66pine]

Jury Instructions & Deliberations in CA. & IN. Criminal Cases.

Wow, this surprised me, about them breaking up in groups, because in California I'm pretty sure you are not allowed to deliberate in small factions like that. They say that if one juror leaves to use the restroom, the rest need to STOP discussing the trial until everyone is back together. They are never supposed to discuss the trial unless everyone is all together.

So I wonder if they would allow little groups to work separately like that? I think it was GENIUS to do it that way----work diligently to differentiate each specific confession for its precise circumstance. I just hope the new appellate team does not try and tear this process apart, legally.

@katydid23 Deliberating in small factions of juries?

FWIW seems this section of CA Jury Instrxns is quite similar to IN's language (quoted in my post upthread last night*). Ditto some other states. No surprise.

Doubtful to me that Jury Instructions would detail specifics down to a granular level to prohibit a jury from breaking into small factions or sub-groups.

Have there been any criminal convictions appealed on basis of jury deliberations by sub-groups, which have been ruled to be improper and resulted in reversals or new trials? IDK.
Some appellate reversals on OTHER improper jury behavior in deliberations. Could have happened on basis of small factions or sub-groups, but I do not recall any. No current access to LexisNexis or equiv. for research.

____________________________________
Tedious Detail Alert
CA: "124. Separation Admonition"
"You may be permitted to separate during recesses and at the end of the day. I will tell you when to return. Please remember, we cannot begin the trial until all of you are in place, so it is important to be on time.] Remember, do not talk about the case or about any of the people or any subject involved in it with anyone, including the other jurors. Do not do research, share information, or talk to each other or to anyone else about the facts of the case or anything else connected with the trial, and do not use any form of electronic or wireless communication to do any of those things, either. Do not make up your mind or express any opinion about the case or any issue connected with the trial until after you have discussed the case with the other jurors during deliberations."

CALCRIM No. 124. Separation Admonition

Justia - California Criminal Jury Instructions (CALCRIM) (2025) 124. Separation Admonition - Free Legal Information - Laws, Blogs, Legal Services and More

www.justia.com

_______________________________
"Rule 29 - Separation during Deliberation"
"(a) The court, in its discretion may permit the jury in CIVIL cases to separate during deliberations. However, before the jurors are permitted to separate, the court shall instruct them that while they are separated, they shall:
"(1) not discuss the case among themselves or with anyone else;
"(2) not talk to the attorneys, parties, or witnesses;
"(3) not express any opinion about the case; and
"(4) not listen to or read any outside or media accounts of the trial."
[ ^ my CAPS ]

"(b) The court shall NOT permit the jury to SEPARATE during deliberation CRIMINAL cases UNLESS all PARTIES CONSENT to the separation and the INSTRUCTIONS found in section "a" of this rule are given." [ < my CAPS ]
Rule 29 - Separation during Deliberation, Ind. Ju. R. 29 | Casetext Search + Citator
Read Rule 29 - Separation during Deliberation, Ind. Ju. R. 29, see flags on bad law, and search Casetext’s comprehensive legal database
casetext.com

 

[gremlin444]

agreed but it kind of illustrates the shortcomings of all these interviews including the MS ones. They never push because it’s all access journalism at best or fanfic at worst.

not saying i don’t find them interesting but it’s a bit of a shame we haven’t had any proper investigative piece ok this yet.

Curious--of the people that MS have been able to interview post trial, who do you want them to push further on and what questions would you have liked them to ask?

I can definitely see why they would want to speak carefully with the juror--both for legal purposes and in the hopes that other jurors would then feel comfortable coming to speak with them.

 

[INfisherman]

Another Holeman interview, this time by GHI.

 

[Spartygirl]

Apparently there was quite a delay between the jury coming to a decision and the verdict being read, with Kathy Allen being “out of town”, juror says they waited in the jury room for “so long”.

I heard that while listening and also reading the interview.

Just another example of NO respect for the court and JG-
to have wifey "out of town" when they were all told to STAY CLOSE for the Verdict.

I mean, this is her husband on trial for a DOUBLE MURDER !!
Jury is in deliberation-- to bring a verdict on what can change both of their lives forever.

Then to make the Jury wait !!

I have no respect for KA
JMO

RA=BG=KILLER

 

[Spartygirl]

Juror_Interview

The Delphi Murders: First Person: A Juror: Part One [Juror] (4:10 - 5:03) With the summons, I was really, it's weird when we got the postcard sent. I wish I could remember. It was pretty early on, I would say, like August-ish even. And I guess, because I'm sure you guys know the trial was suppose...

docs.google.com

[Aine] (50:06 - 50:32)

I was curious, what did you guys think? Speaking of videos, what did you guys make of the... Because we didn't see these.We were weirdly just, like, watching you all react to them. And then trying to be like, everyone's like, wow, the jury's really mad at the defense. The jury's really mad at the prosecution.Everyone's just, like, making it up based on your momentary expressions. But what did you guys make of the Westville videos? Yeah.

[Juror] (50:32 - 52:43)

And it's funny. That's what... Everyone's like, yeah, they're just looking at our faces.And I'm like, oh, no, I didn't even think about that. I hope my face is on. But yeah, so the videos, I can't remember if it was the...Because there was a set of camcorder, like, walking through the prison. And then there's Incel. I don't remember, like, which we saw first.And you guys were able to see either of those, right? No, not any of them. Okay.I'll try to recall the camcorder footage first. It was essentially, like, what you would think. There's someone, you know, there's guards around them.They're holding the camcorder, and they're, you know, taking him somewhere to go somewhere throughout the prison. And I guess, kind of just reference, like, going into it, they did give us, like, a slight warning of, you know, you're watching the videos today. And going into it, it wasn't as bad as I expected, I guess.So to kind of tell you guys that, for not being able to see it, I expected, just from hearing about them, for it to just be so, so bad. Like, because if they want to show all these to us as bad, like, it's got to be real bad. Personally, I...Because I'm huge on, like, especially Westville is horrible, horrible prisons. And like, thank goodness, they're building a new one. But it's the way it is there is just so bad.And I figured that's what, you know, they're trying to portray in the video. But in these videos, it didn't seem that bad to me. Like, it just looks like a prison, like you'd expect.And while they're walking around, I know one of the times he's, like, in what looked like, like, a small wheelchair thing. It didn't have, like, big wheels, like a wheelchair, just, like, small ones on all four legs. But they were carrying it.They weren't even carrying it, like, four people. And I think they were taking him to get that x-ray. He was getting an x-ray because he was seeing his head on the wall.And he was very, that was probably one of the worst ones, just because he looked so black and blue. Like, his whole face and head was black and blue.

BBM
Quoting RA- " I'm not crazy, I am just acting crazy"

Clemons said Allen would also shout to other inmates, "I'm not crazy, I'm only acting like I'm crazy."

Delphi murders suspect allegedly told psychologist he wanted to apologize to Abby, Libby's families

"I killed Abby and Libby. I am sorry." is what the suspect reportedly told a clinical psychologist while in jail.

abc7chicago.com

 

[Sillybilly]

This thread is closed.

Please continue at Thread #218.