Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #198

[mrjitty]

IIRC, SC, BB, and at least one of the teen girls' from the Freedom Bridge have said they believe the man they saw was the same man from the still photo image taken from the video from Libby's cellphone.

I also think that the two forces (ISP and FBI) on the case were not on the same page about the sketches.

Yes. Interesting if they are allowed in.

 

[Niner]

Had quite a few pages to read here this morning - a BIG Thank You to @Vern , @FrostedGlass & @AugustWest - for the docket updates!

And I want to know - if I have this correct?? 17 jurors? 11 women & 6 men? or back to 16 jurors? 11 women & 5 men??

TIA!

 

[FromGermany1]

That hair in Abby’s hand is going to be an absolute nightmare for the prosecution.

MOO

Now we need to know, if the hair was possibly reddish-brown and "fluffy" .....

 

[shonyakay]

Let the defense team have this short lived last hurrah before the whole truth is revealed come Thursday. That is when we will get down to the real meat and potatoes.

Keep in mind we still haven't seen RA's browser history, his work records, his confessions that contain information ONLY the killer would know, nor have we heard a larger sample of his voice.

Thursday is the day for Abby, Liberty, and Justice for ALL.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

Let the defense team have this short lived last hurrah before the whole truth is revealed come Thursday. That is when we will get down to the real meat and potatoes.

Keep in mind we still haven't seen RA's browser history, his work records, his confessions that contain information ONLY the killer would know, nor have we heard a larger sample of his voice.

Thursday is the day for Abby, Liberty, and Justice for ALL.

Ah yes….twas sworn testimony that killed the defense team’s bombast.

 

[shonyakay]

Ah yes….twas sworn testimony that killed the defense team’s bombast.

Not gonna lie, I had to look up the meaning of bombast. Lol.

Very true indeed though.

 

[FromGermany1]

The controversy over the sketches needs to ends, imo. The purpose of the sketches was to generate leads from the public. They are not meant to be matched to the actual perp to determine if they are exact renditions or otherwise the perp gets to go free.

They are a tool. Whether they served a purpose in this case is a debate, I guess, but the person on trial doesn't need to match the sketch(es) in order to be found guilty by evidence presented in court.

jmo

Okay, but the secrets around it makes me wonder. Is that usual also in other cases?
1 sketch
a second different sketch
the age now different
the height/weight different or even no longer mentioned
the hair color no longer mentioned, afaik
the hat no longer mentioned, afaik
after RA-arrest the second sketch of YBG not taken out of circulation
now for trial the presentation of sketches to jurors forbidden
forbidden to mention, that the sketches are forbidden (!!!)

My goodness.

 

[shonyakay]

Just some of my thoughts regarding the alleged hair in Abby's hand.

Abby had just spent the night at Libby's house the night before, she had just rode in Kelsi's car on the way to the trails, and Kelsi gave Abby a jacket of hers to use. All of these things considered have the potential for hair transfer to have occurred.

 

[FromGermany1]

If Kelsei had that sweatshirt in her car, like a car sweatshirt, there when you need it (I keep a jacket, hat and gloves in my cat in the Winter) the possibilities could be many and random. JMO

As far as we assume, the girls had to cross the creek (water on their clothes/wet hands), they had to undress, they had possibly to redress, they had to climb a riverbank possibly on all fours - I can't imagine, that after that there was a hair left in her hand, that didn't come from the last contact, Abby had, namely her attacker (his head or clothing). IMO

 

[shonyakay]

Whose jacket is this?
Notice she has her hands in the pockets.

 

[shonyakay]

As far as we assume, the girls had to cross the creek (water on their clothes/wet hands), they had to undress, they had possibly to redress, they had to climb a riverbank possibly on all fours - I can't imagine, that after that there was a hair left in her hand, that didn't come from the last contact, Abby had, namely her attacker (his head or clothing). IMO

Wet hands, wet clothes, and redressing sounds exactly like the perfect opportunity to get hair transfer on one's hands.

 

[snarast]

As far as we assume, the girls had to cross the creek (water on their clothes/wet hands), they had to undress, they had possibly to redress, they had to climb a riverbank possibly on all fours - I can't imagine, that after that there was a hair left in her hand, that didn't come from the last contact, Abby had, namely her attacker (his head or clothing). IMO

It’s so hard to visualize this…and I don’t even know the girls…it really gets to me.

 

[maamager]

late to this, but if they had found unknown male dna in either girl’s hand, they would have explicitly stated that. purposefully vague from DT yet again. all jmo

 

[girlhasnoname]

Let the defense team have this short lived last hurrah before the whole truth is revealed come Thursday. That is when we will get down to the real meat and potatoes.

Keep in mind we still haven't seen RA's browser history, his work records, his confessions that contain information ONLY the killer would know, nor have we heard a larger sample of his voice.

Thursday is the day for Abby, Liberty, and Justice for ALL.

I thought opening statements begin on Friday in Delphi?

 

[shonyakay]

I thought opening statements begin on Friday in Delphi?

Is it Friday? My bad.

"Let the defense team have this short lived last hurrah before the whole truth is revealed come Friday. That is when we will get down to the real meat and potatoes.

Keep in mind we still haven't seen RA's browser history, his work records, his confessions that contain information ONLY the killer would know, nor have we heard a larger sample of his voice.

Friday is the day for Abby, Liberty, and Justice for ALL."

Corrected it. Thanks for letting me know.

 

[SouthEnd]

I thought opening statements begin on Friday in Delphi?

Correct, Thursday jurors get sworn in and some pre-trial motions are being heard but tbh even the media are confused atm according to the MS

 

[shonyakay]

Correct, Thursday jurors get sworn in and some pre-trial motions are being heard but tbh even the media are confused atm according to the MS

Yeah. I thought I had originally heard Thursday.

 

[FrostedGlass]

IMO the defense is good at throwing a wrench and people run with it. Reasonable doubt

It's helpful to them that they have been given a lot of wrenches to work with, MOO

 

[statt#1]

I am fully aware of the definition of sexual assault, but thank you. This is a case that so many are divided in their opinions. I will be the first to say... I hate perverts, and especially when children are involved. None of us know what really happened that God awful day and I'm thankful I don't. For me, I cannot; and will not make the leap and pre-convict any man/woman of a crime without proof BARD that they are guilty.

All I am saying is let a jury hear all of the evidence and they can decide if he is in fact guilty... I won't! It's for sure, someone killed Abby and Libby, and hopefully they get it right. All MOO.

I didn't think the question of guilt was being discussed in this exchange as I read through these posts. I'm sorry, I thought the question was one of sexual abuse...or sexual assault. For me, if any man forces a woman, or in this case 2 under age girls to disrobe, that in and and of itself is sexual assault/abuse. It meets the definition.

For me, to attempt to argue A & L were not victims of sexual abuse/assault opens the door to questions relative to their participation in the matter, meaning, they disrobed voluntarily, and not under duress.

My opinion on the matter.

 

[Quim The Extraordinaire]

There has been historical speculation about hair and fiber evidence since these terrible crimes due to cryptic comments by LE and LE-adjacent reps. The speculation ramped up following the release in 2022 of the 2017 search warrant for RL’s property.

“Any and all evidence pertaining to a murder including clothing, forensic evidence, blood (seen and unseen), hair, bodily fluids (seen and unseen), fibers, weapons including guns and cutting instruments, electronic devices used to produce the cellular signals detected by law enforcement in the area of the crime scene, animal hair samples.”

Broadly written, to be sure. The “animal hair samples” mention attracted much interest and speculation.

Links: The partially redacted RL search warrant is available via the media site WISH-TV 8 / Indianapolis. The excerpt above is on page 10 of the linked document, which is stamped “Murder Sheet” as the Murder Sheet podcast first obtained the documentation. Any typos or other errors in the excerpt above are mine.

https://www.wishtv.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/05/LOGAN-WARRANT-final_Redacted.pdf

I’m certainly interested to hear (albeit 2nd hand) the context of the hair found in/on Abby’s hand. Attorneys parse words for nuance and good attorneys weave nuance into their arguments.

MOO.