Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #198

[Deleted member 229974]

It was up to each family.
Abby's family put the date the girls were found.

That's all .. there is nothing else to it.

So was it just a rumor that when Abby was found she still had a pulse but later died?

 

[katydid23]

So was it just a rumor that when Abby was found she still had a pulse but later died?

Imo, it was a rumour. There was reportedly a tremendous pool of blood around A's body. She absolutely bled out quickly. It even says in the ME report something about her dying quickly because of lethal stab wounds.

Besides that, when the bodies were found, there was never an urgent medical response. If she still had a pulse thy would have had a media-vac fly her out of there. Nothing like that happened.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

Abby's graveside monument is engraved with date of death as February 13, 2017. So SAD.

https://images.findagrave.com/photos/2020/119/207166212_6de93ccf-e811-459b-a789-1cedcd9da80c.jpeg?v=1656219359

 

[Tricia]

Here is a great video from Lauren and Dr John, Hidden True Crime.

 

[iamshadow21]

So was it just a rumor that when Abby was found she still had a pulse but later died?

The girls were obviously dead based on what we know from when they were found. The searchers who discovered them did not get close because it was clear they were not alive, and there was no aid they could render.

Their injuries were mortal, to major vessels of the neck, and then they laid in the woods for most of a day. They were dead long before they were found, and probably in full rigor.

MOO

 

[shonyakay]

So was it just a rumor that when Abby was found she still had a pulse but later died?

Thank you for bringng this up.

After I made my long post about the movements on the bridge and I was adding the dates of the girls' births and deaths at the end I noticed the different dates of death listed for each girl.

I was just curious about it because I do remember reading somewhere way back that Abby had suffered longer.

It seems the responses back to me about that question were defensive in nature and I meant nothing sinister by asking it.

 

[iamshadow21]

Thank you for bringng this up.

After I made my long post about the movements on the bridge and I was adding the dates of the girls' births and deaths at the end I noticed the different dates of death listed for each girl.

I was just curious about it because I do remember reading somewhere way back that Abby had suffered longer.

It seems the responses back to me about that question were defensive in nature and I meant nothing sinister by asking it.

Not defensive, it's just been chewed over many times, and that isn't your fault. The families cleared it up because the rumours kept circulating.

MOO

 

[shonyakay]

So was it just a rumor that when Abby was found she still had a pulse but later died?

Just want to reiterate that I have never heard that she had a pulse when found but I did hear that she suffered longer. I seriously hope neither is true.

One thing for sure is Dr. Roland Kohr's testimony details will be extremely hard to hear about and what exactly Abby and Libby suffered through at the hands of a monster.

 

[shonyakay]

Not defensive, it's just been chewed over many times, and that isn't your fault. The families cleared it up because the rumours kept circulating.

MOO

Understandable.

 

[iamshadow21]

Just want to reiterate that I have never heard that she had a pulse when found but I did hear that she suffered longer. I seriously hope neither is true.

One thing for sure is Dr. Roland Kohr's testimony details will be extremely hard to hear about and what exactly Abby and Libby suffered through at the hands of a monster.

Even if she did take longer than Libby to die, her hands were clean of blood and she made no move to get up and move after the injury. I think she was unconscious either before or immediately after the neck injury. Otherwise, she would have instinctively covered the wound if her hands were free, or moved her body as she was bleeding out. From the testimony of the blood spatter expert at the prelim, it doesn't sound like she did either.

MOO

 

[shonyakay]

Even if she did take longer than Libby to die, her hands were clean of blood and she made no move to get up and move after the injury. I think she was unconscious either before or immediately after the neck injury. Otherwise, she would have instinctively covered the wound if her hands were free, or moved her body as she was bleeding out. From the testimony of the blood spatter expert at the prelim, it doesn't sound like she did either.

MOO

I agree Abby had no blood on her hands or sleeves but I thought I read in the testimony that her head was turned in a different direction at some point after her injury due to the blood pattern on her face.

 

[iamshadow21]

I agree Abby had no blood on her hands or sleeves but I thought I read in the testimony that her head was turned in a different direction at some point after her injury due to the blood pattern on her face.

Her head, yes, but the rest of her body did not. Her head could have turned as she lost consciousness, or it could have happened because the killer manhandled her face after death. We don't know at this stage. I'm sure we will get more details at trial about the exact sequence they believe the attack happened in.

MOO

 

[StarryStarryNight]

It could have come from either girl, an animal, hair off of Allen's jacket or a hair off of a jacket Abby was wearing.

Since this was a jury selection statement and not the trial they can throw anything they want out there.

Muddling waters for pre jurors.

It’s mindblowing to me that Indiana allows attorneys to make statements like that and have mini opening statements during jury selection.
You would want jurors to come in fresh and clear minded but how can that possibly happen with this set up.

 

[sunshineray]

So in Lawyer Lee’s new video (she is an approved source for WS) she is stating that Richard Allen also confessed to killing his family and grandchildren.

What do you guys make of this? Do you think there could be any truth behind these confessions?

All just my opinion. (And Lawyer Lees)

Maybe he felt so guilty and his family wouldn't listen to him, were hanging up on him, he had a bad dream? Everyone has bad dreams once in awhile. Considering what he's admitted doing, slaughtering two young girls, his bad dreams could be of the really horrific kind. Just a guess

 

[sunshineray]

Her head, yes, but the rest of her body did not. Her head could have turned as she lost consciousness, or it could have happened because the killer manhandled her face after death. We don't know at this stage. I'm sure we will get more details at trial about the exact sequence they believe the attack happened in.

MOO

We may even get info from RA himself on what occured when. MO

 

[shonyakay]

It’s mindblowing to me that Indiana allows attorneys to make statements like that and have mini opening statements during jury selection.
You would want jurors to come in fresh and clear minded but how can that possibly happen with this set up.

I thought jurors were supposed to base their opinions and verdicts only on what they hear during the trial. This is just jury selection. There should be no preconceived ideas or evidence given to possible jurors before any sworn testimony has been given. Imo.

I have never heard of this before.

 

[Warwick7]

Reading old articles and this popped up:

Feb. 23, 2017

"...investigators say they had recovered DNA evidence from the Delphi crime scene..."

DNA evidence is top priority in Delphi murder investigation

INDIANAPOLIS, Ind.- On Thursday, investigators say they had recovered DNA evidence from the Delphi crime scene where two girls, 13-year-old Abby Williams and 14-year-old Libby German, were found mu…

fox59.com

 

[mrjitty]

So Nick's filing on the sketches seems to lend support to one of my speculations

The eye witnesses won't say RA = BG

Rather I think they will say the man they saw is or likely was the man in the video.

MOO

 

[mrjitty]

Eh....as a member of the Due Process Gang, I'd say Bob Motta does have an credible insider line on information about the case.

Agreed - but the problem with any surrogate is whether the insider info is true.

 

[shonyakay]

IIRC, SC, BB, and at least one of the teen girls' from the Freedom Bridge have said they believe the man they saw was the same man from the still photo image taken from the video from Libby's cellphone.

I also think that the two forces (ISP and FBI) on the case were not on the same page about the sketches.