Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #200

[Bergmann]

Now onto MOO.

One of the many problems (transparency being the biggest issue) of judge Gull not allowing audio or video from the courtroom is that the bonafide journalists given press passes into court have to rely upon notebooks and recording lots of information quickly and accurately, which means that reports from any of the recognised outlets probably won't contain all the facts and also the way they synthesise what's going on and report it will also vary, so we need to be careful before jumping to any conclusions (and that's a good idea anyways in a complex case like this which begins as it should with the legal presumption of innocence until proven otherwise).

A good example from the WishTV blog is reporting that Baldwin said that Allen was gone by 1.30pm when other reporters have focused on his assertion that 'phone's don't lie' and that in RA's case his phone shows he had left by 2.15pm (we await the evidence backing this up to be presented of course).

Other MOO -
The defense has predictably come with things it previously hasn't emphasised or made much of. As above lets see the evidence.

Conversely the prosecution has kept in its opening to things we largely expected - the 3 Bs that Nick has focused the juries attention upon etc.

However what I would dearly love to see now is the mountain of evidence that it has been alleged was held back from the PCA to overwhelmingly prove the state's case in court.

Let's see the truth first, backed by weight of evidence, before justice is decided and dispensed.

For the avoidance of doubt, all MOO.

 

[katydid23]

That is true, but I think some of us were expecting some kind of new bombshellish information (akin to the strand of hair the defense presented)

Was that really a bombshell? Her sister or cousin's hair was found on her hand, as it was in the sleeve of the jacket her sister just gave her to wear? That is somehow a 'bombshell?'

How does that lessen RA's possible guilt in any way?

The D threw that out there in a misleading and deceitful way and you are criticising the state for not doing the same kind of thing themselves? I applaud them for not doing any of that bogus nonsense.

in opening statements to provide some kind of reassurance that they have more. But, we didn't get that. So, the case, in my opinion, does still seem quite weak in terms of a huge gaping hole of reasonable doubt.

As always, JMO.

I disagree. They don't need 'more' they just need to actually prove what they already have. They need to prove that
RA=BG. That might not be a big astounding 'bombshell' like a 'serial killers hair in a clenched fist' or a clan of white power Odinists in the woods.

But they have stayed consistent and unwavering unlike the misleading, inauthentic hollow claims of the defense.

The P has video of the killer. And they have evidence gathered which can show clearly and with certainty that the defendant is the man in the video. That's really all they need. And if you add audio tapes of RA admitting to the crimes, including evidence that could only be known by the killer, that would be BARD, IMO

 

[Vern]

Yes, Yes, and Yes. I keep going back to the ammunition. It is a particular brand. Ammunition cartridges are stamped on the bottom as to caliber and mfr., google it in pictures

Winchester Supreme Elite is the brand of the box retrieved from RA's home. I surmise the brand of round found at the scene to be the same.

Then there is the round count, 9 in one mag, 8 in another, one in chamber of gun, one on dresser....that leaves one missing, assuming a 20 round box of hollow point self defense ammo.

Then there is the 'component' analysis. I surmise that not only ejection/extraction markings will be brought up, but also, a match of the round found at the scene to the rounds in the magazines, the chamber of the firearm, and the box on the dresser, in terms of manufacturer and component analysis (chemical makeup and other characteristics of the powder in the individual rounds/lot of ammunition). We shall see.

You and I have always agreed on these points.

Time will tell.

 

[TTF14]

So I am really trying to understand how the defence saw fit to file that Franks motion accusing Ligget of lying about SCs evidence when Nick has this to say in opening (source Murdersheet). No wonder the Judge triggered them when she found out about the leaked crime scene photos from a guy who turned out to be their trusted consultant.

Just wow.

Because she said that in 2019. In 2017, she said she saw a man in a tan coat who was muddy. Looking forward to hearing her explanation for her changing statements.

As always, JMO, but here's a link:

 

[Vern]

Was that really a bombshell? Her sister or cousin's hair was found on her hand, as it was in the sleeve of the jacket her sister just gave her to wear? That is somehow a 'bombshell?'

...

IMO, turns out that that "bomshell" is a dud.

 

[TTF14]

Was that really a bombshell? Her sister or cousin's hair was found on her hand, as it was in the sleeve of the jacket her sister just gave her to wear? That is somehow a 'bombshell?'

Bombshell is in the eye of the beholder.

As always, JMO.

 

[statt#1]

If I’m reading this right, it looks like the round recovered from the scene is Winchester and Blazer rounds were taken from his loaded magazines.

So I don’t think there’s evidence that matching rounds were recovered from his house, but I’d love to be proven wrong.

_Certificate of Analysis from ISP Laboratory Division – B.pdf

drive.google.com

Thank you for this MassGuy, it appears my theory is likely incorrect, however, after reading the linked certificate of analysis I'm still not 100% certain.

 

[Vern]

They did take his miniature katana with a red tassel; so one ceremonial knife and one utility knife = one for each victim?

They also seized numerous other bladed weapons.

Amongst them a Gerber and numerous multitools inclusive of his milspec Indiana National Guard multitool.

In my miltary experience and use, all of the above are equipped with multiple blades - both straight edged and serrated.

_Search Warrant Return.pdf

drive.google.com

 

[katydid23]

I thought she was some kind of CPS worker? How did she have access to police files to sort through things to find this tip? If I'm understanding correctly.

TIA for any clarification you can provide.

"She returned home from a vacation Tuesday night and signed up Wednesday morning to run the headquarters reception desk."

Apparently she ran the reception desk at ISP. And I think she discovered the filing error---Richard Whitman on Allen Avenue.

I do wonder, did RA himself create that filing error? Did he 'accidentally' say he lived on Allen etc?

 

[TTF14]

"She returned home from a vacation Tuesday night and signed up Wednesday morning to run the headquarters reception desk."

Apparently she ran the reception desk at ISP. And I think she discovered the filing error---Richard Whitman on Allen Avenue.

I do wonder, did RA himself create that filing error? Did he 'accidentally' say he lived on Allen etc?

So someone running the reception desk had access to all the files and tips?

 

[FromGermany1]

"She returned home from a vacation Tuesday night and signed up Wednesday morning to run the headquarters reception desk."

Apparently she ran the reception desk at ISP. And I think she discovered the filing error---Richard Whitman on Allen Avenue.

I do wonder, did RA himself create that filing error? Did he 'accidentally' say he lived on Allen etc?

WHY did she look for it at all? I'm surprised.

 

[TTF14]

WHY did she look for it at all? I'm surprised.

That's a really good question.

As always, JMO.

 

[WildHuncher]

I can't find the post now but yesterday someone compared the amount of bullets and empty ammo box seized in the search of RA's home and all bullets from the empty ammo box were accounted for except one. Presumably the one at the crime scene.

Does anyone else remember seeing this post on yesterday's thread?

I’ve seen something like what you describe. I’m not sure where. The forum posts are flying.

Tallying rounds in the fashion discussed only figures to be meaningful if RA did zero shooting in the five years between the crime and the search of his house.

But it may have happened that way. I used to shoot a lot more than I do now. I once ran through ammo boxes pretty quickly, but things change. It’s probably been five years since I made a loud bang.

 

[steeltowngirl]

Because she said that in 2019. In 2017, she said she saw a man in a tan coat who was muddy. Looking forward to hearing her explanation for her changing statements.

As always, JMO, but here's a link:

At 45:23 the YouTuber says that defense claims that in June 2017 SC didn’t say bloody - what is the source of that contention?

 

[katydid23]

Bob M, it seems, has experience as a Defense Attorney so I have no issue with the DT having him there.

Also, unfortunately... we don't have videos, audio or anything like that so the more that are there as eyes and ears -the merrier.

JMO JMT

There is a problem, IMO. BM hosts a podcast that is breaching gag order by discussing details he gets straight from the defense attorneys. And his podcast makes false accusations against the P. Motta helped make that fake bombshell about the hair explode publicly---and it was fake and meaningless.

The defense is flooding the public with their fake 'bombshells' through Mottas podcast. If he was objective and unbiased that would be another thing altogether.

 

[TTF14]

At 45:23 the YouTuber says that defense claims that in June 2017 SC didn’t say bloody - what is the source of that contention?

I don't know. We'll have to wait to find out when she gets on the stand I guess. Maybe her original interview?

As always, JMO.

 

[MassGuy]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1847648213697708260

 

[katydid23]

Just a thought that popped into my head. Why would he let Abby redress herself if he intended to kill and leave them there?

"undoing" ?

 

[steeltowngirl]

WHY did she look for it at all? I'm surprised.

Carter said he believes the killer lives in, works in or frequents the Delphi area, but he declined to elaborate on why he believes that.

"One day I'll be able to tell you. I can't wait for that day," Carter said. "We are doing everything within our power ... and when we run out of tips, we're going to start over again."

Witness in Delphi double murder likely afraid to come forward, investigator says

It's been more than two years since young Abby Williams and Libby German were found dead in Delphi, Indiana, but investigators believe they're close to finding their killer.

6abc.com

 

[MassGuy]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1847649099853562025