Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #200

[otto]

Brown said he was five feet from Libby and Abby's bodies. "I stood there facing away from them," he said. Then, police came.

Brown said you would not have been able to see the bodies from the water. He also noted that he did not have a gun on him.

The families of the girls cried in the courtroom after hearing Brown's testimony.

Delphi Girls Murdered | wthr.com

IIRC, the defence said during opening statements that people searched the area where the bodies were found on Feb 13 and did not find them. Then they searched that area on Feb 14 and did find them. This defence statement intends to suggest that bodies were placed there after searchers left on the evening of Feb 13.

Today's testimony explains how that statement is irrelevant. They were not visible from the water. The bodies were 50 feet from shore. It sounds like they were near the bottom of the steep ravine.

"Mears called him to say he got a call that Shane Haygood had found clothing and asked Brown to check the area. Brown parked near the cemetery and talked to a relative of Libby's family.

During his testimony, Brown told the jury, “First I thought they were mannequins.” He then began crying as he told jurors he realized, “We found ‘em.” Brown said he was five feet from Libby and Abby's bodies. "I stood there facing away from them," he said. Then, police came.

Brown said you would not have been able to see the bodies from the water."

Witness weeps as he recounts finding Abby and Libby's bodies | Day 2 of Delphi murders trial for suspect Richard Allen

Seven years after Libby German and Abby Williams were killed, the trial continues for the man accused of murdering them.

www.wthr.com

 

[TTF14]

Lawyer Lee will be telling us what happened today, live in 6 minutes:

 

[Emma Peel]

It's their job. It looks like they're certainly making an impression on the local Fox News channel. It's all about clicks and revenue generated and the defense knows that. They've got Fox now breathlessly reporting on the mysterious unidentified hair found in Libby's hand.

They only have to convince 1 juror.

Lots of publicity and conspiracy theories during the trial also makes it potentially easier to win on appeal. They're playing to the potential jury pool that will hear an appeal several years from now.

Appellate Courts do not have juries. Just a panel of esteemed and experienced senior judges. And they can only consider what's on the four corners of the written pages of the pleadings, printed exhibits, and the written trial transcript. No audio for their review.

JMHO

 

[MassGuy]

That's great. I wonder what they will be doing. Maybe leaf peeping? It's probably beautiful in some parts there right now, I would imagine.

As always, JMO.

In other (sequestered) rials they've taken them to the movies and out to dinner; things like that too.

 

[ClearAhead]

They tried numerous times to get his out of there.
He was being treated, according to the reports. Were they wrong to trust he was getting good medical treatment?

Perhaps he was indeed getting good medical treatment and the confession were truthful?

If the D weren’t aware of the confessions, then his wife and mother were keeping it a secret from them. That’s a curious scenario, we’ll see how it plays out.

 

[Deleted member 229974]

Yes it would be!

Unfortunately, evidence is only available for viewing by credentialed media for 15 minutes at the close of day! I'm hoping at least one looked at the photo of the Nikes shown to the jurors today, and will Tweet if it was a pair or a single shoe! Lawyer Lee channel hoped to memorialize the evidence after day 1 on Friday and was turned away -- she's not credentialed MSM.

What does the 15 minutes limit mean?

 

[BUF]

Do we know what cell provider Libby had and what the service was like back then? Same with RA?

During cross-examination, the defense also asked about Brown about how sound travels on the trails. He testified that he could hear fine out there and he also had cell service where he found the bodies.

Delphi murders trial: Jurors hear from ex-police chief, man who found bodies of 2 teen girls

Richard Allen is accused of killing teenagers Abby Williams and Libby German near a hiking trail back in 2017.

6abc.com

 

[TTF14]

Do we know what cell provider Libby had and what the service was like back then? Same with RA?

During cross-examination, the defense also asked about Brown about how sound travels on the trails. He testified that he could hear fine out there and he also had cell service where he found the bodies.

Delphi murders trial: Jurors hear from ex-police chief, man who found bodies of 2 teen girls

Richard Allen is accused of killing teenagers Abby Williams and Libby German near a hiking trail back in 2017.

6abc.com

I think she had AT&T.

As always, JMO.

 

[TTF14]

What does the 15 minutes limit mean?

Probably just an effort to keep things moving?

As always, JMO.

 

[Seattle1]

I can't tell you how many times I've heard that description of a body. I was watching a true crime show last week and someone called police when they saw a body floating in water. They said that they weren't sure if it was a human or a "dummy".

I've seen quite a few dead people (natural deaths), and their bodies always looked almost impossibly pale to me. So between not wanting to believe what you're seeing, and what you're seeing not looking quite like a normal human, I think that explains why we hear that so often.

And then add the fact that these two girls were drained of their blood-- were they not nearly decapitated?

 

[FrostedGlass]

Perhaps he was indeed getting good medical treatment and the confession were truthful?

If the D weren’t aware of the confessions, then his wife and mother were keeping it a secret from them. That’s a curious scenario, we’ll see how it plays out.

That's not my opinion but I agree we'll have to wait and see what it is that only the killer knows. Too bad he didn't tell them that before they put him in prison.

 

[MassGuy]

They obviously thought they had enough evidence to convict him before he ever began confessing, so the confessions are more gravy on top of the main course.

They’re important no doubt, and very well could be a major part of the jury’s decision, but they believed they had him already.

 

[BUF]

Lawyer Lee will be telling us what happened today, live in 6 minutes:

According to Lawyer Lee it was asked over and over who would walk on this old (rackity) bridge and people said young people and teens…..so wouldn’t this be a place for an abductor looking for prey to go on a school day off?

 

[wastelands_]

Exactly. BM is not at the trial in his capacity as a defese attorney.

He is there in his capacity as a podcaster ... ergo should be treated as such and subject to the same "Court Rules" as the rest of them are.

Is there a way anyone can actually report this to the judge/court officials? Forgive me if I’m wrong - I’m not too well versed on how American courts work

 

[MassGuy]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1847784600426172588

 

[snooptroop88]

Correct!!! I know we are all interested in this, but it is a court proceeding. It's not designed to be the blockbuster hit of the movies. I am glad the prosecution is cleanly stating their case and facts. Not trying to weirdly drop "bombshells". This is real life. The bombshell here is that 2 little girls went for a walk and ended up with their throats slashed. No more "drama" is needed. Unfortunately, the defense is nothing but drama.

And yeah. Before my post keeps getting replied to saying "source", it's clearly my opinion. Based on basic facts of this absolutely horrible case.

The P imo doesn't woo the drama, they realize the drama is unfortunately already inherent to the crimes themselves, and it's ghastly. The fact that the P delivered a straightforward and understated opening statement for me speaks to their credibility and I'm largely expecting the same tone from them throughout the trial, with exceptions when they cannot contain their horror at the CS. They respect the victims and their dignity.

What are the five shoes?

I count three shoes. Abby was wearing her own 2 shoes. Libby was not wearing any shoes, and one was found underneath Abby with the phone. And the other was down by the creek, according to everything I've gleaned.

I'm completely confused on the clothes and shoes. I've heard jeans, I've heard sweatpants, sweatshirts, tee shirts, three shoes I've heard all different combinations. Does anyone have what they view as a reliable breakdown of the clothing items and shoes? Who was wearing what, what items were where?

 

[MiniMoo]

That's not my opinion but I agree we'll have to wait and see what it is that only the killer knows. Too bad he didn't tell them that before they put him in prison.

Has anyone ever speculated about what it could be that only the killer would know?

Never really thought about it until now...

 

[MassGuy]

Has anyone ever speculated about what it could be that only the killer would know?

Never really thought about it until now...

Specifically how the bodies were posed, any items he removed, placement of specific items of clothing, specific injuries, murder weapon (s) and how this all occurred. It really could be any number of things, but it's got to be something that he couldn't guess, or know from rumors circulating around the time of those confessions (in order to have maximum effect).

 

[katydid23]

There is a huge difference between hearing someone yelling out people’s names and screams.

A scream is a very distinct sound

IMO.

If someone is holding a gun to your head, are you screaming? If someone is holding a gun to your best friends head, are you screaming?

Once the stabbing begins and you are in total shock already from the kidnapping, letting out an actual scream probably never happens. I have my doubts that any real screaming was allowed to happen. They were both slit at the neck. That may have been the first wounds, which would have silenced them both quickly.

BG has L stripped naked, as he holds the gun to A's head, which forces L to comply. Then BG suddenly slits A's throat, shocking L, who starts to run, but he catches her from behind and slits her throat. So from then on, he can continue his violence, but no one is screaming. IMO

 

[TTF14]

The P imo doesn't woo the drama, they realize the drama is unfortunately already inherent to the crimes themselves, and it's ghastly. The fact that the P delivered a straightforward and understated opening statement for me speaks to their credibility and I'm largely expecting the same tone from them throughout the trial, with exceptions when they cannot contain their horror at the CS. They respect the victims and their dignity.

I'm completely confused on the clothes and shoes. I've heard jeans, I've heard sweatpants, sweatshirts, tee shirts, three shoes I've heard all different combinations. Does anyone have what they view as a reliable breakdown of the clothing items and shoes? Who was wearing what, what items were where?

I will try.

When the girls went missing, they were described as wearing:

Libby - Tie Dye T-shirt, gray sweatpants with black lettering, and tennis shoes (I don't remember if they said the color). I don't think any description was given of her hair (i.e. ponytail or not).
Abby - Skinny jeans, black Chuck Taylors, pinkish T-shirt, Gray zip-up hoodie over it (see pic on bridge), hair in bun.

It wasn't in the original description, but at some point later (I recall hearing it several months later), they also said that the girls took sweatshirts from Kelsi's car when she dropped them off. No description of the sweatshirts was given.

When the bodies were found, Libby was not clothed at all, and Abby was wearing a black Delphi swim sweatshirt, jeans that were presumably baggy because they are saying they were Libby's jeans and Libby was bigger than Abby, who was quite tiny, and her own Chuck Taylors. I believe they have said Abby was also wearing her own underwear, two bras (although I don't think that has come out in testimony yet), and no socks.

Libby's one shoe and her phone were found underneath Abby.

Today we heard that one of the searchers found Libby's T-shirt and a pair of Libby's Nike sneakers in the creek while searching for the girls. This is what a WishTV article said. The same article also said that the jurors were shown a photo of Libby's T-shirt and shoes. (Plural)

If I'm missing anything, someone please correct me.

As always, JMO.