Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #200

[twall]

Well that clears that up.
The Defense gets a seat allotment. They can have whoever they want in the seats assigned to them.

What I can't figure out is ... why does MS even care who's at the hearing? It's a public hearing.
Why would anyone care who's at the hearing?

Me, I'm all about the technical happenings at trial.
So, I'll choose the best, highest skilled, most trial- knowledgeable critical-thinking reporters to follow so I can understand the arguments/testimony/facts/evidence that are discussed/revealed at trial.

I'm a no-drama mama; a just-the-facts gal. I don't give a crap who's in the gallery.

Well, I care that in the gallery there are skilled public reporters, able to provide fact-based reporting and reasoned trial commentary.

I don't mind some color commentary but if anyone reporting tries to turn this trial into soap opera garbage; or inserts themselves into the story ... they're booted off my source list.

JMHO

I don't know what the exact words TMS used about BM's seat because I refuse to listen to them but I have seen people posting he was sitting at the defense TABLE with the defendant and defense team which I knew was absolutely incorrect because for anyone to sit there who is not an attorney of record they had to ask the court for permission. State asked for an extra person, defense objected, court granted State's Motion so state can have Mullin and Holeman sitting with them and defense has Baker, not Motta!
JMO

 

[MassGuy]

If someone is holding a gun to your head, are you screaming? If someone is holding a gun to your best friends head, are you screaming?

Once the stabbing begins and you are in total shock already from the kidnapping, letting out an actual scream probably never happens. I have my doubts that any real screaming was allowed to happen. They were both slit at the neck. That may have been the first wounds, which would have silenced them both quickly.

BG has L stripped naked, as he holds the gun to A's head, which forces L to comply. Then BG suddenly slits A's throat, shocking L, who starts to run, but he catches her from behind and slits her throat. So from then on, he can continue his violence, but no one is screaming. IMO

"You scream and I'll shoot you." [Racks slide]

It is possible that there was screaming, and no one heard it. Or that scenario you put forth is exactly how it went down.

 

[katydid23]

I don't doubt she did. It seems the state simply chose not to test the hair??

The State DID test the hair. That's how they determined it was a female closely related to Libby.

But to continue the Genealogy Testing takes time and money. Once they realised it was a sister or cousin of the victim, was it really a priority to figure out who exactly it was? They were not the killer and it was more important to move on to higher priority issues.

 

[TTF14]

I don't know what the exact words TMS used about BM's seat because I refuse to listen to them but I have seen people posting he was sitting at the defense TABLE with the defendant and defense team which I knew was absolutely incorrect because for anyone to sit there who is not an attorney of record they had to ask the court for permission. State asked for an extra person, defense objected, court granted State's Motion so state can have Mullin and Holeman sitting with them and defense has Baker, not Motta!
JMO

Sounds like either MS put out false info. or it was interpreted falsely.

As always, JMO.

 

[TTF14]

The State DID test the hair. That's how they determined it was a female closely related to Libby.

But to continue the Genealogy Testing takes time and money. Once they realised it was a sister or cousin of the victim, was it really a priority to figure out who exactly it was? They were not the killer and it was more important to move on to higher priority issues.

Do you have a link for this (that the State did test the hair)?

Thank you.

 

[snooptroop88]

I will try.

When the girls went missing, they were described as wearing:

Libby - Tie Dye T-shirt, gray sweatpants with black lettering, and tennis shoes (I don't remember if they said the color). I don't think any description was given of her hair (i.e. ponytail or not).
Abby - Skinny jeans, black Chuck Taylors, pinkish T-shirt, Gray zip-up hoodie over it (see pic on bridge), hair in bun.

It wasn't in the original description, but at some point later (I recall hearing it several months later), they also said that the girls took sweatshirts from Kelsi's car when she dropped them off. No description of the sweatshirts was given.

When the bodies were found, Libby was not clothed at all, and Abby was wearing a black Delphi swim sweatshirt, jeans that were presumably baggy because they are saying they were Libby's jeans and Libby was bigger than Abby, who was quite tiny, and her own Chuck Taylors. I believe they have said Abby was also wearing her own underwear, two bras (although I don't think that has come out in testimony yet), and no socks.

Libby's one shoe and her phone were found underneath Abby.

Today we heard that one of the searchers found Libby's T-shirt and a pair of Libby's Nike sneakers in the creek while searching for the girls. This is what a WishTV article said. The same article also said that the jurors were shown a photo of Libby's T-shirt and shoes. (Plural)

If I'm missing anything, someone please correct me.

As always, JMO.

Much thanks @TTF14

​

 

[statt#1]

The State DID test the hair. That's how they determined it was a female closely related to Libby.

But to continue the Genealogy Testing takes time and money. Once they realised it was a sister or cousin of the victim, was it really a priority to figure out who exactly it was? They were not the killer and it was more important to move on to higher priority issues.

I totally agree here, there simply was no reason to further test the hair.

 

[Megnut]

Has anyone ever speculated about what it could be that only the killer would know?

Never really thought about it until now...

Anything that fits a piece LE was missing:

Just exactly which bladed instrument was used....

Potentially an explanation for why, if it exists, Libby's phone may have stopped in place for a period of time before moving again, prior to movement stopping altogether.

Why that day, why those girls

Anything that explains, confirms why the victims may have been treated differently

Not wanting his family to see (CS) photos and reject him

Any mention of his phone use could be a gateway to confession.

Any utterance of what he intended to do or what went wrong (as he might see it)

A lot of ways to expose intimate knowledge of a crime scene.

JMO

 

[Vaderman]

Just a little friendly reminder, because the news seems to always forget:

ABBY MATTERED TOO

 

[katydid23]

Well that clears that up.
The Defense gets a seat allotment. They can have whoever they want in the seats assigned to them.

What I can't figure out is ... why does MS even care who's at the hearing? It's a public hearing.
Why would anyone care who's at the hearing?

I care who is sitting with the defense team, if that person is doing podcasts every night and discussing the trial.

BM has been hyping up false and misleading 'bombshells' which are designed to amp up the chaos and confusion. Having him sit with the defense team is pretty revealing, imo.

Me, I'm all about the technical happenings at trial.
So, I'll choose the best, highest skilled, most trial- knowledgeable critical-thinking reporters to follow so I can understand the arguments/testimony/facts/evidence that are discussed/revealed at trial.

I'm a no-drama mama; a just-the-facts gal. I don't give a crap who's in the gallery.

Well, I care that in the gallery there are skilled public reporters, able to provide fact-based reporting and reasoned trial commentary.

I don't mind some color commentary but if anyone reporting tries to turn this trial into soap opera garbage; or inserts themselves into the story ... they're booted off my source list.

JMHO

" but if anyone reporting tries to turn this trial into soap opera garbage; or inserts themselves into the story ... they're booted off my source list."

The above statement describes BM, in my opinion. He is the conduit from the Defense to the social media you-tubers that are creating false narratives in the public.

He KNEW that hair belonged to one of Libby's female relatives. Yet he hyped it up, confirmed it was HUMAN hair, and implied it was a clump of unknown hair in a dead girls fist, that did not match the defendant.

That was a misleading rumour, hyped up and rolled out by BM and his crew, in order to turn public opinion against the P.

BM is full of dirty tricks. IMO

 

[katydid23]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1847766748873060748

I want to know what their questions were.

 

[Dutch77]

Sounds like either MS put out false info. or it was interpreted falsely.

As always, JMO.

MS is coming across jealous since the judge denied their media passes and spending far too much time on this instead of the trial. Now isn’t the time for unnecessary drama not about the trial. It’s doing the girls an injustice.

 

[MiniMoo]

Specifically how the bodies were posed, any items he removed, placement of specific items of clothing, specific injuries, murder weapon (s) and how this all occurred. It really could be any number of things, but it's got to be something that he couldn't guess, or know from rumors circulating around the time of those confessions.

Also, why their clothes were discarded in the creek like that although it seems it may be just one girls really as only one of the two was fully undressed. JMT.

The Mirror US
"Williams was found wearing Liberty's clothing, while other articles of the girls clothing was found dumped in a nearby creek, McLeland added."

Source: Delphi Trial Reveals Bone Chilling...

I cannot wait until the confessions are revealed.

JMO MOO JMT

 

[otto]

I will try.

When the girls went missing, they were described as wearing:

Libby - Tie Dye T-shirt, gray sweatpants with black lettering, and tennis shoes (I don't remember if they said the color). I don't think any description was given of her hair (i.e. ponytail or not).
Abby - Skinny jeans, black Chuck Taylors, pinkish T-shirt, Gray zip-up hoodie over it (see pic on bridge), hair in bun.

It wasn't in the original description, but at some point later (I recall hearing it several months later), they also said that the girls took sweatshirts from Kelsi's car when she dropped them off. No description of the sweatshirts was given.

When the bodies were found, Libby was not clothed at all, and Abby was wearing a black Delphi swim sweatshirt, jeans that were presumably baggy because they are saying they were Libby's jeans and Libby was bigger than Abby, who was quite tiny, and her own Chuck Taylors. I believe they have said Abby was also wearing her own underwear, two bras (although I don't think that has come out in testimony yet), and no socks.

Libby's one shoe and her phone were found underneath Abby.

Today we heard that one of the searchers found Libby's T-shirt and a pair of Libby's Nike sneakers in the creek while searching for the girls. This is what a WishTV article said. The same article also said that the jurors were shown a photo of Libby's T-shirt and shoes. (Plural)

If I'm missing anything, someone please correct me.

As always, JMO.

Thank you for the update!

Abby was wearing Libby's pants over-top of her skinny jeans? Sounds like it, since the skinny jeans are not mentioned as found elsewhere. They weren't in Deer Creek with the tye-dyed t-shirt.

The suspect must have told Libby to get undressed, and told Abby to put on Libby's pants. They wouldn't to that without being told with a gun pointed at one of them. Maybe the girls believed that if Abby was wearing more clothes, she would be safe, and Libby would do what he wanted sexually, then they could go home.

How far apart were they found?

Was Abby's throat cut first? No way to tell, more curious about sequence of events. It sounds like Libby was the target ... especially if Abby was still wearing her skinny jeans.

 

[BUF]

I want to know what their questions were.

I do too

 

[sunshineray]

I don't know what the exact words TMS used about BM's seat because I refuse to listen to them but I have seen people posting he was sitting at the defense TABLE with the defendant and defense team which I knew was absolutely incorrect because for anyone to sit there who is not an attorney of record they had to ask the court for permission. State asked for an extra person, defense objected, court granted State's Motion so state can have Mullin and Holeman sitting with them and defense has Baker, not Motta!
JMO

He was sitting in the defense seating immediately behind the table. Not the family's seats, the defense's seats.

The Delphi Murders: Richard Allen On Trial: Day One: Opening Statements and More

 

[katydid23]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1847784600426172588

View attachment 539019

GREAT questions. Sounds like they really are paying attention.

Although it could be just one person asking all the questions. I hope that's not the case. I want everyone engaged and involved.

 

[TTF14]

I care who is sitting with the defense team, if that person is doing podcasts every night and discussing the trial.

BM has been hyping up false and misleading 'bombshells' which are designed to amp up the chaos and confusion. Having him sit with the defense team is pretty revealing, imo.

" but if anyone reporting tries to turn this trial into soap opera garbage; or inserts themselves into the story ... they're booted off my source list."

The above statement describes BM, in my opinion. He is the conduit from the Defense to the social media you-tubers that are creating false narratives in the public.

He KNEW that hair belonged to one of Libby's female relatives. Yet he hyped it up, confirmed it was HUMAN hair, and implied it was a clump of unknown hair in a dead girls fist, that did not match the defendant.

That was a misleading rumour, hyped up and rolled out by BM and his crew, in order to turn public opinion against the P.

BM is full of dirty tricks. IMO

I assume you watch him to have such strong opinions about his content. I watch him all the time and just don't have the same opinions. In fact, I get sick of him saying he doesn't know if RA is guilty or innocent and doesn't care, but only cares about procedure, constitutional rights etc. In my opinion, he's a fence sitter. Not once have I ever heard him say he knows (or even thinks) RA is innocent. He says, all the time, he doesn't know.

As far as where he sits in the courtroom, it would be a bit odd if a career defense attorney sat with the prosecutor. And as far his reporting about the trial, he's not divulging private convos with the defense team in his daily synopsis. Maybe, as experienced defense attorneys themselves, they just respect him and his career so they invited him to sit behind their table.

If he, or anyone, does anything to start trying to sway the jury, that will be a whole 'nother issue. As of now, he's just a guy in the courtroom watching the trial and telling us about it.

As always, everything I've just written is all my opinion.

 

[TTF14]

He was sitting in the defense seating immediately behind the table. Not the family's seats, the defense's seats.

The Delphi Murders: Richard Allen On Trial: Day One: Opening Statements and More

Well, that's different than what the MS said (as I understand....didn't listen)....that he was AT the table. Is there something illegal about where he was sitting?

As always, JMO.

 

[TTF14]

Thank you for the update!

Abby was wearing Libby's pants over-top of her skinny jeans? Sounds like it, since the skinny jeans are not mentioned as found elsewhere. They weren't in Deer Creek with the tye-dyed t-shirt.

The suspect must have told Libby to get undressed, and told Abby to put on Libby's pants. They wouldn't to that without being told with a gun pointed at one of them. Maybe the girls believed that if Abby was wearing more clothes, she would be safe, and Libby would do what he wanted sexually, then they could go home.

How far apart were they found?

Was Abby's throat cut first? No way to tell, more curious about sequence of events. It sounds like Libby was the target ... especially if Abby was still wearing her skinny jeans.

That, I don't know. it hasn't been discussed or mentioned in documents that I have seen. Maybe it will come out in the trial.

As always, JMO.