Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #202

[MassGuy]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1849282457771577618

 

[photographer4]

They sure are asking a lot of questions. Love it.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1849277450724745261

Shame he didn’t tell us what the 16 questions were moo.

 

[Web_Sleuth]

Andrea Burkharts live YT mentions she believes Abby could have been “washed” because her hands were very clean even though she would have taken longer to die. (As in didn’t grab her neck like Libby possibly did) I was thinking I had heard or read that Abby’s hands were inside the sweatshirt - not able to grab anything??

She makes some good points in her video. IMO

 

[iamshadow21]

I did review the few mins provided by the person I replied to. Ty! Lawyer Lee says the issue of a photo from Lg’s funeral being on the phone was brought up in cross and was very quick. I wonder if we may learn more about this? I just can’t imagine Le would hand back crime scene evidence to the family!!?

I think in the age of cloud based storage and family accounts for digital devices, this is probably a non-issue. I can't imagine that at the age of fourteen Libby was on anything but a family account. She wasn't old enough to have her own pay cheque or to sign a contract for an independent account for a phone. That her phone ended up with an image from her funeral was probably something as simple as it being handled for processing outside a Faraday cage. It connected to the network and synced.

MOO

 

[MassGuy]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1849283311698411841

 

[MadMcGoo]

As a reminder:

Anything you post as fact should be accompanied by an approved source link.

Many members have been following this case from the beginning, and others may have recently joined the discussion. For those just joining, please read through or search the previous threads if another member posts information that seems new to you. There’s a chance (with 202 existing discussion threads for this case) that it’s been previously discussed and/or sourced.

If, after doing so, you aren’t able to find a source, please ask the OP to provide an approved link. If the OP can’t or doesn’t provide a link, then report the post for us to review.

Thanks!!
Mad

 

[StarryStarryNight]

DBM: didn’t do my homework

 

[dkaras]

They sure are asking a lot of questions. Love it.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1849277450724745261

This IMO is very problematic for the P. I'm surprised TBH, I'm still expecting some link via the a-shots or other online grossness.

I have questions... apologies if I've missed any answers (not directly to you MassGuy, just jumping off your post)

Out of all these devices, are they all from after the crime? Are some from before, then none during, then some after? Or just devices from RA's life from whenever til his arrest?

I have devices from years ago til recently, mostly saved because of pictures on the device that I've been meaning to copy over and just haven't got around to it. I have a few of my ex's devices (he passed away earlier this year) that my son brought to me in case there are pictures we'd want and he didn't want to deal with it. So I completely understand saving old devices. Just curious if these 23 devices included some from that timeframe or are conspicuously missing.

And also, is this guy on the stand the person that should be asked?

 

[aliciacstone]

Somebody stated the name Richard Allen hasn’t even been mentioned in any testimony and that is true. Instead, in a deliberate and methodical way the P are establishing the timeline including various witnesses IDing the likeness of the photo of the man on the bridge. We’ve just passed February 14, 2017. IMO the way the P is moving forward the timeline is ingenious, by presenting seven years of information in chronological order so it’s easy for the jury to understand.

Still yet to come, linking BG = RA including his arrest and confessions.

I was thinking the same thing. Laying it out in chronological order or maybe bringing the evidence most likely to poke holes in first. I am still catching up on what happened today in court but it seems investigators would have had everything(autopsy/clothes/witnesses/bullet/cellphone data) brought forward to the jury so far back in 2017 before there were ever charges against RA. Something more significant has to exist to have lead to the arrest years later. I think it’s strategic and we will eventually find out… or at least I hope. These girls and their families deserve the closure and peace.

Also sorry if there has been further comments since this with more info from today. I’m currently catching up in order of where I left off!

 

[Vern]

I don't see his name on that list.

I'll link it again today:

Note: On October 10th, Judge Gull entered a Transport Order for IDOC Inmate, but the single upload Order contains only the Order for James Haas thus far:

- James Haas (IDOC Inmate #250845). Motion for Transport: _Motion for Transport of IDOC Inmate.pdf
- Kegan A. Kline (IDOC Inmate #294614). Motion for Transport: not yet granted(??)/uploaded
- James B. Chadwell (IDOC Inmate #286303). Motion for Transport: not yet granted(??)/uploaded
- Ricci D. Davis (IDOC Inmate #114393). Motion for Transport: not yet granted(??)/uploaded

You need to compare the Inmate Numbers with those on the Fien'X tweet that you quoted.

You can confirm Indiana Inmates by their Inmate # here. Enter the DOC# as above quoted block and the database will give your their names for confirmation purposes:

Indiana Incarcerated Database Search

Inmate James Haas, IDOC Inmate #250845 is the only one so far ORDERED (as per link at end of his line above).

 

[iamshadow21]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1849282457771577618

Well, there's more details for anyone wondering about the wounds.

Given that the 'small' wound to Abby was 2.75"x2+"... I think we can all agree the three "very large" wounds to Libby were very grievous indeed by anyone's standards. They'd have to be just to involve three of the four major blood vessels of the throat.

MOO

 

[MassGuy]

I was thinking the same thing. Laying it out in chronological order or maybe bringing the evidence most likely to poke holes in first. I am still catching up on what happened today in court but it seems investigators would have had everything(autopsy/clothes/witnesses/bullet/cellphone data) brought forward to the jury so far back in 2017 before there were ever charges against RA. Something more significant has to exist to have lead to the arrest years later. I think it’s strategic and we will eventually find out… or at least I hope. These girls and their families deserve the closure and peace.

Also sorry if there has been further comments since this with more info from today. I’m currently catching up in order of where I left off!

Unfortunately, if something more significant existed at the time of his arrest it would have been in the probable cause affidavit. The reason for the arrest years later is that an early interview with him was misfiled. When they found it, they realized they had someone they needed to follow up with, as he admitted to being there that day. A follow-up interview led to Allen revealing more information, to include the fact that he was dressed like BG that day. That, coupled with the timeline provided by Allen and witnesses, led to the search warrant that resulted in the gun being found that matched the unspent round.

So we have that, likely information developed after his arrest that we are not aware of, and the dozens of confessions.

That round is likely as close to a smoking gun as we are going to get, and it's something that is going to be hotly disputed.

 

[MiniMoo]

This IMO is very problematic for the P. I'm surprised TBH, I'm still expecting some link via the a-shots or other online grossness.

I have questions... apologies if I've missed any answers (not directly to you MassGuy, just jumping off your post)

Out of all these devices, are they all from after the crime? Are some from before, then none during, then some after? Or just devices from RA's life from whenever til his arrest?

I have devices from years ago til recently, mostly saved because of pictures on the device that I've been meaning to copy over and just haven't got around to it. I have a few of my ex's devices (he passed away earlier this year) that my son brought to me in case there are pictures we'd want and he didn't want to deal with it. So I completely understand saving old devices. Just curious if these 23 devices included some from that timeframe or are conspicuously missing.

And also, is this guy on the stand the person that should be asked?

I was thinking 23 devices is a lot, but maybe not if some of them are dinosaurs or not new.

I wonder how relevant or not they have become in regards to this crime.

JMO MOO JMT

 

[Deleted member 229974]

Disagree. Evidence has to relate to the crime. Sticks in a forest on or near a body do not directly relate to ritual. Is there a ritual that involves kidnapping two girls, stripping them, possibly forcing one to wear the other's clothes, slitting their necks one or more times, nearly decapitating one of the victims, and tossing a couple of sticks on their bodies?

Some ritual involves sticks, not all sticks involve ritual. How does this crime scene illustration represent ritual - keeping in mind that this is a forest covered with sticks, branches, leaves and blood. Numbers represent possible movements of Libby as she was murdered.

Red = Abby
Yellow = Libby
View attachment 540059

I look at this and all I can say is, why? What was the reason or the motivation behind someone planning to do this? Have they done it before on other victims? I think it would indicate experience and confidence to take on two random people at once, in a somewhat public setting. IMO

 

[Gemmie]

Well, there's more details for anyone wondering about the wounds.

Given that the 'small' wound to Abby was 2.75"x2+"... I think we can all agree the three "very large" wounds to Libby were very grievous indeed by anyone's standards. They'd have to be just to involve three of the four major blood vessels of the throat.

MOO

They were very grievous by my standards.

Per the diagram, both of Libby's carotid arteries were severed. Her left jugular vein was also severed.

'I don't know' | Investigator describes unexplained gap in data from Libby's phone | Day 5 of Delphi murders trial for suspect Richard Allen

Seven years after Libby German and Abby Williams were killed, the trial continues for the man accused of murdering them.

www.wthr.com

 

[Seattle1]

Delphi Murders Trial: Day 5 | 'Bridge Guy' sighting, autopsy photos, and digital forensics

Day 5 of the Delphi Murders trial included testimony from a witness who claims to have seen "Bridge Guy" on the day Abby Williams and Libby German went missing.

www.wrtv.com

10/23/24

The autopsy revealed Williams had a five to six-centimeter-long wound (approximately 2 inches long) on the left side of her neck, however, Dr. Kohr said it was not a deep cut, "only an inch deep" in the doctor's words. He stated there was some skin damage to the right side which he believes suggests the cut was made from right to left.

[..]

Dr. Kohr testified he did not see any crime scene photos until this year, which was after his reports had been issued.

The doctor could not determine the exact type of weapon used or the length of the blade, but he said "anything from a pocketknife to a kitchen knife to Abby. (There is) no way to tell if it was right or left-handed."

 

[MiniMoo]

I look at this and all I can say is, why? What was the reason or the motivation behind someone planning to do this? Have they done it before on other victims? I think it would indicate experience and confidence to take on two random people at once, in a somewhat public setting. IMO

I would go with experience plus doing it during broad daylight was totally brazen.

JMO MOO JMT

 

[MassGuy]

This IMO is very problematic for the P. I'm surprised TBH, I'm still expecting some link via the a-shots or other online grossness.

I have questions... apologies if I've missed any answers (not directly to you MassGuy, just jumping off your post)

Out of all these devices, are they all from after the crime? Are some from before, then none during, then some after? Or just devices from RA's life from whenever til his arrest?

I have devices from years ago til recently, mostly saved because of pictures on the device that I've been meaning to copy over and just haven't got around to it. I have a few of my ex's devices (he passed away earlier this year) that my son brought to me in case there are pictures we'd want and he didn't want to deal with it. So I completely understand saving old devices. Just curious if these 23 devices included some from that timeframe or are conspicuously missing.

And also, is this guy on the stand the person that should be asked?

We don't know when the devices were purchased, but logically, most of them would probably be before the crime. The only one that is conspicuously missing (that we know of) is the phone he would have had on him during the murder. No clue if the jurors asked him about the dates of those devices, but we're only getting a fraction of the information here so who knows.

So the missing device is an interesting nugget, and the expert on the stand also said that the only connection they could find to Libby or Abby is internet searches. We heard nothing further about that, as it's likely beyond his purview, but that's something I think could play a major role here, depending on the timing, frequency, and specificity of those searches.

 

[MassGuy]

Delphi Murders Trial: Day 5 | 'Bridge Guy' sighting, autopsy photos, and digital forensics

Day 5 of the Delphi Murders trial included testimony from a witness who claims to have seen "Bridge Guy" on the day Abby Williams and Libby German went missing.

www.wrtv.com

10/23/24

The autopsy revealed Williams had a five to six-centimeter-long wound (approximately 2 inches long) on the left side of her neck, however, Dr. Kohr said it was not a deep cut, "only an inch deep" in the doctor's words. He stated there was some skin damage to the right side which he believes suggests the cut was made from right to left.

[..]

Dr. Kohr testified he did not see any crime scene photos until this year, which was after his reports had been issued.

The doctor could not determine the exact type of weapon used or the length of the blade, but he said "anything from a pocketknife to a kitchen knife to Abby. (There is) no way to tell if it was right or left-handed."

That's a wide range of knives, but I think because these are more slashing type injuries as opposed to what we think of when we think of stabbing, that makes sense.

 

[Warwick7]

Pathologist: Abby was cut once on the neck. Libby was cut at least 4 times.​

Dr. Roland Kohr, a semi-retired forensic pathologist, who conducted the autopsies on the teens on Feb. 15, 2017, said Abby had a 2-inch laceration across her neck that damaged the left jugular vein. Kohr said the cut appeared to have been made from right to left.


Libby had at least four, maybe five, overlapping wounds on her neck, Kohr testified. Two of the cuts, one on each side, were lethal and hit arteries ― meaning blood would have spread several feet. Both of her hands were also bloody, Kohr said, suggesting that she might have grabbed her neck.

Kohr, who said that he had performed between 7,700 and 7,800 autopsies in his career, estimated that the teens lived between four to 10 minutes after their throats were slashed, although they likely lost consciousness before dying.

Kohr also said there were no signs that the girls were sexually assaulted.

'You need to call me now': Delphi murder trial testimony reveals text from Libby's grandmother

The trial of Richard Allen for the Delphi murders resumed Wednesday with testimony from an eyewitness, a forensic pathologist and a police technician.

www.indystar.com

Libby....4 x's!
Libby....4 x's! Maybe 5 x's......!!!!
What rage he had for Libby...
This pi$$es me off!!!!!!
He hated her, singled her out, murdered her!
I absolutely hate this!!!
:0(