Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #203

[MassGuy]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1849480050569060604

And this is how they know the phone is missing:

Dulin said he collected info off of RA’s phone at the time of the encounter in 2017 but did not look at the contents. It was testified to yesterday that that phone is not in the possession of law enforcement and hasn’t been found.

 

[BUF]

Under cross-examination by the defense, Shank said the mistake was made before she joined the investigation. Defense attorney Andrew Baldwin asked Shank “There was no other tip, to your knowledge, that involved Richard Allen?” Shank replied “to my knowledge, no.” She told the jury there were so many tips that she couldn’t remember individuals.

Baldwin asked “But you would remember if there was a tip about a man covered in mud and blood walking on 300 North?” Shank said she could not remember specifics.

The jury asked Shank “How did you determine the name was incorrect on the file?” Shank replied that being from the area, she knew there was a Whiteland Drive.

Delphi Murders trial: Day 6 live blog

Delphi Murders trial continues with testimony from Dr. Roland Kohr and Sarah Carbaugh. Allen accused of murdering Abby Williams and Libby German.

www.wishtv.com

 

[Bbgiraffe]

And this is how they know the phone is missing:

Dulin said he collected info off of RA’s phone at the time of the encounter in 2017 but did not look at the contents. It was testified to yesterday that that phone is not in the possession of law enforcement and hasn’t been found.

I wonder if they can find out when he stopped using that phone. It seems like maybe after they came back to him in 2022 from a post I read either earlier today or on yesterday's thread the quote of the interview where he wants an apology and he "was going to give them the phone"

 

[girlhasnoname]

If Abby was standing up and pulling her feet up to get out of the pants one leg at a time her feet in shoes coul have caused that.

I can personally attest that skinny jeans and Chuck Taylors are not the most compatible in coming off unless you take the time to sit and untie and remove your shoes first and then wiggle out of the skinny jeans.

JMO

 

[Yemelyan]

So we now know from the FOX59 team reporting that:

RA "self-reported that he was on the bridge" and that this happened by 2/18 because that was the day DD was charged with talking to him. The name DD was given was "Richard Allen Whiteland." During this conversation with DD, he originally said he was there 1-3pm and then in the course of the conversation corrected that to 1:30-3:30.

 

[Vern]

If this were any other case on Websleuths, one without all the baggage and tribalism over prosecution vs. defense, we would be all over this nugget of information as incredibly telling.

Yep; and same with his changing of the timing he had bee on the trails ... after he found out the girls had video of him.

Any other time, we'd group that under "guilty knowledge".

But in this case we have Streeeeetch Armstrong and the Odinists moving in unseen, untracked, in the dark without using flashlights lest they be seen moving through the woods while others manned the trails overnight, getting both Abby & Libby back to the exact spot they left the phone the afternoon before and making sure to kill Abby in the exact spot required to have her fall onto the phone. Not to mention the supposedly Odinistic placement of the branches over them in the dark too. Yet, not a trace of them.

Ri-ight.

All IMO of course.

 

[KSwizzle]

I really wish this was televised or some sort of live transcript

Because if I had potentially killed two people I wouldn’t want to be interviewed at my house, I might have evidence lying around, I wouldn’t want to go to the station because they would probably crank up the heat and ask if they could see my hands and arms real quick. But in a grocery store parking lot in the middle of February, I’m wearing a hoodie and my winter jacket to cover up any marks, I wonder if he asked to see RA’s hands and arms there

 

[aliciacstone]

And this is how they know the phone is missing:

Dulin said he collected info off of RA’s phone at the time of the encounter in 2017 but did not look at the contents. It was testified to yesterday that that phone is not in the possession of law enforcement and hasn’t been found.

Forgive me if this is a dumb question or has already been addressed - would it be possible the cellphone carrier would have location data of the 2017 phone without having that physical phone? Records of pinged towers?

 

[ClearAhead]

Chain of custody is not being contested for anything found at the crime scene or search warrant at Whiteman. (Along with a host of other things, but those two are most relevant given all of the concerns expressed here).

Point #16 Several witnesses named who it is stipulated that they be allowed to attend trial. B and MP, AW (victims family), KA and JA (RA’s wife and mother), plus JJ (no idea who that is).

 

[susiQ]

Wow. So this is weird on a couple different points:

Tasked with talking to Rick Allen Whiteman.
Called him to ask to meet at house, Allen said no. Suggested police station, Allen said no. Asked where and Allen suggested Save A Lot parking lot.

Met there and confirmed correct name is Richard Allen who lived on Whiteman St.

He said in 2022 he also went into DNR files to see if there was anything there and found that on 4/1/17, which RA applied for a new fishing license, he reported a new height and weight. The change in height was from 5’4” to 5’6”. He thought that was unusual.

Kind of like a 56 year old woman telling her date she’s only 49, lol . Nothing burger! JMHO

 

[Inthedetails]

9:08 a.m. The state called Kathy Shank. Shank acted as a “secretary” for the investigation. She would take tipster’s names and information. Shank said she worked with 50 or more law enforcement officers while working the investigation.

Shank told the jury she was given “bankers boxes” of reports related to the investigation and was asked to organize the reports. Eventually these reports took up five filing cabinets. Shank said she created a filing system with names of people of interest, tipsters, etc.

Shank told the jury that in 2020 she was asked to scan every file from the filing cabinets into an electronic database. She said it took her two years to do so. Shank told the jury she did not read the entire context of every file and she entered over 14,000 of them.

She told the jury that at some point she came across some hand-written tips, one of them said a “Richard Allen Whiteland” had “self-reported being on the trails and girls had seem him at the same time.”

That tip was dated February 16, 2017.

Delphi Murders trial: Day 6 live blog

Delphi Murders trial continues with testimony from Dr. Roland Kohr and Sarah Carbaugh. Allen accused of murdering Abby Williams and Libby German.

www.wishtv.com

Here we go.

jmo

 

[BUF]

Dulin said he collected info off of RA’s phone at the time of the encounter in 2017 but did not look at the contents. It was testified to yesterday that that phone is not in the possession of law enforcement and hasn’t been found.

Bingo!

 

[m00c0w]

Kind of like a 56 year old woman telling her date she’s only 49, lol . Nothing burger! JMHO

I think the closer analogy there would be if she had revealed she was 56 on previous dates, but soon after a 56 year old woman is sought for murder, she then tells the date she’s actually 49 and ignore her saying she’s 56 previously.

Kinda weird.

JMO

 

[Inthedetails]

I suspect the reason the changing locations was brought up is because it’s unusual, but that is self-evident. The height change was probably asked about specifically by the prosecution to give the jury a frame of reference for whether that is something commonly seen or not.

JMO

Exactly. And I think the jury will note that meeting in the parking lot seems odd and usual.

jmo

 

[ClearAhead]

Forgive me if this is a dumb question or has already been addressed - would it be possible the cellphone carrier would have location data of the 2017 phone without having that physical phone? Records of pinged towers?

Good question! I’ve wondered the same. If not the carrier, maybe an app that he regularly used was subpoenaed? Mollie Tibbets case, iirc data was obtained by LE from Google.

Possibly wishful thinking…

 

[arielilane]

11:38 A.M.​

TESTIMONY FROM KATHY SHANK​

Court was back in session today with the jury entering the courtroom at 9:06 a.m. The judge shared that the jury was able to access their phones, call their families and view work emails briefly last night. They have not seen any media coverage.

9:08 a.m. The state called Kathy Shank. Shank acted as a “secretary” for the investigation. She would take tipster’s names and information. Shank said she was surrounded by 50 or more law enforcement officers while working the investigation.

Delphi Murders trial: Day 6 live blog

Delphi Murders trial continues with testimony from Dr. Roland Kohr and Sarah Carbaugh. Allen accused of murdering Abby Williams and Libby German.

wishtv.com

She told the jury that when investigators were moving their headquarters she came across some hand-written tips, one of them said a “Richard Allen Whiteland” had “self-reported being on the trails and girls had seem him at the same time.”

That tip was dated February 16, 2017.

Shank said she pulled the written tip about Allen being interviewed in 2017 and changed the file name to “Richard Allen”. She told the jury she made this discovery on September 21, 2022.

 

[RyanHenson]

Delphi Murders trial: Day 6 live blog​

Delphi Murders trial: Day 6 live blog

Updated: Oct 24, 2024 / 08:59 AM EST

Excellent! Thank you!

 

[MrsWatson]

I think the closer analogy there would be if she had revealed she was 56 on previous dates, but soon after a 56 year old woman is sought for murder, she then tells the date she’s actually 49 and ignore her saying she’s 56 previously.

Kinda weird.

JMO

Also, isn't it illegal to lie on a government form like a fishing license?

Lying to a date isn't against the law.

 

[Inthedetails]

I think the closer analogy there would be if she had revealed she was 56 on previous dates, but soon after a 56 year old woman is sought for murder, she then tells the date she’s actually 49 and ignore her saying she’s 56 previously.

Kinda weird.

JMO

And it's a deliberate change. Who cares what your exact height is on a fishing license - it would take deliberate thought to change the height on that document. And he knows it's important to have the license as getting caught without it by the DNR would seem especially risky for him.

I always write the same height out of habit on forms and it's the height I remember being measured in high school, lol. I'm likely shorter now. I never think of that when filling out a form but go into auto-pilot with birth date, address, height, etc., without actually thinking about it. He thought about his height and changed it.

jmo

jmopinion

 

[RyanHenson]

Good question! I’ve wondered the same. If not the carrier, maybe an app that he regularly used was subpoenaed? Mollie Tibbets case, iirc data was obtained by LE from Google.

Possibly wishful thinking…

Interesting thought! He said he was reading a "stock ticker" at the time so there is a possibility that app collected data, not to mention any of the other apps working in the background.