Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #203

[Vaderman]

Yep; and same with his changing of the timing he had bee on the trails ... after he found out the girls had video of him.

Any other time, we'd group that under "guilty knowledge".

But in this case we have Streeeeetch Armstrong and the Odinists moving in unseen, untracked, in the dark without using flashlights lest they be seen moving through the woods while others manned the trails overnight, getting both Abby & Libby back to the exact spot they left the phone the afternoon before and making sure to kill Abby in the exact spot required to have her fall onto the phone. Not to mention the supposedly Odinistic placement of the branches over them in the dark too. Yet, not a trace of them.

Ri-ight.

All IMO of course.

Well, they had to leave the phone there so they knew how to bring them back, silly. Can't be trying to sneak back late at night wandering around blind!

 

[girlhasnoname]

Chain of custody is not being contested for anything found at the crime scene or search warrant at Whiteman. (Along with a host of other things, but those two are most relevant given all of the concerns expressed here).

Great to hear, another one of the Internet Crank conspiracies shot down. It's good to see all the drama and misleading information that has been pushed out by the D and their gang of supporters fall flat.

Let's just stick to the facts. Good, bad or ugly, it's the truth that matters because that is where you will find Justice.

IMO

 

[Vaderman]

I really wish this was televised or some sort of live transcript

Because if I had potentially killed two people I wouldn’t want to be interviewed at my house, I might have evidence lying around, I wouldn’t want to go to the station because they would probably crank up the heat and ask if they could see my hands and arms real quick. But in a grocery store parking lot in the middle of February, I’m wearing a hoodie and my winter jacket to cover up any marks, I wonder if he asked to see RA’s hands and arms there

Also, I wonder if he was trying to hide that he was admitting to being there to his family.

 

[BexLuth0r]

I think this is where the nitty gritty stuff will come out. All these facts on their own, no biggy. But if you add them all together and the timing of everything, it does start to look suspicious.
Again... he could just be the most unlucky guy in the world

Given they have the phone's IMEI number, can they pull a lot of information about it??

 

[m00c0w]

Alright, one of the “smoking guns” that hasn’t been fully developed by the prosecution at trial yet is going to be the box cutter.

We keep hearing he knew details that only the killer would know. It sounds like the police were never looking for a box cutter prior to his confessions. The box cutter idea would not have been in discovery, and so he could not have picked up on the idea in any other way. It sounds like the medical examiner was stumped as to what type of knife may have killed the girls. After RA’s confession mentioning the box cutter, it sounds like the police went back to the ME and asked if it could be a possible murder weapon. The ME did some tests himself and determined that a box cutter would fit well with the marks seen, and changed his opinion.

I suspect this will be pressed hard when we get to the confessions.

My opinions only.

 

[shonyakay]

What's the source of this? The PCA?

Yes.

Sidenote: All of this info came from RA's PCA except the 2:32 p.m. info about Libby's phone ceasing movement. That came from Cecil's testimony. I thought it was important to add.

Edited to add: The info about the 2:05 p.m. and 2:07 p.m. photographs also come from Cecil's testimony and they were also important to add.

The rest is all contained in Allen's PCA. I just compiled it in chronological order.

 

[FrostedGlass]

Exactly. And I think the jury will note that meeting in the parking lot seems odd and usual.

jmo

Knowing how neighbors and co-workers can be, I sure would not want LE coming to my house or workplace nor would I want them to see me going into a police station.

Innocent or guilty would not enter into my decision on where to meet the police.

 

[MassGuy]

Forgive me if this is a dumb question or has already been addressed - would it be possible the cellphone carrier would have location data of the 2017 phone without having that physical phone? Records of pinged towers?

I’m not sure how long those records are kept, but I do know they did tower dumps to identify phones that were connecting to them during the time.

I’m sure we’ll hear a lot more at some point.

 

[RyanHenson]

The other point TMS brought forward, since the cellphone wasn’t turned off or turned back on, if the girls were taken by car and brought back (even if the app doesn’t log steps in a vehicle) it still would’ve logged steps from exiting the car to the crime scene area, which it didn’t.

I just finished listening to this Day 5 podcast and although they’re not technical experts, I appreciate their insights and impressions from inside the courtroom. JMO

What podcast is that?

 

[cbeagle]

Exactly. And I think the jury will note that meeting in the parking lot seems odd and usual.

jmo

Not sure about that, it seems close to a CVS, maybe just more convenient than going elsewhere.

 

[mrjitty]

Well that is interesting. Blast from the past. Ives was just talked about on the threads Monday and yesterday. So, defense suddenly decides they need to have him testify. Light-bulb moment triggered by social media chatter?

jmo

IMO the other way round.

Stuff that the D is going to do turns up on social weeks or months before it happens. Murdersheet uncovered why that is - they tent pole these strategies in advance.

Motta himself admits he talks to "andy". Right after the the 3 day hearing Motta pivoted to "timeline" on his show, as if it was great advice for Andy. IMO it's the other way round. He was already trailing the post-odin strategy.

MOO

 

[MassGuy]

Kind of like a 56 year old woman telling her date she’s only 49, lol . Nothing burger! JMHO

Context is everything. A woman who does that, is going to have a habit of doing that. This guy told the truth the first time on that document, then added 2 inches when he renewed (shortly after the murders).

Again, it’s just interesting. I’m sure there’s a lot more where that came from.

 

[BUF]

On Sept. 21, 2022, she came across a file folder that was not with the others she was managing. Inside was a report with the name “Richard Allen Whiteman.” The report indicated that Allen was on the Monon High Bridge on the day of the murders.

She immediately notified Tony Liggett, lead investigator on the case and the current Carroll County sheriff. Shank noted that the tip sheet said “cleared” and wasn’t sure why Allen’s name was entered incorrectly as “Richard Allen Whiteman.”

The discrepancy likely surrounded Allen’s address, which was located on Whiteman Drive.

https://fox59.com/delphi-trial/delphi-murders-misfiled-report-from-2017-put-allen-in-investigators-sights-in-2022/

 

[mrjitty]

Alright, one of the “smoking guns” that hasn’t been fully developed by the prosecution at trial yet is going to be the box cutter.

We keep hearing he knew details that only the killer would know. It sounds like the police were never looking for a box cutter prior to his confessions. The box cutter idea would not have been in discovery, and so he could not have picked up on the idea in any other way. It sounds like the medical examiner was stumped as to what type of knife may have killed the girls. After RA’s confession mentioning the box cutter, it sounds like the police went back to the ME and asked if it could be a possible murder weapon. The ME did some tests himself and determined that a box cutter would fit well with the marks seen, and changed his opinion.

I suspect this will be pressed hard when we get to the confessions.

My opinions only.

Yeah. People wanted bombshells and yesterday delivered them. According to MS reporting this statement by the ME came as a total shock to Rozzi.

Source,

MOO.

 

[joe jones]

Was very pleased to hear that I have learned that girls hands were bagged and under fingernail scraping done by pathologist, I am still waiting for testimony that the word gun was heard on Libby's video,
I am looking forward to hearing from DNA witnesses
The phone testimony I can't get a really good overview of as each report or video I watched makes me more confused,

 

[Yemelyan]

More from Dulin's testimony under cross:

At 10:35 a.m. defense attorney Brad Rozzi begins cross-examining Dulin. Rozzi said Allen called law enforcement in February. Rozzi said Allen suggested meeting at the grocery story because he was already on his way there.

Dulin said he cannot recall the appearance or demeanor of Allen during the meeting. Rozzi said the handwritten notes would be better evidence of the meeting than the electronic report and that Dulin said in a March 2024 deposition that he had “no independent recollection” of what Allen said to him in their 2017 meeting.

Rozzi said that anyone could purchase a fishing license for another person.

Dulin testified that he was also in charge of calling phone numbers that pinged off of cell towers during the time of the crime. He said he canvassed the crime scene the day before he met with Allen.

Dulin told the jury that while he was at the scene he found branches piled up with blood on them.

Rozzi asked Dulin if he saw deer standing in the woods hear the bridge, Dulin said there were. Rozzi asked if it is not uncommon to find shell casings in the woods.

Judge Gull stepped in and said to Rozzi, “If you’re going to impeach him, impeach him properly.”

Rozzi asked Dulin if he was familiar with “Smith and Wesson.” Dulin said he was.

At 11:06 a.m. McLeland asked Dulin about the credit card used to purchase Allen’s fishing licenses. Dulin replied that he did not know what username was used to purchase the licenses.
Dulin told the jury in re-direct by the defense that he has not thought of Allen between 2017 and 2022.

At 11:13 a.m. The jury asked Dulin “What was Allen’s hair like?” Dulin replied that he didn’t know.

Source: Delphi Murders trial: Day 6 live blog

 

[RyanHenson]

I highly doubt the defense is pulling ideas for witnesses to testify from websleuths but It would be fun to be wrong on this one.

Defense, if you’re listening: hone down on the height discrepancies!!!

I think this has been explained as it was altitude, right?

 

[mrjitty]

Context is everything. A woman who does that, is going to have a habit of doing that. This guy told the truth the first time on that document, then added 2 inches when he renewed (shortly after the murders).

Again, it’s just interesting. I’m sure there’s a lot more where that came from.

RA sure does have a lot of bad luck.

 

[Seattle1]

And it's a deliberate change. Who cares what your exact height is on a fishing license - it would take deliberate thought to change the height on that document. And he knows it's important to have the license as getting caught without it by the DNR would seem especially risky for him.

I always write the same height out of habit on forms and it's the height I remember being measured in high school, lol. I'm likely shorter now. I never think of that when filling out a form but go into auto-pilot with birth date, address, height, etc., without actually thinking about it. He thought about his height and changed it.

jmo

jmopinion

RA thought he'd like to be taller on that date, and made it happen, -- on paper!

 

[girlhasnoname]

Knowing how neighbors and co-workers can be, I sure would not want LE coming to my house or workplace nor would I want them to see me going into a police station.

Innocent or guilty would not enter into my decision on where to meet the police.

If I was on MHB and completely innocent, I would have no concern about when or where I spoke to LE. I mean they offered 2 places and he turned them down? They spoke to over 300 local men, I wonder if they all got to pick the meeting location?

I think RA wasn't going to go anywhere near the police station for fear of being identified. These are all the 'bricks' in the wall of guilt for RA IMO.

MOO