GUILTY Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #216

[tlcya]

true

Just my opinion, it was a clear textbook play for sympathy.
The on off switch of dependance and sensibility was not lost on me.

Yes it will be a great thing for it all to come out.
Although Im not expecting any bombshells.
Just more incriminating/ redflags against Allen
moo

I am unsure about what to think about DPD. I had never heard of it before this trial. So I think, hey, maybe he did have that thing, shrug - doesn't explain what made him decide to become a double murderer that day.

but mostly I think it was a convenient way for the defense to try to suggest this meek mild mannered little man would never because he can't even decide what to wear or eat for dinner without his wife telling him what to do.

But I do think he had some mental health issues prior to the murders. His alleged attempt at suicide in 2015, for instance, could be an indicator of that.

I definitely believe the alleged psychosis came and went way too conveniently (JMO) and DT had to blame that on the "torturous" conditions in prison because DPD is apparently not in any way associated with that mental health disorder.

 

[ClearAhead]

It was apparently decided pre-trial. The defense had all the confessions on their list of evidence, the prosecution had 7.

The obviously false confessions are evidence that goes to the infamous false confession defense.
A lot of jurors (who never heard the discussion about which were to be admitted) would want to hear a smattering.

There are several areas where this could result in an appeal that at least goes above state appellate court. Another one has to do with planting someone in the cell next to him, etc.

I do think he will likely stay convicted in that particular region, with that particular set of appellate judges, but it would have been to his advantage in making the false confession defense.

If his defense team doesn't bring it up on appeal, then I think they are incompetent (which is another possible appeal).

And then of course, there's the fact that he was kept alone in a lit cell for 13 months (said the prison psychologist on the stand).

Odinism, confessions, alleged judicial bias among issues Richard Allen could raise on appeal

"This isn't over at all," a visibly upset Kathy Allen, Richard Allen's wife, said as she left the courthouse Monday, hinting at an inevitable appeal.

www.indystar.com

Apparently the composite pictures (based on witnesses near the bridge that day and on the photo) were not allowed into evidence either.

The following was trial testimony by Dr Wala. No doubt the D will file an appeal but no guarantee it will be granted. Meanwhile I think the jury got it right and nothing which was disallowed would’ve made any difference to the outcome. JMO

'I just want to sign my confession' | Prison psychologist describes Richard Allen's alleged confessions | Day 11 of Delphi murders trial

Seven years after Libby German and Abby Williams were killed, the trial continues for the man accused of murdering them.

www.wthr.com

“The prosecuting attorney then turned to Wala's May 2, 2023 meeting with Allen. Wala said during that meeting, Allen said "I killed Abby and Libby. I will kill everyone..." "He mentioned starting World War III," Wala said, and asked "Is it ok to kill myself?"
"He stated he did not want to die," Wala said of Allen. He also said during that meeting, "I killed myself and my family and best friend" and "I'm not going to kill myself. I'm too much of a coward."

 

[INfisherman]

"He stated he did not want to die," Wala said of Allen. He also said during that meeting, "I killed myself and my family and best friend" and "I'm not going to kill myself. I'm too much of a coward."

RSBBM

I agree 100% with his last sentence.

 

[k-mac]

I am unsure about what to think about DPD. I had never heard of it before this trial. So I think, hey, maybe he did have that thing, shrug - doesn't explain what made him decide to become a double murderer that day.

but mostly I think it was a convenient way for the defense to try to suggest this meek mild mannered little man would never because he can't even decide what to wear or eat for dinner without his wife telling him what to do.

But I do think he had some mental health issues prior to the murders. His alleged attempt at suicide in 2015, for instance, could be an indicator of that.

I definitely believe the alleged psychosis came and went way too conveniently (JMO) and DT had to blame that on the "torturous" conditions in prison because DPD is apparently not in any way associated with that mental health disorder.

yeah for sure RA has to have some kind of mental illness to support that depravity.
Its just not rational or normal to want to sexually abuse and kill others.

But mentally incompetent no. (indirect side to your post)
How he turned it up in prison when he lost his freedoms is pretty normal.A pysch nurse spoke on Gray Huges the other night and said its almost an expectation. Text book typical malingering in prison.

His guilty actions and normal functioning behaviours before he got arrested shows his capabilities where just fine.

moo

 

[k-mac]

For me what makes me feel guilty is the correct verdict was there were so many coincidences RA needed to explain away. Plus his confession that made a highly plausible scenario. Yet the defence teams "what ifs" while semi plausible as standalones were all hyper specific and didn't come together for a coherent alternative. Then came the plea for sympathy. JMO that if that strategy was their best shot at clearing him, they knew he was cooked.

100%
This is a great post articulating perfectly what happened.

moo!

 

[katydid23]

Actually, he just stated he was there that day looking at the fish.

And he said he didn't see the other witnesses because he was busy looking at the stock ticker ON HIS PHONE.

He said he did not bring his gun but he did bring his phone.
Turns out, he didn't bring his phone but he did bring his gun.

So he lied. IMO

 

[loveplace]

For me what makes me feel guilty is the correct verdict was there were so many coincidences RA needed to explain away. Plus his confession that made a highly plausible scenario. Yet the defence teams "what ifs" while semi plausible as standalones were all hyper specific and didn't come together for a coherent alternative. Then came the plea for sympathy. JMO that if that strategy was their best shot at clearing him, they knew he was cooked.

Agreed. It feel oddly close to jury nullification the way it was handled in closing.

 

[Boxer]

Agreed. It feel oddly close to jury nullification the way it was handled in closing.

Judge had to prepare also for possible acquitall. That would have been a really dangerous sutuation to get RA out if the court house.

 

[loveplace]

Judge had to prepare also for possible acquitall. That would have been a really dangerous sutuation to get RA out if the court house.

Honestly based on the bevahior of locals over the years I think they would have been livid angry, but I think they would have maintained their integrity. If I were her I would have been more concerned about the unhinged folks and the guilty verdict. That's why I think she read and sent him back earlier than 3pm.

As for my post I mean it was as though Baldwin was asking the jury to vote not guilty because of how badly they felt he was treated while in custody rather than based on proven guilt or lack thereof. ( the jury nullification definition seems very close to this.)

 

[ClearAhead]

Agreed. It feel oddly close to jury nullification the way it was handled in closing.

Yes that’s it! I didn’t know there was such a thing. Even if it had been a hung jury “the law has been nullified in the trial at hand”. I recall a D surrogate hoping at least one of the jurors knew of someone incarcerated in Westville prison. I have the utmost respect for this jury in heeding their task at hand!

What is jury nullification?

For the answer, visit this Frequently Asked Questions resource provided by the Fully Informed Jury Association.

fija.org

In its strictest sense, jury nullification occurs when a jury returns a Not Guilty verdict even though jurors believe beyond reasonable doubt that the defendant has broken the law.

 

[Aussieboy]

Why. The evidence is overwhelming.
Blaming others SODDI who have alibis means the defense has to at least crack those alibis, which was not done because the individuals the defense wanted to drag into the story were confirmed to be at work, unlike RA who was off that day, has no alibi, and placed himself at the scene.

The only thing that connects Allen to the scene of the crime is the unspent cartridge. The testing from the firearms expert isn't conclusive evidence that the bullet came from Allen's gun, there's a probability that it may have come from his gun but it's not 100% definite. The type of testing isn't common and it's been doubted by other experts before, it's not a perfect science. The eyewitnesses were all over the place, and unreliable as usual. There were many people in the park that day, many wouldn't come forward as they wouldn't want to associate themselves with this type of crime. The defence team was dispairing and it was all he could afford.

 

[INfisherman]

Judge had to prepare also for possible acquitall. That would have been a really dangerous sutuation to get RA out if the court house.

Ooooph - that would have been rough.

 

[katydid23]

The only thing that connects Allen to the scene of the crime is the unspent cartridge. The testing from the firearms expert isn't conclusive evidence that the bullet came from Allen's gun, there's a probability that it may have come from his gun but it's not 100% definite. The type of testing isn't common and it's been doubted by other experts before, it's not a perfect science. The eyewitnesses were all over the place, and unreliable as usual. There were many people in the park that day, many wouldn't come forward as they wouldn't want to associate themselves with this type of crime. The defence team was dispairing and it was all he could afford.

The cartridge isn't the only connection he has to the scene of the crime, imo.
He has been shown to be Bridge Guy. BG was shown to be the kidnapper. That is a big connection.

Taken as a whole, the eyewitnesses are credible. A few details were wrong but the timeline is correct and they corroborate each other.

I found his confessions, as a whole, to be credible. He confessed over 60 times to a dozen or more people. He was not in psychosis for all of those confessions. He was lucid and coherent for many of them. IMO

 

[INfisherman]

The only thing that connects Allen to the scene of the crime is the unspent cartridge. The testing from the firearms expert isn't conclusive evidence that the bullet came from Allen's gun, there's a probability that it may have come from his gun but it's not 100% definite. The type of testing isn't common and it's been doubted by other experts before, it's not a perfect science. The eyewitnesses were all over the place, and unreliable as usual. There were many people in the park that day, many wouldn't come forward as they wouldn't want to associate themselves with this type of crime. The defence team was dispairing and it was all he could afford.

Hi. Some food for thought, not trying to sound stand-offish:

The ballistics/tool mark evidence was allowed, and is allowed in many courts throughout the US, regardless of what some experts may believe. Science as a whole, regardless of subject, is imperfect & much of it is based on opinion. Test results analysis is often opinion based in many instances & will never be 100% definitive. If the testimony in question is allowed in the majority of courts, then I’m guessing the doubt surrounding it must be in the minority opinion otherwise such testimony would not be allowed.

Regardless of what came out of eyewitnesses mouths, they ALL agreed they saw BG that day. Every single witness for the state. The descriptions didn’t matter, the agreement that the man shown in the still frame from Libby’s video was the man they all saw is what mattered most.

If there were many others at the park that day, I would assume somewhere some of the other eyewitnesses that DID come forward would have mentioned that at some point, or the defense would have pointed that out during cross examination. If they didn’t, why not? So where is that proof? Along the same lines, if eyewitness testimony is so unreliable by your own words, then what would it matter how many more people came forward?

RA’s defense team, which included others who were in court but not presenting, had plenty of time & money to make content for YT. Maybe their efforts would have been better served doing something else other than attempting to sway public opinion & run down rabbit holes with dead ends.

JMO

ETA clarity BG

 

[Han]

Allen, Allen, Allen! That’s what we tend to hear now that the jury has determined that bridge guy equals Richard Matthew Allen.

Was this a fair trial? Will there be an appeal? What factors motivated this criminal behavior? Where will the prisoner be housed? Et al

Richard Allen would be welcome to live on my street as long as he stays in prison. In fact, it could be interesting to get to know KA. Maybe find out what makes her tick.

The only thing that connects Allen to the scene of the crime is the unspent cartridge. The testing from the firearms expert isn't conclusive evidence that the bullet came from Allen's gun, there's a probability that it may have come from his gun but it's not 100% definite. The type of testing isn't common and it's been doubted by other experts before, it's not a perfect science. The eyewitnesses were all over the place, and unreliable as usual. There were many people in the park that day, many wouldn't come forward as they wouldn't want to associate themselves with this type of crime. The defence team was dispairing and it was all he could afford.

Don’t think so.

 

[INfisherman]

Richard Allen would be welcome to live on my street as long as he stays in prison. In fact, it could be interesting to get to know KA. Maybe find out what makes her tick.

RSBM

If you do end up with a prison on your street, we’re having beers at my house.

 

[Boxer]

The only thing that connects Allen to the scene of the crime is the unspent cartridge. The testing from the firearms expert isn't conclusive evidence that the bullet came from Allen's gun, there's a probability that it may have come from his gun but it's not 100% definite. The type of testing isn't common and it's been doubted by other experts before, it's not a perfect science. The eyewitnesses were all over the place, and unreliable as usual. There were many people in the park that day, many wouldn't come forward as they wouldn't want to associate themselves with this type of crime. The defence team was dispairing and it was all he could afford.

The timeline connects him to the girls on the bridge. Actions on the bridge were felony murder.

 

[Boxer]

Allen, Allen, Allen! That’s what we tend to hear now that the jury has determined that bridge guy equals Richard Matthew Allen.

Was this a fair trial? Will there be an appeal? What factors motivated this criminal behavior? Where will the prisoner be housed? Et al

Richard Allen would be welcome to live on my street as long as he stays in prison. In fact, it could be interesting to get to know KA. Maybe find out what makes her tick.

Don’t think so.

There is always an appeal.

 

[Boxer]

The cartridge isn't the only connection he has to the scene of the crime, imo.
He has been shown to be Bridge Guy. BG was shown to be the kidnapper. That is a big connection.

Taken as a whole, the eyewitnesses are credible. A few details were wrong but the timeline is correct and they corroborate each other.

I found his confessions, as a whole, to be credible. He confessed over 60 times to a dozen or more people. He was not in psychosis for all of those confessions. He was lucid and coherent for many of them. IMO

Exactly.

 

[Aussieboy]

The cartridge isn't the only connection he has to the scene of the crime, imo.
He has been shown to be Bridge Guy. BG was shown to be the kidnapper. That is a big connection.

Taken as a whole, the eyewitnesses are credible. A few details were wrong but the timeline is correct and they corroborate each other.

I found his confessions, as a whole, to be credible. He confessed over 60 times to a dozen or more people. He was not in psychosis for all of those confessions. He was lucid and coherent for many of them. IMO

A video that's so blurry that you can't even recognise their face, and looks like 50% of the guys in Delphi, it could have been anyone. There's no GPS or phone data putting him on that bridge, none at all.

The multiple confessions were strange, but if you lived a normal life for years and then were put in solitary confinement you could see how it would play with your head. He couldn't have been that sane if he ate his own feces. It's been known in the past that many people confess to crimes that they've never done due to many reasons. I don't have enough facts to comment about it but I hope more comes out about the case.

He's never been convicted for any type of SA and reached mid life, don't you find that's a bit odd? I can understand how people had gotten away with it in the 90's, but with the digital data these days and DNA detection it makes it very difficult and a typical hallmark for these types of crimes is that the perpetrators work themselves up to these type of horrendous crimes.

I personally think they need to find more direct evidence to link him to the crime. For the sake of the children and the families involved, I hope it was it was him and him alone but if not the wrong people are still out there.