GUILTY Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #220

[Megnut]

One thing about RA, the judge removed his unprofessional counsel and assigned him a more professional team but RA actively chose to fight that and succeeded in getting his crime scene photo leakers back.

I can't be certain of the timing, but I believe there was an extended period there where RA was cut off from KA and counsel during thus period. Then came him asking KA if he could trust his attorneys.

I suspect that they were pressuring him to state wanting to keep them.

Adding to questionable attorney ethics, remember how they represented to SCION how ready they were to go to trial, that if they were replaced by new counsel it would delay a trial, compromising RA's rights? And what's the first thing they tried, after being reinstalled? Seek extensions. They were NEVER ready for trial.

JMO

 

[Megnut]

He sure was found guilty by a jury of his peers. The jury took their position very seriously.

During the trial many things were stated by the defense, and IMO were false. It is my opinion and my understanding no attorney should out right lie. After reading the recently released documents, especially the defense stating the judge was denying all their requests for reimbursements, there was misconduct by the defense. Among many other claims.

This conduct made the trial into a three ring circus, added additional pain and suffering on the victims family and friends. My desire would have the board look into the conduct of the defense's actions, which I truly believe made Abby and Libby's family suffer even more.

I used the word accused because the child killer was not convicted at the time of the misconduct.

You are 100% correct. And I thank you for giving me a chance to clarify.

RBBM

So maddening. And much of the public took their claims seriously, became outraged (or would have been outrageous IF IT WERE TRUE -- same with mistreatment in custody, IF IT WERE TRUE -- it was the other way around -- RA's behavior was reckless, deliberate and dangerous to himself and staff -- completely intentional -- "I won't be doing that again"). Gull approved attorney's fees/salaries, reimbursements, experts, testing when counsel submitted proper invoices.

Worth remembering SCION found her to be fair and unbiased. Which, to her credit and dignity of office, she maintained throughout the trial, despite the actions and behavior of the defense team.

They're seasoned attorneys. They know how to submit proper invoices. So why didn't they?

IMO it sure looks like they were setting Gull up to (rightfully) deny their payments do (wrongfully) they could broadcast failure to be paid (when it was THEIR failure to document, all along).

What part of ethical lawyering is it?

Underhanded.

JMO

 

[INfisherman]

They're seasoned attorneys. They know how to submit proper invoices. So why didn't they?

RSBM

Most likely, they were too busy figuring out which misrepresentations of evidence with which to come up next. It’s not just that they misrepresented evidence, there are actually people seeing this today for the first time & believing it at face value (the BW van video timestamp is being taken as the actual time, for example). Misconduct, muddying the waters, tainting the jury pool, whatever one wants to call it - it was ambulance chaser level BS.

They are an embarrassment to this state, the justice system & their profession. They were the ones who made things personal - and have yet to offer as much as a hint of remorse towards the victims or their families, which to me is the most unforgivable of their low class deeds.

JMO

 

[kkdj]

Respectfully to me, RA comes across as a well practiced lying liar who lies. Overly acted to present himself as innocent, his whole life depended on it and he had 5 years to fine tune it. But that's just my take.

JMO

I thought his body language in the police interview was a total tell. jmo.

 

[INfisherman]

I thought his body language in the police interview was a total tell. jmo.

He sure didn’t seem bothered by the photo Holeman showed him of the CS, showing his unspent round next to the leg of one of the victims.

MOO

 

[kkdj]

Someone accuses me of something I didn't do I think my hands would naturally go up and push away as I spoke. His body language was out of sync for innocence imo.

 

[flashy09]

Someone accuses me of something I didn't do I think my hands would naturally go up and push away as I spoke. His body language was out of sync for innocence imo.

100%. He was so cool and calculated! It would have been a Grammy winning performance of someone lying their way out of a more minor offense. Just right personable, just right unphased, just right furious at being accused in the first place, just right dumbfounded, etc. Except he wasn't accused of of a minor offensive and therefore completely underacted because he was too nervous to try and fake the emotions of a truly wrongly accused man.

A innocent person would not have needed to act their shock,horror and fear at being accused of a double murder of girls and certainly would not have played "cool customer" to the detectives.

It does show what a pathological liar he is that he was so comfortable. Any preconceived notion I had that he was a middle aged, midwest creep that had a mental break one day and got lucky is gone. That was a premeditated, careful, educated, terrifying crime.

 

[Boxer]

Also, an innocent person doesn't just think they can talk their way out of the police accusing them of murder, it is already so far out that this would be happening to them think "I did not do this, I need a lawyer!" would be their reponse, not "come on, honey you know I couldn't do something like this."

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Also, an innocent person doesn't just think they can talk their way out of the police accusing them of murder, it is already so far out that this would be happening to them think "I did not do this, I need a lawyer!" would be their reponse, not "come on, honey you know I couldn't do something like this."

Just jumping off from your post:

I have watched many of the recordings but not all, so would someone help me out here, did he ever ask KA point blank if she thought he did it?

If so what did she say in response?

I don't recall seeing him ask that, just him assuring KA that he knows she knows he couldn't/wouldn't do anything like this.

 

[flashy09]

Also, an innocent person doesn't just think they can talk their way out of the police accusing them of murder, it is already so far out that this would be happening to them think "I did not do this, I need a lawyer!" would be their reponse, not "come on, honey you know I couldn't do something like this."

And your wife wouldn't be finding out you were on the bridge at or near the same time for the first time because that would have a huge deal for an innocent person! Traumatic! An innocent person would have replayed that day 1000x to their spouse.

 

[INfisherman]

I have watched many of the recordings but not all, so would someone help me out here, did he ever ask KA point blank if she thought he did it?

If so what did she say in response?

I don't recall seeing him ask that, just him assuring KA that he knows she knows he couldn't/wouldn't do anything like this.

Not that I recall. He kept tell her (paraphrasing), "You know me. You know I couldn’t do something like this," as you said.

She did bring up that the police told her that RA said he was on the bridge & that RA didn’t tell her that he was on the bridge that day. It seems to me that she caught him in a lie. He just proceeded to gaslight her, act flustered that he was being questioned repeatedly & stopped short of explaining himself to her & just said "I love you."

 

[INfisherman]

Also, an innocent person doesn't just think they can talk their way out of the police accusing them of murder, it is already so far out that this would be happening to them think "I did not do this, I need a lawyer!" would be their reponse, not "come on, honey you know I couldn't do something like this."

Exactly! Once you hear LE repeating the same questions & you’ve given the same answers & remind them you’ve answered those questions, you know it’s pointless to answer them again & again & again. It’s time to stop answering & start getting legal representation.

He just couldn’t shut his mouth & stop talking. It seemed to get him off or something.

JMO

 

[Megnut]

Exactly! Once you hear LE repeating the same questions & you’ve given the same answers & remind them you’ve answered those questions, you know it’s pointless to answer them again & again & again. It’s time to stop answering & start getting legal representation.

He just couldn’t shut his mouth & stop talking. It seemed to get him off or something.

JMO

Yeah, he wouldn't do it even if he wanted to.

I can't shake that. I can't fathom an innocent person putting that sentence together.

An innocent person wouldn't.

JMO

 

[INfisherman]

Yeah, he wouldn't do it even if he wanted to.

I can't shake that. I can't fathom an innocent person putting that sentence together.

An innocent person wouldn't.

JMO

That, to me, is an example of how dumb he was. He thought he could gaslight LE just like he did his idiot wife & he FAFO. Hello Westville (again), hello Pendleton, nice to see you again sporks.

MOO

 

[LeahBee]

Did RA ever try to walk back his confessions to his wife/mother/psychologist/anyone else he directly confessed to?
Obviously in court he claimed his innocence and that the confessions were because of psychosis, but were there any further phone calls with his wife and mother saying "Oops my bad I made a false confession during psychosis" or did they just pretend in all their further conversations that his confessions never happened?

 

[INfisherman]

Did RA ever try to walk back his confessions to his wife/mother/psychologist/anyone else he directly confessed to?
Obviously in court he claimed his innocence and that the confessions were because of psychosis, but were there any further phone calls with his wife and mother saying "Oops my bad I made a false confession during psychosis" or did they just pretend in all their further conversations that his confessions never happened?

He never walked back anything & if he did it was never reported as such.

No evidence of any recordings of him recanting any confessions. IIRC, he was diagnosed as psychotic for 3 weeks at longest while at Westville. His confessions came before, during & after those diagnoses.

His family were in denial. He’d gaslit them for years, just like he did his wife near the end of the interview with Holeman prior to his arrest.

MOO

 

[Bekind89]

He never walked back anything & if he did it was never reported as such.

No evidence of any recordings of him recanting any confessions. IIRC, he was diagnosed as psychotic for 3 weeks at longest while at Westville. His confessions came before, during & after those diagnoses.

His family were in denial. He’d gaslit them for years, just like he did his wife near the end of the interview with Holeman prior to his arrest.

MOO

Absolutely. Just imagine what a power trip that would be for a control freak and manipulater, commiting the most egregious crime, the murder of innocent children, then practically demanding love, support, and forgiveness from your spouse.
The insignificant loser.

 

[sunshineray]

Everyone remember way back when the Defence Team was removed from the case 'behind closed doors' ... and claimed that there was no record of what happened in that 'ambush' meeting?

Turns out there was ... and that the Defence knew it.


Record Of In Camera Proceedings Held On October 19th, 2023:

10/19/23 Ambush Hearing - Google Drive

drive.google.com

View attachment 576315

As well, it wasn't really the 'ambush' it was cracked up to be as apparently Judge Gull discussed her consideration of 'disqualification' that he asked for (!) with Rossi & Baldwin via telephone and emails prior to being behind closed doors.

View attachment 576316

Pages 13 through 16 are quite interesting where Judge Gull goes over in detail the Defence Team failings and her concerns with their representation of RA. Including the fact that Baldwin also admits (page 14, lines 14-16 ) that he also knew of the breach of the USB case information leak (including evidence and trial strategy) via email to the "wrong Brad" but failed to notify anyone, or the court, of that breach ... that pleadings on the safekeeping hearing contained deliberate falsehoods and inaccuracies (page 14, line 22-25) etc etc etc

Suffice to say, RA insisted on keeping them despite their failings and the SCOIN allowed it due to JG not doing this 'in the courtroom' ... but it's also very obvious now exactly why the SCOIN did NOT remove her from the case.

There goes the 'ineffective counsel' appeal down the toilet.

Sometimes, you get exactly what you wish what you wish for.

What a tangled web we weave when we practice to deceive ...

IMO.

-

WOW!! So Rozzi asked to be disqualified and Baldwin admitted knowingly not reporting leaked discovery to the court and to pleading what he knew to be falsehoods and inaccuracies in a court hearing, on the record. Rozzi must have also know that as well, IMO.

Well some people sure owe JG an apology. MO

 

[mrjitty]

And your wife wouldn't be finding out you were on the bridge at or near the same time for the first time because that would have a huge deal for an innocent person! Traumatic! An innocent person would have replayed that day 1000x to their spouse.

Exactly. I always felt his presence on the bridge on Murder Day would have been a huge talking point at his local bar!

but then it turns out he never told anyone what he told Dulin because of course he didn’t.

 

[Boxer]

Exactly. I always felt his presence on the bridge on Murder Day would have been a huge talking point at his local bar!

but then it turns out he never told anyone what he told Dulin because of course he didn’t.

Of course. A tight wire of lies.
He was likely shocked it was working.

When all that brass descended, it turned out that everyone was just too high ranking to physically be checking on things.
So the lady detective from CPS, who was volunteering to clean up and turn off the lights finds RAs interview, with his statement that he was on the trail and the bridge at the time, parked at old CPS lot (the old building there by FB,) saw the first group of girls. Dulin collected this info along with RAs phone number, his address, his drivers license and probably the license of the car he drove to meet Dulin in.