Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #198

[iamshadow21]

@kithanleytv

NEW: jury selection is complete in the #Delphi murder trial — 12 jurors and 4 alternates.The jurors will be sequestered for about a month. Opening statements are scheduled to begin on Friday, when the proceedings shift to Carroll County.Our team will be there.


3:54 PM · Oct 15, 2024

https://twitter.com/x/status/1846278598702821385

Well, with the jury being sequestered, I can't see them being pleased if the defense tries to put on all 100+ witnesses on their list. The defense will have to balance their approach with an understanding for the limits of the patience of the jury.

Sequestration is probably also why we had a bunch of jurors bounced. There are some folks who just can't drop their jobs, their kids, their aging parents, their disabled partner, their dialysis, etc, to devote every moment to a trial.

MOO

 

[NoSpoonFeeding]

IMO, other witnesses probably assisted with one of the sketches, not just one person.
I do think BB was the only one for the YBG sketch but not the original.

IMO, other witnesses probably assisted with one of the sketches, not just one person.
I do think BB was the only one for the YBG sketch but not the original.

The transcripts show only 2, both witnesses from that day, sat with sketch artists, separately. The witnesses did not want to do it. The prosecutor is saving them from being grilled on the stand about the sketches, for the defense to try to impeach their testimony.
MOO

 

[sunshineray]

Yes, I'm aware of this fact...but for me that doesn't answer the question of 'how' LE would know he was interrupted by one of those other people, other than to have a record of the fact. From whence does that record come? A witness? A phone? Evidence on the bridge side of the creek?

I think in the multitude of confessions RA may have mentioned it himself...why he crossed the creek.

 

[Megnut]

Sketches: composites. If the sketches are work product based on multiple input, how could a witness evaluate the degree to which a composite sketch matches the details they provided?

The veracity/accuracy of the sketches isn't on trial! The sketch artist isn't on trial. The witnesses aren't on trial. Some are children, one saw him at a distance, another whole driving past. The State isn't calling them to I.D. RA or to validate any sketches.

It suffices that they saw a lone male, not inconsistent with the man in Libby's video, and can establish what time (or between what times) that occurred.

If the motion is granted, and the State calls those witnesses, the Defense is still free to cross examination them and challenge their recall relative to statements contained in discovery.

In that way, the Defense can try to create doubt that the witnesses all saw the same man or that the man they saw was RA.

IMO the tight timeline, not the sketches, will paint RA on the bridge, him and him alone, none other.

JMO

 

[katydid23]

Well, one option is it wasn’t RA. MY OPINION ONLY.

Even if it isn't RA, the crime seems to be sexually motivated. No matter who did it, unless it was someone with a relationship to the girls and had a personal motivation, like revenge or jealousy, etc.

But the video taken of BG seems to destroy that possibility---if they knew BG they'd have said so in the video. IMO

So even if it was not RA, the girls were forced off the bridge at gunpoint, taken to the woods and undressed, then stabbed to death. That has all the signs of SA motivation, imo.

 

[Chelly]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1846285226525577624

Am I the only poster shocked that the jury of 16 was selected in just hours over one day?

 

[sunshineray]

I wonder actually, if he was planning to SA them or one of them and was then interrupted when did he get the chance to murder them and stage them the way he did? It doesn’t seem reasonable to me that a traditional r*** was his plan and he was interrupted but still did these things. He clearly had time to redress / set the scene on how they’d be found - doesn’t speak to a man interrupted and afraid to be caught imo.

The only way that idea works imo… <graphic and I am not going to write it out!> Maybe hearing DG if he was calling for them? Mooooooo.

He simply could have heard voices, maybe other hikers. Sound travels in the woods when there's no leaves on the trees and I'd think a person doing what RA was, his senses would be heightened. As far as if he had the time to do all that was done, the blood evidence tells a lot of that story. Cisero's testimony painted that picture for me. AJMO

 

[TTF14]

And wouldn't that be a good reason for the D to put MP on their witness list. BP, DG and Kelsei need to testify for the timeline, MP was at work. Let's remove all of Libby's Indiana family from the courtroom. Just my honest opinion. I trust this D will think of everything, they're so very zealous. Also MO

In my opinion, They are doing a terrific job of covering all the bases. This is my opinion.

 

[sunshineray]

The jury hasn't heard a thing from the hearings. Testimony that has been heard in the past that was used for the purposes of the evidentiary hearing would have to be testified to again in court. I don't think the prosecution is going to call Perlmutter on her opinion on the nature/motive of the attack.

I'm only bringing this up as a reminder we have to separate what happened pre-trial from what is happening now. The slate is clean, so to speak. All we know we must assume the jury doesn't.

The Prosecution asked, if the defendant saId that. I'm thinking we'll hear that part of the crime details from RA himself. Powerful stuff. AJMO

 

[orchidaceaes]

In my opinion, They are doing a terrific job of covering all the bases. This is my opinion.

Makes it less likely for a successful appeal!

 

[sunshineray]

Which just makes me think back.. what did LE see when they looked back into him, that justified the search of his property and subsequent arrest? I actually cannot remember what they learned that allowed to get them the search warrant. Anyone know?

I'm extremely curious about whomever LE interviewed right before and right after the interviews of RA and KA.

 

[renah]

The second sketch came out because the witness who provided it was upset that it hadn't been used. I believe it was quite some time later that SHE approached LE and it was at her insistence that they finally made "her" sketch public. I'm not sure how that jibes with the P saying that both sketch witnesses were reluctant.

This information was in the much-bemoaned Frank's memo, so take it as you will. However IMO it's one of those things (similar to guard tattoos & patches, and the interview room tray slot) that simply can't be made up or exaggerated for effect. That's why it still stands out in my mind.

 

[Melted]

That hair in Abby’s hand is going to be an absolute nightmare for the prosecution.

MOO

 

[sunshineray]

So if he's interrupted before they cross the water and the girls are already forced to undress, I'd say maybe he walked them across the water to ensure evidence was washed off of them. I think Abby was also on the small side so perhaps she was shivering from the cold water and he had her redress somewhat while he was trying to figure out what to do now.... Then Libby tries to run or fight him and he decided the only thing he could do was make sure they couldn't talk or ID him.

If he had a certain idea in his mind of how things would go, then right from the beginning he was forced to change things up, he might have lost it because part of what these predators like is control.. I'd say interruption is a loss of control.

All my opinion, but if he high tailed it out of there, then there would be 2 girls that could describe him and he may not even make it back to his car before the alarm was sounded. Way to risky to just leave the job unfinished. I think this could also be why he threw some sticks over them and moved them somewhat.. he didn't get to do it how he planned so he was more erratic in his actions after the interruption.

I think it was his intent to murder them when he was walking across the bridge towards Abby and Libby. CVS guy couldn't chance being identified working in a small town's store. He wasn't getting a new job, selling his house and moving away. He was always going to murder them </3 AJMO

 

[twall]

Am I the only poster shocked that the jury of 16 was selected in just hours over one day?

It was 2 days and no I'm not shocked. Indiana does not do individual voir dire. It's done as a group. I recently was in a jury pool for a child molestation case (in Indiana). The jury was picked in 7 hours. (defendant was acquitted)

 

[TristanP]

Opening paragraph of the in limine motion (sketch)

COMES NOW the State of Indiana, by Prosecutor Nicholas M. McLeland, for the 74th
Judicial Circuit, and respectfully requests that the Court enter an Order prohibiting the admission
or reference to composite sketches, prepared by any sketch artist for the investigation of the
murders of Abigail Williams and Liberty German, for the reason that a composite sketch is not
relevant, admission would result in undue prejudice, confuse or mislead the jury, or is
impermissible hearsay, and the witnesses who participated in the preparation of composite
sketch(s) will not be presented by the State for the purpose of in-court identification of the
defendant.

One of the 7 reasons the P gives:
5. It is the State’s belief that the defense intends to use composite sketches from the
investigation as demonstrative evidence and for impeachment purposes. That the
witnesses who participated in the preparation of composite sketches are not being
called to provide in-court identification of the accused; furthermore, no composite
sketch was instrumental in identifying Richard Allen as a suspect.

His request:
WHEREFORE, the State of Indiana, by Prosecuting Attorney, Nicholas C. McLeland,
respectfully requests this Court to grant the following relief:
A. Order the Defendant, his Counsel and witnesses to refrain from mentioning,
commenting, or making any reference whatsoever, either directly or indirectly, to
composite sketches without first obtaining permission of the Court outside the presence
and hearing of the jury;
B. To further order said persons to make no reference to the fact that this motion
has been filed and granted and all other relief just and proper in the premises.

2024_10_15_Motion in Limine - sketches.pdf.pdf

drive.google.com

Hey, we just want to have the most publicized pieces of information in this case completely disregarded, mmmkay? We don’t want the jury wondering why there were two sketches released that don’t look even remotely like one another, now do we?

 

[tlcya]

I don't think the hair will be anything of the sort for the prosecution.

a) we don't know where on or in Abby's hand it was located
b) we don't know if it is human or animal or some hairlike fiber from a fabric or textile
c) we don't know if the prosecution will come into this trial already having figured out and able to explain what that hair/fiber is
d) not everything found on a victim or a crime scene is connected to the crime so I don't feel it is on the prosecution to explain what it is or how it got there

JMO MOO IMO

 

[sunshineray]

Prosecutors in the murder trial of Richard Allen, the Delphi man who is accused of killing two teenagers, has asked the court to prohibit the sketches used by investigators.

View attachment 537846

Prosecution in Delphi murders trial seeks to ban suspect sketches

Prosecutors in the murder trial of Richard Allen, the Delphi man who is accused of killing two teenagers, has asked to prohibit sketches.

www.wishtv.com

I think an earlier picture of RA shows a better likeness, especially to the second younger BG sketch. The features are very close. And that's just my honest opinion.

 

[Vern]

@Niner / @arielilane

Yesterdays that is now up:
Motion In Limine Regarding IPAS Settlement (14/10/24):

2024_10_15_Motion in Limine - IPAS.pdf.pdf

drive.google.com

Today's up so far:
Motion in Limine Regarding Sketches (15/10/24):

2024_10_15_Motion in Limine - sketches.pdf.pdf

drive.google.com

 

[tlcya]

Hey, we just want to have the most publicized pieces of information in this case completely disregarded, mmmkay? We don’t want the jury wondering why there were two sketches released that don’t look even remotely like one another, now do we?

no, we don't if those things are not among the evidence prosecution plans to present. the important thing is what evidence are they going to present and will the jury find it enough to find the accused guilty or will they feel the state hasn't met the bar. IMO