Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #201

[Kudzuu]

Thanks for the link! I didn’t even think of the privacy blocking black bars when reading “black marks” but as soon as Ravenmoon suggested it, I thought that could be a reasonable explanation, and now it makes sense. I appreciate Barbara’s reporting on the case.
I really do feel for all of these reporters, too. So much info to absorb & make notes of, and so little time to convert all of it into a concise update.

Thanks to everyone who is keeping the thread updated with the various sources!

MOO

I feel for the LE that stayed with the bodies. How awful for him. He is an honorable brave man.

 

[Bbgiraffe]

I have followed this case and am horrified by what happened to these girls- and if I’m going to take a hypothetical innocent until proven guilty narrative, is there another plausible explanation for the evidence that we have to date - regardless of defense motions and prosecution mistakes- is there a narrative that explains the evidence and yet doesn’t assume that the current accused individual on trial is obviously guilty?

In the quest for justice for the girls, I have to wonder if the “masses” would be willing to have the wrong person held accountable vs no one held accountable

Does our desire for closure and accountability on occasion obscure our quest for justice- would we rather a man be falsely convicted? Or the case remain unsolved? Just thinking out loud, towards no one in particular- but thinking about some recent dinner table conversations… moo

I don't think just wanted to solve it and picked RA to get it off their files. If that was the case they could have just framed KK or TK. From the surface they're easy suspects because of the catfishing etc.

They must have something that proves not only is RA "bridge guy" but ALSO that "bridge guy" is for sure the one who killed the girls.

I think the only narrative that excludes RA is one where either "bridge guy" isn't actually RA OR "bridge guy" didnt kill the girls.

 

[vls12345]

Datzman also said the sticks on the bodies “were of no evidentiary value” and did not have blood on them. The sticks were later placed in evidence storage at the state police post in Lafayette.

Delphi Murders trial: Day 3 blog

Follow the trial of Richard Allen, accused of the Delphi Murders, as he faces charges for the deaths of Abby Williams and Libby German.

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[shonyakay]

I think it’s actually going to be one of the girls saying “he’s got a gun” or something similar. The defense doesn’t want it in for the same reason, though… if BG has a gun and the girls only refer to one person, the defense’s narrative starts to look pretty… unfactual.

JMO

I just posted further on this matter. Gray Hughes said Abby asked, "Is that a gun?" And then she said, "He's got a gun."

Implying one man.

 

[tlcya]

Glitter?

Delphi Murders trial: Day 3 blog

Follow the trial of Richard Allen, accused of the Delphi Murders, as he faces charges for the deaths of Abby Williams and Libby German.

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I am gonna guess this was meant to be spatter, as in blood. JMO

ETA probably the result of something misheard or an issue with reading hurried notes taken from inside the courtroom IMO

 

[rhino]

Glitter?

Delphi Murders trial: Day 3 blog

Follow the trial of Richard Allen, accused of the Delphi Murders, as he faces charges for the deaths of Abby Williams and Libby German.

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Typo for spatter perhaps?

 

[vls12345]

I am gonna guess this was meant to be spatter, as in blood. JMO

Typo for spatter perhaps?

Great point. Thanks. That makes a lot more sense.

 

[Tealgrove]

In the beginning of the investigation it was claimed by investigators that there were numerous ritualistic “signs” that the killer or killers had purposely left at the crime scene. (They weren’t called signs though, it was another term, that I can’t recall) Deliberate posing of the bodies, usual placement of sticks, etc. IMO

Not true.

They said there were signatures. They never said it was ritualistic.

 

[m00c0w]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1848456928210653355

Of note:

The bullet found after moving the bodies of Abby and Libby was not easy to see. It was found using a blue light that showed a sparkle.

Sounds like this clarifies that the bullet was not found days after the murder, after the scene was released, as has been claimed and speculated on in the past.

JMO

 

[arielilane]

Follow this blog throughout the day and stay tuned to News 8 for the very latest.

Delphi Murders trial: Day 3 live blog

Follow the trial of Richard Allen, accused of the Delphi Murders, as he faces charges for the deaths of Abby Williams and Libby German.

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[Kudzuu]

Anyone remember the enigmatic statement Carter made at that presser where he looked into the camera and spoke to the killer? I spent hours watching and wondering what The Shack had to do with anything. It was haunting and the hiding in plain sight was true.

 

[ClearAhead]

After lunch…

Defense attorney Brad Rozzi resumed questioning of Indiana State Police Sgt. Jason Page.

Page said it was not his job to determine the girls’ times of deaths when asked an opinion about when they may have happened.

“Do you know if a rape test kit was given?” Rozzi said.

“I would assume. I wasn’t there,” Page said.
I
Rozzi next asked about the sticks placed over the bodies. Page said he’s seen other death investigations where bodies had sticks placed over them. Page said, in Delphi, a human appeared to have placed the sticks over the girls’ bodies.

Rozzi also asked about the depth of Deer Creek, the size of the footprints, the blood around the area where the bodies were found, and about information on the hair found in Abby’s hand. Page responded, “You’re asking questions out of my knowledge.”

Page later explained his job — he was the 14th law enforcement officer to arrive at the crime scene — was to preserve the area through photography.

Prosecutors next called Indiana State Police Sgt. Duane Datzman, a crime scene technician, to the stand. He’s now retired, but was the CSI at the Delphi Murders crime scene. He has at least 20 years as a CSI, visiting hundreds of crime scenes.

Delphi Murders trial: Day 3 blog

Follow the trial of Richard Allen, accused of the Delphi Murders, as he faces charges for the deaths of Abby Williams and Libby German.

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Appears this witness is very well prepared for the D by *not allowing their irrelevant questions make it appear as if the investigation was shoddy. Good job!

How would the D expect an officer tasked with photographing the crime scene be in a position to answer questions about the hair found in Abby’s hand? A cheap, feeble tactic to ensure the jury hasn’t forgotten about it. IMO

ETA * not - important missed word

 

[Deleted member 229974]

Not true.

They said there were signatures. They never said it was ritualistic.

That’s right, sorry I couldn’t think of the right word at the time. Signatures. Has the Prosecution addressed that yet?

 

[mrjitty]

I think we now see why the defence had little interest in the more obvious alt suspects.

If the jury agree muddy/bloody guy is the killer, then what defence do they have? The jury is surely going to agree that muddy / bloody guy is the same guy the 3 juvenile girls saw. MOO

 

[Seattle1]

I haven't followed this case in a long time. I didn't even know there was a ritual theory.

By September 2024, Judge Gull was able to put an end to years of the defense's speculative ritual theories which OP can easily read in the Media thread.

“The case law is quite clear that the nexus must not be based on speculation, conjecture, rumors, or hearsay, but rather on admissible evidence,” Gull wrote in her order.

9/10/24 - NewsNation

 

[iamshadow21]

That’s right, sorry I couldn’t think of the right word at the time. Signatures. Has the Prosecution addressed that yet?

"Undoing" is a signature behaviour.

MOO

 

[MassGuy]

After lunch…

Defense attorney Brad Rozzi resumed questioning of Indiana State Police Sgt. Jason Page.

Page said it was not his job to determine the girls’ times of deaths when asked an opinion about when they may have happened.

“Do you know if a rape test kit was given?” Rozzi said.

“I would assume. I wasn’t there,” Page said.
I
Rozzi next asked about the sticks placed over the bodies. Page said he’s seen other death investigations where bodies had sticks placed over them. Page said, in Delphi, a human appeared to have placed the sticks over the girls’ bodies.

Rozzi also asked about the depth of Deer Creek, the size of the footprints, the blood around the area where the bodies were found, and about information on the hair found in Abby’s hand. Page responded, “You’re asking questions out of my knowledge.”

Page later explained his job — he was the 14th law enforcement officer to arrive at the crime scene — was to preserve the area through photography.

Prosecutors next called Indiana State Police Sgt. Duane Datzman, a crime scene technician, to the stand. He’s now retired, but was the CSI at the Delphi Murders crime scene. He has at least 20 years as a CSI, visiting hundreds of crime scenes.

Delphi Murders trial: Day 3 blog

Follow the trial of Richard Allen, accused of the Delphi Murders, as he faces charges for the deaths of Abby Williams and Libby German.

wishtv.com

This is a common tactic of asking questions of a witness that are outside their purview. They'll ask questions that they know the witness cannot answer, because it makes the witness look incompetent, and in turn, makes the investigation look sloppy.

I guarantee that at multiple points during this trial, people will say "oh my God, I can't believe they didn't do that."

Odds are someone did, but the person on the stand didn't.

 

[mrjitty]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1848456928210653355

Of note:

The bullet found after moving the bodies of Abby and Libby was not easy to see. It was found using a blue light that showed a sparkle.

Sounds like this clarifies that the bullet was not found days after the murder, after the scene was released, as has been claimed and speculated on in the past.

JMO

Yet another conspiracy debunked.

 

[Yemelyan]

After lunch…

Defense attorney Brad Rozzi resumed questioning of Indiana State Police Sgt. Jason Page.

Page said it was not his job to determine the girls’ times of deaths when asked an opinion about when they may have happened.

“Do you know if a rape test kit was given?” Rozzi said.

“I would assume. I wasn’t there,” Page said.
I
Rozzi next asked about the sticks placed over the bodies. Page said he’s seen other death investigations where bodies had sticks placed over them. Page said, in Delphi, a human appeared to have placed the sticks over the girls’ bodies.

Rozzi also asked about the depth of Deer Creek, the size of the footprints, the blood around the area where the bodies were found, and about information on the hair found in Abby’s hand. Page responded, “You’re asking questions out of my knowledge.”

Page later explained his job — he was the 14th law enforcement officer to arrive at the crime scene — was to preserve the area through photography.

Prosecutors next called Indiana State Police Sgt. Duane Datzman, a crime scene technician, to the stand. He’s now retired, but was the CSI at the Delphi Murders crime scene. He has at least 20 years as a CSI, visiting hundreds of crime scenes.

Delphi Murders trial: Day 3 blog

Follow the trial of Richard Allen, accused of the Delphi Murders, as he faces charges for the deaths of Abby Williams and Libby German.

wishtv.com

One thing that makes me really happy, if "happy" could be an emotion that I feel on this sad and emotional day, is that the crime scene techs were so experienced. We heard a lot in the intervening years from people who said "well the Delphi police likely didn't know how to analyse a crime scene" and for all we know that may be true, but the people who had to deal with this were, ultimately, very experienced at what they do, being part of ISP.

 

[Deleted member 229974]

<modsnip - quot4ed post was removed (no link) This post is referring to Todd Glick)>


So he wasn’t an investigator at the crime scene? Geez, it certainly was discussed in detail here in WS, IIRC.