Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #203

[Tealgrove]

I wish they took that house down to the studs.

Paul Bernardo.

They tore that house apart when they served the SW there. They were there for 2 weeks.

They did take some walls out. Nada.

What they never did was take the ceiling lights down.

Boom! The videotapes or the S.A’s of Kristen French, Leslie Mahaffey, Karla Himolka’s sister and a Jane Doe were found hidden in the ceiling above the light fixtures.

They always seem to find a way to hide those precious things.

 

[Charlot123]

Short beard or long beard, 2017 or sitting in court in 2024, fat or skinny? He doesn't look anything like he did seven years ago. Asking a witness to identify a suspect in the courtroom sounds more like TV drama than actual courtroom evidence.

View attachment 540336

View attachment 540337

All I have been looking at was a young face with curly hair and somewhat asymmetrical eyebrows + strabismus (one of the eyes pointing outward). It is such a specific symptom that I can't unsee it. Obviously, different witnesses saw different people. Likewise, the height. We were discussing if someone could be above 6" (it was the top at 2019 conference), but no one, ever, quoted it as low as 5'3".
Besides DNA, which was supposedly touch DNA, then some other DNA, now there is no foreign DNA (what about the searchers?)...what is science worth if the public was never provided with the age close to RA's true age? Or his height being close to RA's true height?

I am trying to imagine what happened, and can not. I just hope that ISP got their man.

 

[MiniMoo]

I don't find that witness credible.

I don't think credible either somehow.

Link: SC Testimony Muddy Bloody Man


JMO MOO JMT

 

[MiniMoo]

Been educated about white-washed jeans so have amended

JMO MOO JMT

 

[rez125]

Isn't it's spatter?

Who's typing this summary.

 

[rez125]

What colour pants or jeans would you all say BG is wearing?

IMO they appear to be blue.

According to Sarah Carbaugh in the attachment:

View attachment 540403
Link: White-Washed Jeans

JMO MOO JMT

Blue/white, 20/50, beautiful/face covered.

Who the heck knows!

 

[susiQ]

What colour pants or jeans would you all say BG is wearing?

IMO they appear to be blue.

According to Sarah Carbaugh in the attachment:

View attachment 540403
Link: White-Washed Jeans

JMO MOO JMT

Back in the day, we called lighter coloured jeans “white washed” in contrast to darker jeans. For me, the bigger take from SC’s testimony is that it changed over time. There was no mention of blood in he original interview. And, not surprisingly, there was a hour missing from one of her interviews! I mean seriously? More missing video? Oh my. JMHO

 

[FromGermany1]

DD was simply obtaining the identifying numbers on his phone, it's not like he would have been scrolling through it. There's no reason to believe Allen took any photos or videos that day anyways.

I know if I interviewed a guy like that, I would certainly be following up to see what came of it. This guy was at a minimum, a great lead, yet as you say, he seems to have forgotten all about him. Had he brought this up again, this would have progressed years ago.

It would be very interesting to know, WHO put "cleared" on RA's file, when even the big mistake with the surname (Whiteman/Allen) hadn't been discovered at that time.

When DC spoke of a mistake being made by LE staff and not made with intention of course, was that in 2019 within the PC? They changed the direction of their investigation, he said. Whiteman/Allen and the wrong filing obviously wasn't meant, but another mistake. Wonder, which error was mentioned by DC.

 

[girlhasnoname]

Day 11 in #Justice4Abby&Libby​

 

[MiniMoo]

Back in the day, we called lighter coloured jeans “white washed” in contrast to darker jeans. For me, the bigger take from SC’s testimony is that it changed over time.

That I didn't know. I have never heard of them described like that so have learnt something new.

Thanks for educating me about white-washed jeans.

Below though I can't ignore...



Link : 3 Interviews

JMO MOO JMT

 

[Cedars]

Day 11 in #Justice4Abby&Libby​

What happened to days 7,8,9 and 10?

 

[rez125]

It was not the complete opposite. Expand the nearly five 5 hours of watching AB's opinion and watch someone else or better yet, just read back a few pages here where the truth is told. <modsnip>

IMO

<modsnip>

I'm not looking for opinions, I watch the detailed recaps for words that were said.

As this trial is locked up tighter than fort Knox it's the next best thing to watching it fully myself.

 

[mrjitty]

Just to clarify in case there is confusion (maybe there isn't).

In 2022 RA said he didn't really notice people on the trail because he was watching stock prices on his phone as he walked.

LE already knew from tower dumps that his phone (that he used in 2017) hadn't pinged in the area that day.

My assumption is that means he either forgot, got mixed up, or wasn't telling the truth about watching stock tips. That's not a crime.

IMO the niggling thing is, why was he there, and yet his phone was not. He didn't say 'I often don't bring my phone when I go for walks', instead he brings attention to the phone that wasn't there.

JMO

This is something I've long wondered about - especially because the D didn't include this info in the Franks. The mast connections on the phone should clear their client. Unless the phone was not there, or was switched off.

My wild speculation, is he turns the phone off to create a crime window. We've seen this in so many cases.

 

[technicallymissing]

What colour pants or jeans would you all say BG is wearing?

IMO they appear to be blue.

According to Sarah Carbaugh in the attachment:

View attachment 540403
Link: White-Washed Jeans

JMO MOO JMT

What are you implying? There is zero chance Sarah meant that the man she saw was wearing white jeans. Either Sarah semi misspoke and said “white wash” instead of “light wash” or, just as likely, the reporter in that article wrote it that way. Page 112/283 of the documents released June 2023 have Sarah describing the man as wearing “a blue colored jacket and blue jeans”. Screenshot attached below for ref if you don’t want to go look at the docs themselves.

 

[MiniMoo]

What are you implying? There is zero chance Sarah meant that the man she saw was wearing white jeans. Either Sarah semi misspoke and said “white wash” instead of “light wash” or, just as likely, the reporter in that article wrote it that way. Page 112/283 of the documents released June 2023 have Sarah describing the man as wearing “a blue colored jacket and blue jeans”. Screenshot attached below for ref if you don’t want to go look at the docs themselves.
View attachment 540413

Someone was kind enough to explain what white-washed jeans meant and I amended that post.

Still not a credible witness for me though.

JMO MOO JMT

 

[Vern]

<modsnip>

I'm not looking for opinions, I watch the detailed recaps for words that were said.

As this trial is locked up tighter than fort Knox it's the next best thing to watching it fully myself.

I think what the OP is implying is that you can also utilize other "approved WS sources" and get a completely different take on the day. Those sources have also been linked in here today. I know this because I am currently listening to one of them after having missed the entire day of 'updates' ... and they are not all the same as this linked source.

That's why, in a trial like this that is not televised/streamed, it's important to get your info from multiple and varied sources. Not soley one source's 4hr+ video of their take/opinion. Because then to actually inform oneself fully, one would also have to sift through and listen to all the other hours+ sources for a full context and take on the actualities of the day. Thank goodness that I'm retired - I actually have time to do that.

Especially so when an individual source - whether it be MSM or a youtuber, is soley that - one person quickly scribbling down notes throughout an 8 hour day and coming back later with those scribbled notes to put out what they 'took' from the day based on what they managed to record (and apparently to hear).

 

[Niner]

Friday, October 25th:
*Trial continues (Day 7) (@ 9am ET) – IN – Abigail Joyce Williams (13) & Liberty Rose Lynn German (14) (Missing Feb. 13, 2017, found killed Feb. 14, 2017, after walking on a local hiking trail & were discovered around noon about 50 feet from the north bank of Deer Creek which is about 0.5 miles from the Monon High Bridge Trail, Delphi) – *Richard “Ricky/Rick” Matthew Allen (44 @ time of crime/50/now 52) arrested & booked (10/26/22) into the Carroll County Jail & charged & arraigned (10/28/22) with 2 counts of murder while committing or attempting to commit kidnapping of both victims. Plead not guilty. Held without bond.
Amended charges (1/18/24/granted 3/18/24): 2 counts of felony murder (knowingly & intentionally), 2 counts of murder (while committing or attempting to commit kidnapping of both victims). Transferred to White County jail from Carroll County for security reasons. And was transferred (11/2/22) to IN. DOC at Westville Correctional Facility at a more secure facility. Was awaiting transfer to Westville Correctional Facility but Judge Gull denied move (6/15/23). She plans to take the arguments under advisement & will make a ruling on whether or not he will be moved out of Westville at a later date. Judge Gull denied move (7/5/23). On 12/6/23 Allen was transferred from Westville to Wabash Valley Correctional Facility (long term segregation). Allen was booked (5/6/24) into the Allen County Jail [for hearing on 5/7/24]. Allen back (5/7/24) to Wabash Valley Correctional Facility. Judge Gull granted transfer of custody to the Carroll County Sheriff [instead of IDOC] but will be held in Cass County jail until trial [8/1/24]. Carroll County
Trial began with jury selection on 10/14/24 & ended 10/15/24.
Trial began on 10/18/24. Mondays thru Fridays from 9am to 6pm. Saturdays from 9am to noon.
*12 jurors (7 women & 5 men) & 4 alternates [3 women & 1 man]. Jury is sequestered.
Allen County Judge Frances C. Gull presiding. Carroll County Prosecutor Nicholas McLeland & Special Prosecutor James David Luttrull, Jr.
Andrew Baldwin & Bradley Rozzi are Allen’s public appointed attorneys & added Jennifer Auger [addressing the circumstances surrounding digital forensics].
Charges, case & court info from 4/19/21 thru 10/11/24 & Jury Selection Day 1-2 (10/14-10/15/24) & thru 10/16/24 & Trial Day 1-5 (10/18-23/24) reference post #6 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...hi-murders-richard-allen-arrested-203.726949/
10/14/24 Docket update: Order Issued. Comes now the Court & having reviewed Defendant Allen's Motion for Order on Designated Defense Representatives, now grants said Motion & authorizes Max Baker to act as designated representative of the Defense Team during the course of the trial in this cause. Accordingly, Max Baker will be excluded as a potential defense witness pursuant to Rule 615 of the Indiana Rules of Trial Procedure.
10/18/24 Docket update: Order or Judgment of the Court. Order prohibiting defense use of sketches: Judge Gull granted the prosecution motion to prohibit the defense from using the composite sketches of ‘bridge guy’ in the trial. Denying defense's motion to use sketches.
10/28/24 Docket update: First Joint Stipulations regarding evidentiary Matters. The prosecution & defense have agreed that certain evidence may be admitted to the trial without having to have an expert or witness verifying its origins or confirming a chain of custody. These items include videos of Allen while in custody, medical records & items collected at the crime scene.
10/18/24 Docket update: Instructions of Court pursuant to Criminal Rule 8 & Jury Rule 20 of the Supreme Court of the State of Indiana. Judge Gull released the instructions the jury will receive when the trial is nearly concluded.
10/20/24 Docket update: Order for Transport. The court has arranged for transportation for inmate Kegan Kline to come to the Carroll County court to testify.
10/21/24 Docket Update: Order or Judgment of the Court. Order returning equipment: Judge Gull returned cameras & equipment to members of the media, after the court confiscated them for violating decorum rules.
*All the above docket updates see post #38, Page 2-Day 6 blog.
10/24/24 Docket update: Motion to Quash Subpoena. Defense attorneys had filed [10/22/24] a subpoena on former Carroll County Prosecuting attorney Robert Ives. Requesting his testimony at the trial. Ives is trying to quash the subpoena filed by his counsel Thomas J. O'Brien. See post #123, page 7, thread 203.
10/24/24 Thursday, Trial Day 6: State witnesses: Kathy Shank. Shank acted as a “secretary” for the investigation. [Found the interview of Allen on 2/18/17 in files]. Dan Dulin is a Captain with the Dept. of Natural Resources for the State. [He was tasked with assisting with and following up on leads. He told the jury he received a lead on Richard Allen and he contacted Allen by phone. Dulin told the jury that he requested to meet with Allen at his home, then police headquarters. Allen refused and requested that they met at a grocery store parking lot]. Steve Mullin [former Chief of Delphi police, now investigator for Carroll County Prosecutor's office] back on stand. Carroll County Sheriff Tony Liggett. Former Delphi Police Chief Steve Mullin back on stand. Indiana State Police Trooper David Vido [was involved in searching Allen’s home on Oct. 13, 2022, and taking photos there that day and other days]. Indiana State Police Lt. Jerry Holeman. [He supervised the search of Allen’s home on Oct. 13, 2022].
For more info see post #38 (Day 6 blog) here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ders-richard-allen-arrested-203.726949/page-2
Trial continues on Friday, 10/25/24 @ 9am.

 

[sunshineray]

I listened to TMS Day Six for the trial.
When Jerry Holeman testified about the search RA said something a couple times. Now while we can never know exactly the way another person's mind works in any given situation, RA's words are interesting in the context of what was going on and being said to him at the time he spoke them, IMO.

The first time Holeman approached RA saying, (paraphrasing) we're going to try and be careful as we search, but if something gets damaged during the search there's a form you can fill out to get reimbursement to fix it.

RA answered, " It doesn't matter. It's over."

The RA asked, (paraphrasing) where his wife was, did they arrest her? Holeman replied that she couldn't use the bathroom at the house because of the search, she went to her work to use the bathroom. Do you want me to bring you there to her?

RA answered, "It doesn't matter. It's over."

The conversation that was occurring each time, once about damage to his home and another about being with his wife are two very important things in a person's life...home and family.

I must say his choice of words do not sound, IMO, like what an innocent man would be saying who was just told his home was in danger of possible damage or his wife had actually removed herself to another place at what was I'm sure a very stressful situation.

I think if being an innocent person in such a situation, I'd be saying, yeah I'd sure appreciate if you didn't damage stuff, this is my home! Or I'd want to call my spouse to make sure they were ok. If they had taken my phone away (for the search) I'd ask to use someone's phone to call my spouse or take him up on the ride and be with my spouse.

Very out of place and pessimistic choice of words, for an innocent man, in that situation.
"It doesn't matter. It's over." What was all over in his mind and why?

All of this is just my opinion.

 

[sunshineray]

Yeah maybe he had a burner and it wasn’t the one he handed DD. Must have nerves of steel though imo if he killed the kids or was involved and then reported himself / handed over his phone / met with DD and officers etc. mooo

You hear about it a lot in true crime stories, the guilty party, trying to inserting themselves somehow in the investigation. Who knows maybe he was hoping deep down that he'd be caught? Maybe the guilt, right after the murders, was very great indeed? Just some thoughts

 

[katydid23]

No pitfalls. Defense is going to be able to question him about all the things (lies) LE told him when they were trying to get him to confess to killing the girls. The prosecution will then have to try to repair by explaining that LE can lie, with no repercussions, to anyone in the course of an investigation, even in an attempt to coerce a confession.

So? I think most people know that LE can lie during interrogations. I am pretty sure the jurors know that already too. IMO