Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #206

[Bbgiraffe]

Dbm.

 

[Bbgiraffe]

If I were RA, under the assumption that RA=BG, nothing would have prevented me from somehow leaving Delphi during those years before the arrest. But he just stood there in plain sight.

No fear, one of the cardinal traits of a sociopath. And yet, why do I sense fear in almost every picture of him after the arrest?

He is afraid because he knows what happens to people like him in prison. See Dahmer for reference.

 

[statt#1]

The major portion of the State's discovery was dropped off by R&B's assistant in early April. RA had already written a confession to the Warden as was posted here dated March 5th.

RA told KA in November right after his arrest, that if it became 'too much for her' he would just plead guilty.

JMO

I surmise in a jury deliberation these confessions, and a few other things said by RA, will be difficult to ignore.

 

[Bergmann]

But that could be down to his meds….the spaced out look.

You can always see what you want to see and read into a lot of this - its the old 'he looks guilty' standard of proof. I hope we're not going to indulge that level of self confirmatory speculation.

This is where we have got to though in the case IMO - state's evidence in the court room has been weak and inconclusive so far and therefore what's left is likely to be highly subjective in nature, a lot of conjecture and wishful inference etc.

Unless the alleged confessions are absolutely irrefutable and watertight then I don't know where the state goes from here. The internet search history at this point smacks of desperation IMO, especially at this stage.

As the state's case has progressed its got weaker not stronger IMO which has surprised me because I thought they had the motherlode on RA, but apparently not. As the case has got weaker the standard of evidence needed to convict also appears to be lowering accordingly.

So this is going to put a ton of pressure on the alleged confessions and we're going to have to endure all manner of interpretations about the context for and against. This isn't how I wanted to see this go down if I'm honest. RA wasn't arrested and charged based on these, that was the PCA which the state hasn't effectively landed in court IMO. So here we are and it looks to be hinging on alleged confessions and debates about how these were derived, and in the finality, how convinced the jury are.

All JMO.

 

[girlhasnoname]

“Psychosis refers to a collection of symptoms that affect the mind, where there has been some loss of contact with reality. During an episode of psychosis, a person’s thoughts and perceptions are disrupted and they may have difficulty recognizing what is real and what is not.”

Understanding Psychosis

This fact sheet presents information on psychosis including causes, signs and symptoms, treatment, and resources for help.

www.nimh.nih.gov

I believe seeing in black and white the State's main case against him, and the realization that all the world would know of his sick, perverted actions that day is what sent RA into a meltdown. Not full blown psychosis, just the realization that he was caught. His 'psychosis' conveniently lasted from approx April 5th to June 15th.

Most telling to me is that the Defense did not order an independent Psych Evaluation of their own client who was suffering such mental distress. Why not?

Those dates are important as that is when the Defense finally started paying attention, took the faked up picture of RA drooling in a chair, describing his dog cell and him being lead around on a leash, etc. The campaign to portray RA as severely mentally deficient as possible started after his confessions to his Wife and Mother on a recorded prison phone line were caught and submitted to the Prosecution.

Super coincidental, and then, RA coincidentally regained his mental acumen after the June 15th hearings. Pfffft. I'm not buying what this Defense is selling.

As always, JMO

 

[girlhasnoname]

See, I think maybe this is one area where my autism gives me a different perspective. To me, photographs of serial killers and Nobel Peace Prize recipients alike just look like... people. I don't think a photograph of someone can tell you anything about their thoughts, intentions, or the dark secrets of the heart. It's all in the perception of the viewer, and knowing that someone is accused of something heinous, a lot of people perceive ill intent or malice where I just see a resting face, boredom, attention, curiosity...

Video, you might see expressions that give you more, but a photograph? To me, it reveals nothing that marks a killer from a nonkiller.

Shakespeare said it pretty well. "There's no art to find the mind's construction in the face."

I see a guy I could have passed on the street or had serve me at a pharmacy and never thought about again. And obviously, that's true, because he passed for normal for five whole years and wasn't tripped up by being spotted as a monster, he was caught because he'd done what he thought a regular, helpful human being would do - reported he'd been at the scene of the crime.

MOO

I totally respect your opinion, even if I don't agree.

I'm not saying a walking, talking, pool playing or working RA looked that way, I am saying that still shot photos of him show his eyes in that fashion to me.

JMO

 

[snarast]

He is afraid because he knows what happens to people like him in prison. See Dahmer for reference.

Sociopaths generally don’t display or feel fear. See Gacy’s last words for reference.

But maybe RA has spotted an orca in his surroundings. Anyway, you can’t really tell anything from expressions - some people live for deception just for fun, so…

IMO

 

[girlhasnoname]

This one says Abby was moved.

"At one point, Cicero highlighted that the patterns on Libby's cheeks were consistent with tears. At that point, Libby's grandmother, Becky Patty, put her head down and cried."

"Cicero said the blood on Abby's chin was a sign she had been moved, because blood would normally flow down from a neck wound, not up."

"Cicero said he believes Abby died where she was injured"

Tips pour in after suspect identified in Delphi double homicide

The search continues for the person who killed two teenage friends in Delphi one week ago.

www.wthr.com

Just Abby's head was possibly moved or turned, I can hardly type that it's so gruesome.

Abby and Libby suffered horrendous deaths, they are the victims. Truth and Justice for these innocent young girls.

JMO

 

[girlhasnoname]

I am going by the official start date of Oct 14th:

Day 15 in #Justice4Abby&Libby

​

 

[shonyakay]

Is there any evidence of this prior to incarceration?

I haven't seen any accounts of his behavour prior to imprisonment.

Dr. Wala's testimony revealed that he was given psychotropic drugs in his 20's.

It was also revealed that he stayed at a mental institution for one week in 2019. I don't know the exact dates but I'm interested to find out if that stay was before or after the second sketch presser.

 

[rez125]

Dr. Wala's testimony revealed that he was given psychotropic drugs in his 20's.

It was also revealed that he stayed at a mental institution for one week in 2019. I don't know the exact dates but I'm interested to find out if that stay was before or after the second sketch presser.

I had read he suffered from depression and anxiety.

 

[shonyakay]

Just Abby's head was possibly moved or turned, I can hardly type that it's so gruesome.

Abby and Libby suffered horrendous deaths, they are the victims. Truth and Justice for these innocent young girls.

JMO

I looked back at his testimony and he does say her body may have turned. He gives the option of her body turning or her head turning that caused that blood flow pattern to be sustained. I do think it was the latter, like you mentioned, because the phone was under her and there was no recorded movement after 2:32 p.m.

 

[shonyakay]

Jury Q's.


I had read he suffered from depression and anxiety.

Correct. Depression/Anxiety can also lead to psychosis if severe enough.

 

[FrostedGlass]

You can always see what you want to see and read into a lot of this - its the old 'he looks guilty' standard of proof. I hope we're not going to indulge that level of self confirmatory speculation.

This is where we have got to though in the case IMO - state's evidence in the court room has been weak and inconclusive so far and therefore what's left is likely to be highly subjective in nature, a lot of conjecture and wishful inference etc.

Unless the alleged confessions are absolutely irrefutable and watertight then I don't know where the state goes from here. The internet search history at this point smacks of desperation IMO, especially at this stage.

As the state's case has progressed its got weaker not stronger IMO which has surprised me because I thought they had the motherlode on RA, but apparently not. As the case has got weaker the standard of evidence needed to convict also appears to be lowering accordingly.

So this is going to put a ton of pressure on the alleged confessions and we're going to have to endure all manner of interpretations about the context for and against. This isn't how I wanted to see this go down if I'm honest. RA wasn't arrested and charged based on these, that was the PCA which the state hasn't effectively landed in court IMO. So here we are and it looks to be hinging on alleged confessions and debates about how these were derived, and in the finality, how convinced the jury are.

All JMO.

Of all the things you said, it's this right here for me. IMO, they truly needed those confessions. What a gift RA gave the prosecution.

RA wasn't arrested and charged based on these, that was the PCA which the state hasn't effectively landed in court IMO.

 

[sunshineray]

The major portion of the State's discovery was dropped off by R&B's assistant in early April. RA had already written a confession to the Warden as was posted here dated March 5th.

RA told KA in November right after his arrest, that if it became 'too much for her' he would just plead guilty.

JMO

And at the June 15, 2023 hearing, Westville's warden testified he recieved 5 or 6 letters from RA. If that first was March 3rd the others may have quickly followed and came before April.
MO

6.15.23 Safekeeping - Google Drive

 

[iamshadow21]

I totally respect your opinion, even if I don't agree.

I'm not saying a walking, talking, pool playing or working RA looked that way, I am saying that still shot photos of him show his eyes in that fashion to me.

JMO

Absolutely fine, you don't have to agree with me or I with you. I'm aware my perspective is coloured by my neurotype.

But the serious offender who passed for normal? That's a thing, regardless. Far more do that than most people would be comfortable with accepting. I think it comes as less of a shock to me than some, because I never assume that I understand a person's intentions because of their face. I find a face a very unreliable indicator of anything, good or ill.

MOO

 

[shonyakay]

People on the prior thread (205) are discussing whether RA kept souvenirs. Considering the muddy/bloody and interrupted BG, I think it is doubtful (still possible, though) there are souvenirs. If there were a souvenir, it would be a cryptic one, and I think it could be that bullet in the keepsake box from the bedroom, jmo.

Logically, I'd say no souvenirs. But the killer doesn't appear to always have been thinking clearly, so we can't be sure. Still, with RA having several years in which to consider his options, my guess would be no souvenirs, and if there is one, it is the keepsake bullet. All MOO.

LE relayed that missing articles of clothing was missing from the scene. They believed it was possible that these missing items may have been kept as Souvenirs by the killer.

It would be an absolute slam dunk for the prosecution if they found one of these items in RA's possession. They said no DNA links RA to the scene of the crime but that doesn't necessarily mean something missing from the crime scene wasn't found in his possession.

Someone here mentioned that the last page of RA's (either his Search Warrant or PCA) wasn't publicly released.

 

[mrjitty]

Another shout out for this excellent Prosecutors Podcast. What is valuable about these guys is they tend to focus much more on legal practice than theories of the case - for instance, they are the only guys i know of who actually conducted an indepth review of Indiana SODDI law which predicted the logical outcome quite well.

In this coverage, Brett makes a solid point that there really is not reasonable doubt that Bridge Guy did the murders at the crime scene, and then left. The second location and murders in the dead of night are wild speculation for which there is literally no real evidence.

So why is the D spending so much time on suggesting BGs potential innocence?

The answer is that if you step back from the case (which is difficult for those who followed it so long), RA has essentially admitted he is BG. So they do seem to be hedging to say that even if you think RA is BG, you can't convict.

MOO.

PodcastOne, Inc. - Investor Relations

www.podcastone.com

 

[FrostedGlass]

I was a Certified Med Tech back in the 80s and administered this medication. It has horrible side affects like (Tardive Dyskinesia) as well as others. I'm surprised its even still around. I'm wondering what was going on with RA for him to be administered this medication? If someone knows?

Here's some of the history of his medical episodes:
[snip]
March 23, 2023: Allen was depressed and withdrawn and said he “was not straight in the head."
April 4, 2023: Allen suffered from insomnia, hopelessness, was suicidal, and stated “death would bring relief to him."
April 13, 2023: Allen was exhibiting “bizarre” behavior, including consuming his own feces, and was suffering from a “grave disability.” The prison psychologist ordered Allen receive an involuntary injection of psychotropic medication.
April 21, 2023: Allen’s thoughts were disjointed and he was saying “strange things.” Wala discussed that he might be considered incompetent to stand trial.
May 3, 2023: Allen said he wanted to confess details of the crime.
May 18, 2023: Allen receives another dose of psychotropic medication.
May 23, 2023: Allen diagnosed as suffering from stress-induced psychosis.
June 8, 2023: Allen’s depression “at its peak,” noted trembling, knees buckling.
June 16, 2023: Allen receives another dose of psychotropic medication.
Late June, 2023: Allen’s mental health improving.
October 2023: Allen was proclaiming his innocence.

Judge rules Delphi murders suspect Richard Allen to be moved to county jail

It is not yet known where Allen will be housed or when he will be moved to a new jail.

www.wthr.com

*****************************
[snips]
Wala testified Allen came to the WCF already on suicide watch, and he remained there for approximately a month.
She also added that she visited with Allen — via a crack in his door — on a daily basis during that time.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/jail-confessions-highlight-delphi-hearing-035900542.html?guccounter=1

 

[sunshineray]

See, I think maybe this is one area where my autism gives me a different perspective. To me, photographs of serial killers and Nobel Peace Prize recipients alike just look like... people. I don't think a photograph of someone can tell you anything about their thoughts, intentions, or the dark secrets of the heart. It's all in the perception of the viewer, and knowing that someone is accused of something heinous, a lot of people perceive ill intent or malice where I just see a resting face, boredom, attention, curiosity...

Video, you might see expressions that give you more, but a photograph? To me, it reveals nothing that marks a killer from a nonkiller.

Shakespeare said it pretty well. "There's no art to find the mind's construction in the face."

I see a guy I could have passed on the street or had serve me at a pharmacy and never thought about again. And obviously, that's true, because he passed for normal for five whole years and wasn't tripped up by being spotted as a monster, he was caught because he'd done what he thought a regular, helpful human being would do - reported he'd been at the scene of the crime.

MOO

Interesting. We also though know very little about his life from anyone...good or bad comments. That's quite remarkable in and of itself. MO