Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #210

[ClearAhead]

That's a classic sign of a Narc. Threatening suicide when things don't go their way or they are outed in their lies, manipulations, and in this case IMO, murder.

If RA wanted to commit suicide, he's had plenty of chances to do it from 2017 to 2024. Nope, he love his sick self to much. He'd rather take advantage and flex power over 2 completely innocent children, Abby & Libby.

JMO

I agree. Threatening suicide has probably worked for him all this life.

 

[minor4th]

And yet his defenders are saying he went through Discovery and crafted a complicated, yet coherent and detailed confession, to tell to his Therapist.

I haven’t seen anyone say that. And it’s disputed whether he ever gave a coherent and detailed confession to his therapist. We don’t have recordings of those statements. We don’t know what else he said in that same conversation. We don’t know what his behavior was like on that day. , but we do know around that time he was eating feces and drinking out of the toilet and expressing confusion about what was happening and “losing his mind.”

Based on the chaotic and disorganized “confessions” he made to his family around the same time, it’s reasonable to also assume that his statements to his therapist were similarly chaotic and disorganized.

 

[NoeticSoul]

I have no idea whether the defense was notified of all these so-called confessions, but I do know they tried several times to have the safekeeping order vacated so that RA could be transferred due to his deteriorating mental health.

If RA had continued to be refused treatment and had not regained his competency, I’m sure the defense would have sought a competency evaluation. They did file a motion to have the confessions excluded because of their unreliability due to RA’s severe mental illness.

There was much more the D could have done to seek a competency evaluation and then some imo They chose not to. moo

 

[katydid23]

Please, correct me if I’m wrong, but don’t “We The People, which includes a judge and jury, supposed to consider a defendant innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt before they make assumptions? TIA IMO

The jurors, YES.

People in a true crime discussion forum---NO. IMO

 

[susiQ]

Yes the FBI have the tech and other smaller labs as well.

I don't know why they didn't ask for their help.

They did in fact ask for their help. ISP Superintendent Doug Carter asked his friend Jay Abbott of the FBI for help. And then according to DC’s testimony on Saturday asked them to leave and return all investigative material. Go figure!

 

[MassGuy]

In my opinion, there is no way Allen is acquitted. The jury will do their job and find him guilty. He will never be free again. JMO.

I absolutely believe he is guilty, but I’m not willing to go all-in on a conviction. There’s a lot going on here, and there’s a lot more skepticism here than in most cases (from people following).

And I hate to say it, but even if he is found guilty, I don’t think this is anywhere close to over.

 

[Myvice]

I have no idea whether the defense was notified of all these so-called confessions, but I do know they tried several times to have the safekeeping order vacated so that RA could be transferred due to his deteriorating mental health.

If RA had continued to be refused treatment and had not regained his competency, I’m sure the defense would have sought a competency evaluation. They did file a motion to have the confessions excluded because of their unreliability due to RA’s severe mental illness.

I may have misunderstood. I thought it was RA refusing treatment and the medications ended up having to be administered against his wishes.

 

[steeltowngirl]

Anybody know why April 2022 calls were mentioned at trial?

Rozzi references the Nov. 2022 call where Allen says he was “willing to do whatever it took to make sure his wife didn’t take the heat.” He mentions the April 2022 call where Allen referenced a call he made to his stepdad. Harshman confirms that Allen did make a call earlier that day to his parent’s house at 3:12 a.m. He confirms that Allen made a call that same day at 8:45 a.m.

Delphi Murders trial: Day 12 live blog

Day 12 of the Delphi Murders trial begins with the jury expected to hear two hours of audio.

www.wishtv.com

 

[minor4th]

He did not sound incoherent or delusional in those phone calls. What was his intent in telling the people he loved the most, that he killed Abby and Libby?

Wow. I disagree. From the transcripts posted, he sounded completely off his rocker, totally detached from reality. I believe he was very delusional and incoherent. He said he didn’t understand what was happening; he said several times he was losing his mind; he confessed to killing his entire family and best friend; he expressed that he “thinks” he killed them and questioned whether he did; and some of his statements seemed to be complete gibberish.

 

[girlhasnoname]

I don’t think any physical evidence has been provided that there was an attempted and interrupted R-word.

SA doesn't have to be rape. The fact that he forced Libby and Abby to disrobe against their will is SA.IMO

 

[minor4th]

I may have misunderstood. I thought it was RA refusing treatment and the medications ended up having to be administered against his wishes.

No, you’re right about that.

 

[minor4th]

SA doesn't have to be rape. The fact that he forced Libby and Abby to disrobe against their will is SA.IMO

I agree but RA specifically used the R-word I believe.

 

[girlhasnoname]

Forcing girls to undress shows attempt.

jmo

Or some type of assault not necessarily penetration. JMO

 

[minor4th]

Anybody know why April 2022 calls were mentioned at trial?

Rozzi references the Nov. 2022 call where Allen says he was “willing to do whatever it took to make sure his wife didn’t take the heat.” He mentions the April 2022 call where Allen referenced a call he made to his stepdad. Harshman confirms that Allen did make a call earlier that day to his parent’s house at 3:12 a.m. He confirms that Allen made a call that same day at 8:45 a.m.

Delphi Murders trial: Day 12 live blog

Day 12 of the Delphi Murders trial begins with the jury expected to hear two hours of audio.

www.wishtv.com

I think that must be a typo.

 

[susiQ]

Didn’t one of those tests of another suspect’s gun come back as “inconclusive”? I wonder how they differentiate between inconclusive and match?

Excellent question!

 

[Boxer]

Yep---apparently he confessed too many times to too many people.

We can't believe the inmates because they are convicts. We can't believe the guards because they work for the state.
We can't believe his therapist because she peeked into another convict's file and she posted on social media about the case.
We can't believe our own ears when he confessed to his wife and mother because he is psychotic---even though he was speaking calmly and coherently.

So 60 plus confessions can all be explained away because reasons....

Exactly, and this is for every single thing.
The the original statement to Dan Dulin, the missing phone from 2/13/17, his build and height (5% of men are 5'4") the voice, the time line, the car, the clothes, the girls on the trail, not seeing A and L after the witness passed them going to the bridge, the .40 cal P226, the box cutter, the no sexual assault knowledge, the van and the confessions.

 

[Myvice]

That's a classic sign of a Narc. Threatening suicide when things don't go their way or they are outed in their lies, manipulations, and in this case IMO, murder.

If RA wanted to commit suicide, he's had plenty of chances to do it from 2017 to 2024. Nope, he love his sick self to much. He'd rather take advantage and flex power over 2 completely innocent children, Abby & Libby.

JMO

IMOO, he used these same tactics on his wife and mother. He told his wife "if she couldn't handle the pressure" he would tell LE what happened. And he wanted his mother to promise to still love him if he did it putting responsibility on her for his decision. At the meeting with LE that KA attended he made a comment that KA was not involved as if that had ever been in question which made me feel like he was trying to guilt KA to stand by him in the same way. MOO

 

[katydid23]

I haven’t seen anyone say that.

I have seen it implied by people here discussing if he saw it in discovery about the white van or if he heard it in police interviews somehow.

Even if he did, he'd have to know the Weber's were out of town and his son would be coming over to water the plants. That seems unlikely for him or Wala to have known.

And it’s disputed whether he ever gave a coherent and detailed confession to his therapist. We don’t have recordings of those statements.

So his therapist made it all up? He never said those things to her in the confession?

She had daily notes and had discussions about the confession with her supervisor.

We don’t know what else he said in that same conversation. We don’t know what his behavior was like on that day

I think Wala had a daily observation log. I'm pretty sure the D has seen that log and would have looked to see what the notations said.

. , but we do know around that time he was eating feces and drinking out of the toilet and expressing confusion about what was happening and “losing his mind.”

How close to around the same time? It has to be within hours of that time to be seen as him in psychosis, imo.

Also, there was some discussion about malingering.

Based on the chaotic and disorganized “confessions” he made to his family around the same time,

You think those confessions to his mom were chaotic and disorganised? How so?
Reports said he was very calm and measured. He followed and tracked the conversation perfectly and answered everyone of her questions very well.

it’s reasonable to also assume that his statements to his therapist were similarly chaotic and disorganized.

I disagree. His confessions to his wife and mother were reported to sound very calm and logical. I saw no chaotic or disorganised behaviour in his confessions to family. IMO

What did you specifically note as chaotic/disorganised in his confessions to his mother ?

 

[ClearAhead]

There was much more the D could have done to seek a competency evaluation and then some imo They chose not to. moo

Possibly it might’ve proven problematic for the D to seek a competency evaluation capable of separating prison treatment from his pre-existing conditions?

'I killed Abby and Libby': Prison psychologist says Richard Allen confessed to Delphi murders

"I killed Abby and Libby," Allen reportedly said. "I will kill everyone. I will wipe out everybody," Dr. Monica Wala testified.

www.indystar.com

Wala also said Allen was a "fragile" man when he arrived at the facility. Allen has a history with major depressive disorder and anxiety and showed signs of dependent personality syndrome, a mental health condition that involves an excessive need to be taken care of by others.

 

[girlhasnoname]

I think that the absence of evidence of the r-word and the fact that they were undressed along with the confessions of RA that his original intention was SA and it was interrupted are taken together as a plausible explanation that SA was the goal and it didn’t happen as planned-

I wasn’t there, i don’t know what happened and I have serious concerns about due process- and I think that the P made it sound like a slam dunk obvious case BARD and I don’t think that is how this case has played out - and all of that is independent of what I think about RA’s guilt - moo

The P never talked about this case being a slam dunk, if you have a link stating they did so please link it. No trial is a slam dunk when you are dealing with 12 people all coming from different backgrounds and from their own personal experiences.

What I believe the State has laid out plainly is that RA-BG-Killer. To think it would be anyone else would be to deny all plausible and reasonable explanation. Yes, hypothetically Big Foot could have been at the bottom of the hill and done this terrible deed, but is that reasonable? One man, self admittedly, dressed as BG was on that bridge that day, filmed by Libby and his name is Richard Allen.

EBM: Duplicate wording
JMO