Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #210

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  • #261
I’m not required to prove anything. But you avoided my question - how was RA saying he hadn’t seen Libby or Abby helpful to police (truth or lie)? The reason is to attempt to remove himself as a POI. if he wasn’t the LAST to see them, then gosh he couldn’t have murdered them.
Maybe he didn’t see them on the bridge. Perhaps he decided to turn around and leave. While the video makes it appear that he is right there near the girls, we don’t actually know how far away he was from them when the video was taken. The extremely short recording of “guys down the hill”, could be another person the girls met there. We don’t know.
IMO
 
  • #262
Dr. Wala corroborated what RA had already said himself, to his family and many others.

He killed Abigal Williams and Liberty German.
View attachment 542712
I don’t believe a word of what Wala had to say. She was unethical in her “care” of RA, accessed records she wasn’t supposed to… she was all over the podcasts, and various social media platforms regarding this case etc etc. His statements were vague and left more questions for me than answers - especially how nothing from his car tied him to the kids or the murders. See my prior posts for links to the articles and quotes I posted and for a better explanation of this post which I won’t reiterate here. Moo.
 
  • #263
IIRC The vehicle by the transfer station was a box truck.
On the 13th it was. Not a white van there on the 13th though, that was the 14th. That's the point.
 
  • #264
I think they were shown the treatment he endured at the prison.

Per LL multiple jurors were wiping away tears whilst watching.
What treatment?
I see suicide and harm risk reduction measures to keep him and others safe. If he was acting normally his protocols would be normal.
 
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  • #265
Only via opinions of some witnesses on the stand as far as I know - not proven with any sort of forensics or software that I’m aware of. Moo. In three words on the video I don’t think any meaningful comparison can be made. Mooo
More uncertainty. IMO
 
  • #266
An expert no. But the video was played for the jury more than once. After hearing RA’s voice during the phonecalls they could draw their own conclusions.
and they may conclude it sounds the same or not. I wonder if hearing the witnesses say it sounded the same may have prejudiced some of the jurors? Unfair to allow them to do so imo.
 
  • #267
What treatment?
I see suicide and harm risk reduction measures to keep hin and others safe. If he was acting normally his protocols would be normal.

The treatment his D has been arguing for years now.

Interestingly the warden said on the stand none of these videos had audio (RA was recorded 24 hours a day).

The videos played in court today all had audio, which wasn't played. Per DD and LL.
 
  • #268
The treatment his D has been arguing for years now.

Interestingly the warden said on the stand none of these videos had audio (RA was recorded 24 hours a day).

The videos played in court today all had audio, which wasn't played. Per DD and LL.
The videos with audio were taken with a camcorder, as opposed to the prison surveillance system which apparently doesn’t have audio.

So no, the warden wasn’t lying, if that’s what those YouTubers are implying.
 
  • #269
Well she's an elected official, and up for re-election in 2 years.

I'm not sure I can say with a straight face that the rulings have been fair thus far, considering the history between Judge and DT.

Interestingly Gull was a proponent of the pilot program for televising trials.
I can certainly say with a straight face she's been fair, more than fair with the DT. She's been unbiased as ruled unanimously by SCOIN. She even let RA keep his dignity by not letting the courtroom see his naked and revolting images. A dignity that Abby and Libby did not get.

Even though I'd have very much wanted to see the trial, I agree with JG about not allowing cameras. I do wish a media room with piped in audio had been allowed.
AJMO
 
  • #270
Sharing this prior post of mine for those who may have missed it.

February 13, 2017

At 12:43 p.m. three teen girls and a little girl take a picture on the Monon High Bridge.

At 1:26 p.m. Those same girls take a picture on a bench after having walked the entirety of the approximately one mile trail. They then head westbound toward Freedom Bridge.

At 1:27 p.m. A car that resembles Richard Allen's 2016 Black Ford Focus is seen traveling westbound on CR 300 N. Heading in the direction of the former CPS building.

In his first statement, Richard Allen, says he parked at the old farm bureau building. He says he headed toward Freedom Bridge. He said he was on the trails that day from 1:30 to 3:30 p.m.

In the vicinity of the Freedom Bridge the three teen girls see a man. They describe him as "kind of creepy", "not very tall", had his hands in his pockets, wearing blue or black jeans and a blue or black jacket. He had gray hair maybe a little brown.
He matched the man in the still photo from LG's cellphone video.

Richard Allen said at the Freedom Bridge he saw three females. One was taller and had brown or black hair. He then says he walked to the High Bridge.

Just before 1:46 p.m.
Betsy Blair observed four girls (The three teen girls and the little girl) walking on the bridge over State Road 25 as she was driving underneath.

At 1:46 p.m.
Betsy Blair's car is seen traveling eastbound.
She parks her car across from the Mears farm and starts walking toward the High Bridge.

At 1:49 p.m. Kelsi drops Libby and Abby off across from the Mears' farm.

When Betsy Blair makes it to the High Bridge she
sees a man wearing blue jeans and a blue jeans jacket standing on platform One approximately 50 feet away. He matched the man from the still photo from Libby's cellphone video.

Richard Allen said in his 2022 statement that at the High Bridge he walked out onto platform One. He described himself as wearing blue jeans and a blue or black jacket.

Betsy turns around to finish her walk and halfway between the high bridge and the Mears' farm parking area she sees two girls who she believes to be Libby and Abby. They were headed to the High Bridge.

At 2:05 p.m.
Libby takes a picture of the bridge in between the second and third platforms.

At 2:07 p.m.
Libby gets on the third platform and turns around to take a picture of Abby walking across High Bridge.

Around 2:10 p.m.
A man on his way to Delphi on State Road 25 observes a purple PT cruiser or a small suv type vehicle parked on the South side of the old CPS building. It was backed in as though to conceal it's license plate.

At 2:13 p.m.
While at the end of the High Bridge or very close to it Libby, who is turned toward the beginning of the bridge, begins recording video of a man on her cell phone. The man is coming from the direction of the beginning of the bridge. He is between the fifth and six platforms at the end of the bridge walking behind Abby.

At 2:14 p.m.
Betsy Blair's car is seen leaving westbound from the trails. As she passes by the old CPS building she sees a car parked in an odd manner. It is in the same general spot and backed in like the man observed around 2:10 p.m.

Around 2:28 p.m.
A man sees a small dark colored car parked at the old CPS building. He describes it as possibly a smart car.

At 2:32 p.m.
Libby's phone ceases movement, according to the Apple Health Data on her cellphone.

At 3:57 p.m.
Sarah Carbaugh is driving eastbound down CR 300 N when she sees a man walking westbound away from the Monon High bridge. He matches the man in the still photo from LG's cellphone video. He appears muddy, bloody, and like he's been in a fight.

There were other individuals on the trails or CR 300 N from 2:30 p.m. to 4:11 p.m. and none of these people saw a man resembling Richard Allen on the trails.
There is some more information that has since come out from the trial. For instance the movements/steps from Libby' phone. The fact RA stated he drove by the Mears' entrance when he arrived at the trails etc.

Also I do need to correct where I stated BG was at when he was caught on Libby's video. He is actually just slightly past the 6th platform. This was verified by the I.D episode "Down the Hill".
I supplied a photo from that episode below.
He is approximately 40 feet from the end of he Bridge. Libby's video is 43 seconds.

Screenshot_20241030_060555_Chrome.jpg
 
  • #271
I can certainly say with a straight face she's been fair, more than fair with the DT. She's been unbiased as ruled unanimously by SCOIN. She even let RA keep his dignity by not letting the courtroom see his naked and revolting images. A dignity that Abby and Libby did not get.

Even though I'd have very much wanted to see the trial, I agree with JG about not allowing cameras. I do wish a media room with piped in audio had been allowed.
AJMO

AFAIA SCOIN have not ruled over any judgements in this trial. That's what I'm talking about.

The P could have asked for the crime scene and bodies of the girls not be shown to the gallery, like the D asked in reference to their evidence today.

The P did not.

Yes agree an overflow room would be helpful.
 
  • #272
If it was recorded, that’s one of the recordings that was lost/taped over by police.
Even before the interview that Le lost or recorded over - RA met with Dan Dulin and provided information to him. For some reason, he stated he hadn’t started recording his interviews yet: “Dulin spent approximately 10 minutes with Allen, he testified. He did not record the interview and said he was not sure why. “It was one of the first leads I conducted, and I hadn’t started using my voice recorder yet,” he said. - DNA and digital evidence have yet to link Allen to murders of Carroll County teens - Carroll County Comet
 
  • #273
You missed my point entirely. It’s not complicated, not even really important anyway so I’ll try explain just one last time.

You began by claiming RA came forward to help police and look where it got him, or something like that. I disagreed, he stated that he didn’t even see the girls so he was NOT helpful at all, therefore helpfulness is not the reason he came forward. He did however mention the three girls, which (unfortunately for him) collaborated his timeline.

Only leads and tips regarding sightings, sounds or something out of the ordinary relating to the crime that occurred have any chance of proving HELPFUL to an investigation. Nothing burgers are not helpful, hoping this makes sense?

This is why I totally respect those witnesses who did come forward with information describing what they’d noticed that same day. They did the right thing. JMO
I’m going to thank you for the discussion and just agree to disagree with you here. I didn’t miss your point we just don’t agree.
 
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  • #274
I don’t believe a word of what Wala had to say. She was unethical in her “care” of RA, accessed records she wasn’t supposed to… she was all over the podcasts, and various social media platforms regarding this case etc etc. His statements were vague and left more questions for me than answers - especially how nothing from his car tied him to the kids or the murders. See my prior posts for links to the articles and quotes I posted and for a better explanation of this post which I won’t reiterate here. Moo.
Well you and I must have been viewing different statements. His words wre crystal clear to me, He brutally killed Abby and Libby, waiting and watching to make sure they were dead. Then he tried to cover up what he did. He admitted time and again he killed them. He wrote it down, he yelled it, he once or twice sobbed it, he insisted it, he described how it happened and why. He prayed to God about it. Why shouldn't he be believed? I believe him. AJMO I also believe Dr. Wala who discussed RA with her superior to figure out how to help him cope with his guilt and his depression.
 
  • #275
The treatment his D has been arguing for years now.

Interestingly the warden said on the stand none of these videos had audio (RA was recorded 24 hours a day).

The videos played in court today all had audio, which wasn't played. Per DD and LL.

The warden said the videos from the camera IN the cell had no audio--which is true.

Today's videos were from a handheld camcorder used when transporting him within the building. They have audio, but the audio was not played in court.
 
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  • #276
AFAIA SCOIN have not ruled over any judgements in this trial. That's what I'm talking about.

The P could have asked for the crime scene and bodies of the girls not be shown to the gallery, like the D asked in reference to their evidence today.

The P did not.

Yes agree an overflow room would be helpful.
Why would SCOIN need to rule about anything during this trial, it has a very capable and unbiased judge, just like they've already ruled. Appeals that may reach them if RA is convicted and it goes first to the Appellate court are of no issue to them right now. That'd be jumping the gun.
AJMO
 
  • #277
Would the D really want to open the door to potential evidence they violated the gag order by sharing confidential information from discovery? Because that would be too much of a coincidence if what was only a rumour of a possible suspect in white van proved to truly involve a white van whom the D insinuated should’ve been a suspect. Who would believe it. JMO
Do you have a link to show they ever violated a gag order pls and thanks? Court filings are not covered by such orders to my limited understanding and they were not found in contempt by JG that I am aware of? Maybe I am further behind than I thought?
 
  • #278
Why would SCOIN need to rule about anything during this trial, it has a very capable and unbiased judge, just like they've already ruled. Appeals that may reach them if RA is convicted and it goes first to the Appellate court are of no issue to them right now. That'd be jumping the gun.
AJMO

I didn't suggest they would - your comment brought them up.

I was simply talking about this trial and some of the rulings. IMO.
 
  • #279
The warden said the videos from the camera IN the cell had no audio--which is true.

Today's videos were from a handheld camcorder used when transporting him within the building. They have audio, but the audio was not played in court.

Thank you. I'll have to go back and read the testimony. I was sure I read there was no audio.

Is the use of a camcorder when transporting a regular occurrence? I have no idea so am just asking.
 
  • #280
Thank you. I'll have to go back and read the testimony. I was sure I read there was no audio.

Is the use of a camcorder when transporting a regular occurrence? I have no idea so am just asking.

Handheld camcorder probably silenced so no-one in the gallery could hear and to keep it as private as possible.

Even RA couldn't see it nor a number of attorneys, I believe.

JMO MOO JMT
 
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