GUILTY Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #215

[DS2021]

This case is widely known but the jurors don't know the craziness of this case. Or I should say, shouldn't know

Theres no way they arent aware of the magnitude of this case. They werent sequestered until 7 years after the murders. I hope for their sake none of them speak a word to the media

 

[SeattleStew]

<modsnip - quoted post was removed> I will wait to see what the actual trial transcripts state when Liggett read Tip #74 to RA on October 13, 2022.

From court testimony: Liggett and Mullin interview with RA on October 13 2022:

"He told the investigators he was wearing blue jeans and a Carhartt jacket that day. He had a black one and a blue one at the time but believed he wore the black one. He also said he was wearing a “skull cap.”"

https://fox59.com/delphi-trial/arrest-me-or-take-me-home-jury-watches-video-richard-allens-first-interview/

 

[Inthedetails]

The silence of this trial has been deafening, even more so during deliberations…. I have never seen anything like this before. There is no way to know how this jury “may be” leaning not knowing what notes, questions, etc. have been submitted. They may just want to review all the evidence again before handing in their verdict… there may be other things going on.

Does it make a difference in terms of justice if we know what the jury is doing? I don't ask this out of snark, truly!!

I am just a curious as anyone about what is going on, but I am concerned at the trend to suspect everything and assume bad things are happening - when there are literally thousands of court cases every day that we don't know every detail as jury deliberates. This seems like normal, legal, course of action.

jmo

 

[Momofthreeboys]

Question, if the jury finds RA not guilty, how do you think the public will react?

Depends on how broad you want to make "public"....the avid crime followers that were convinced RA was guilty before the trial even began won't be happy. People that know very little probably will move on in life. People in Indiana might be sad the state didn't find the "real" killer and I use the term "real" very loosely.

 

[Momofthreeboys]

I am assuming it doesn’t count in this case but does the U.S Ever do a majority verdict?

When I did Jury Service as it was 11-1 for Guilty the judge made the decision that a majority verdict would be acceptable in our case. I am wondering how it works in the U.S.

Only in civil cases not criminal I believe.

 

[Megnut]

We can put this to rest.

The girls were dropped of at 1:49.

 

[Boxer]

I sure hope so

If hung hopefully they will retry.
Reasonable doubt is not "no doubt."
Its what would your house on.

MOO
If not guilty it is a MOO a faulty verdict, that everyone unfortunately will have to live with.

Being or stating suicidal things are often precursors to murder.
His behaviour in prison and jail show what his character is.

 

[shonyakay]

From court testimony: Liggett and Mullin interview with RA on October 13 2022:

"He told the investigators he was wearing blue jeans and a Carhartt jacket that day. He had a black one and a blue one at the time but believed he wore the black one. He also said he was wearing a “skull cap.”"

https://fox59.com/delphi-trial/arrest-me-or-take-me-home-jury-watches-video-richard-allens-first-interview/

Thank you but I am speaking of what is stated in Tip #74 that Liggett read to RA.

"Liggett then read Tip #74, Allen’s self-reported tip stating he was on the trail dressed in similar clothes as Bridge Guy."

‘I didn’t do it’ - Carroll County Comet

This is a two-part series. Tomorrow we will post Allen’s confessions testified to by employees and former employees of the Indiana Department of Corrections. “I didn’t do it.” Richard Allen sat in an interview room at the Indiana State Police Lafayette Post across the table from Lt. Jerry...

www.carrollcountycomet.com

 

[BexLuth0r]

This video is painful.

A lot of information from the ME that I had not heard before.

Abby had dirt and debris on her back, under her clothes. I don't like my conclusion.

More information from the ME about the marks on her chin, possible restraint.

Libby had superficial wounds on her neck. (Threats maybe?) Each cut (gaping wound) had multiple passes. He describes the wounds like perhaps a blade handle going in too far. She was covered in blood, her hands covered in blood. 5 to 10 minutes for each to die.

Absolute mad man.

JMO

This is so so awful. I knew they suffered serious injuries but to see it out as a sketch. Those poor girls. They were absolutely brutalised.

 

[fred&edna]

Does anyone know how frequently jurors have access to courtroom transcripts? Is it simply based on turn-around time? Or something more? I know the trials where I served we were never permitted trial transcripts but that has been a few years ago.

 

[Tortoise]

Does anyone know how frequently jurors have access to courtroom transcripts? Is it simply based on turn-around time? Or something more?

Not sure if you're asking about this case but they aren't allowed transcripts in this case.

 

[AugustWest]

Clarification requested by any verified attorney’s online?
@minor4th @AugustWest

Can the judge ask the foreman of the jury what the count is? There was a discussion between two Webseluths Posters earlier in this thread ‘that it is permissible for the judge to ask the jury foreman in so many words ‘what the count is.’ I am skeptical.Correct this post if the following is wrong (I have no legal background).

Under Lewis v State we can basically expect (unless there’s some reason extrinsic to the deliberations themselves we are not aware of) the court to re read the jury instructions it gave without any comment on the conduct of the trial or evidence

Thanks for reading. And providing clarification.​

My Opinion only

The case you have referenced is good law. In theory, Allen charges are not allowed in Indiana. The judge may, however, instruct them to read their jury instructions carefully and reconsider. Counting votes would be a no-no. It puts pressure on the holdouts.

The proper procedure is for the court to call the jury back into open court in the presence of all of the parties and their counsel, if they desire to be there, and to reread all instructions given to them prior to their deliberations, without emphasis on any of them and without further comment.

Lewis v. State

Lewis v. State - 424 N.E.2d 107

law.justia.com

https://scholarworks.uark.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1161&context=alr

 

[al66pine]

Reward for Tip Leading to the ARREST?

Is KS the one, who has earned the big reward now?? After all, without her thorough work we wouldn't be, where we are: at the end of a trial.

@FromGermany1 Thx for the reminder.
Seems KS is a verrry likely candidate, maybe the only one.

ISP page "Seeking Information"* offering "a reward for information leading to the arrest of the person or persons responsible for the homicides" as announced by IN SP, FBI, & Carroll County Sheriff’s Dept, is still online, saying reward may exceed $200,000.
This is specifically for the arrest. Sometimes these types of rewards are offered only for homicide CONVICTION & are explicitly not payable to LE employees or certain others (like below, if there is collusion or criminal involvement).

Originally KS was an unpaid volunteer IIRC; did she become a sheriff dept employee at some point?

Post is not meant to suggest that KS should not get all or some of the reward. I wonder if someone else who provided info - info which may not have surfaced at trial - may try to elbow her out of it.

The reward offer still being online after RA's arrest, suggests that the entire $$$ has not been paid yet. imo, icbwrong.

______________________________
* Excerpt.
"Information can be reported anonymously; however, the Indiana State Police, the FBI, and the Carroll County Sheriff’s Department have announced a reward for information leading to the arrest of the person or persons responsible for the homicides of Liberty German and Abigail Williams. The amount of the reward may be in excess of $200,000 depending upon the value of the information provided.

"Law enforcement authorities reserve the right to reject a claim for reward where there has been collusion or criminal involvement. The reward may be apportioned between various persons and/or paid for the arrest of the responsible person(s), as the circumstances fairly dictate."

"The Indiana State Police Alliance (ISPA) has established an account for individuals or businesses wishing to donate to the Delphi Reward Fund. Checks should be made payable to the Indiana State Police Alliance Foundation. “Delphi Reward” should be entered on the memo line. Donations can be mailed to:...."

Delphi Homicide Investigation

www.in.gov

 

[ClearAhead]

Does anyone know how frequently jurors have access to courtroom transcripts? Is it simply based on turn-around time? Or something more? I know the trials where I served we were never permitted trial transcripts but that has been a few years ago.

Page 10 of 13

https://www.wishtv.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/10/24/Jury-instructions-1.pdf

“Transcripts of witness testimony will not be available to you during your deliberations, so please pay careful attention during that testimony.”

 

[Megnut]

While Abby and Libby were eating pancakes, RA was throwing back beers.

While they grabbed sweatshirts, he grabbed his jacket. And weapons.

Between 1:30 and 1:49, Abby and Libby were smiling for a selfie.

Between 1:30 and 1:49, RA was scowling at juveniles.

At 2:06, Abby and Libby thought they had a long future ahead of them.

At 2:06, RA already knew they didn't.

At 2:13, Libby was aware that danger was in front of her, Abby knew danger was behind her, and RA knew they had every reason to be afraid.

Two little girls.

Twenty minutes of unthinkable violence.

All so unfair.

JMO

 

[Deleted member 229974]

This video is painful.

A lot of information from the ME that I had not heard before.

Abby had dirt and debris on her back, under her clothes. I don't like my conclusion.

More information from the ME about the marks on her chin, possible restraint.

Libby had superficial wounds on her neck. (Threats maybe?) Each cut (gaping wound) had multiple passes. He describes the wounds like perhaps a blade handle going in too far. She was covered in blood, her hands covered in blood. 5 to 10 minutes for each to die.

Absolute mad man.

JMO

Horrible. Stunning to think what both girls went through. Such anger and rage, especially towards Libby. And when I think about the scenario, the time it took, it only confirms my belief that more than one person was involved in this crime, and it was personal. IMO, it appears they killed Abby first, just to get her out of the way, so that they could violently torture and rage against Libby. Why, why, why? IMO

 

[Warwick7]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1855993108904702363

 

[Kudzuu]

Page 10 of 13

https://www.wishtv.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/10/24/Jury-instructions-1.pdf

“Transcripts of witness testimony will not be available to you during your deliberations, so please pay careful attention during that testimony.”

This shocks me! I can't imagine every juror hearing the exact same thing from every witness. Words matter. We saw what confusion came out from reporters taking notes.

I feel horrible for these jurors. What a task they've been given. Seems like a perfect storm for a hung jury especially if there is one that can't be convinced to join the majority.

My opinion.

 

[photographer4]

We can put this to rest.

The girls were dropped of at 1:49.

Then why did Cicero start counting steps from 1:30? Actually asking.

 

[browneyes]

I mean no disrespect to the Jury at ALL. I wonder if they are gathering information and want to be prepared as possible to speak to the media. I imagine they will be hounded relentlessly, maybe they are also making media plans with each other, I again am not saying they are trying to profit or anything, just maybe making plans to all go to a remote cabin, or deciding what they will or will not be speaking about.

While I love the nuances of juries, I hate when they give interviews…it makes me nervous. But I am nosy too.