Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #198

[MassGuy]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1846205108234686607

 

[Vern]

I hear you, and I appreciate the input!

I am going with the FBI scene analysis and their conclusion. Additionally, re when the clothes were removed:

During the 3 days pre-trial hearing, the blood expert (Cicero) testified that Abby was already redressed by the time her wound was inflicted. She bled out on her hoodie and the blood followed the exact trail of gravity. All MOO because I am struggling to find the transcripts atm - unless much more capable humans, like @Vern have a link available?

Cicero Testimony:

_Testimony of Major Patrick Cicero Given at Hearing on Motion in Limine Held August 1, 2024.pdf

drive.google.com

 

[SouthEnd]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1846205108234686607

...it was all going far too smoothly.

It is ok, I am glad that JG was running everything so fast, there is plenty of time to fill in the ranks of the jurors.

(Note: My heart breaks at the huge issue of childcare there seems to be around the world atm)

All MOO

 

[katydid23]

I never actually thought about a car approaching then as interrupting him...but that makes sense! I just assumed the girls made a run for it... but your idea makes a lot more sense. The only other thing I heard at the time was the family in that house where the gravel roads goes to was in Florida for the winter.

Right, but their adult son was interviewed and said that on the afternoon of the murders, he drove up the driveway to check on his parents home. That gravel driveway would be loud.

 

[girlhasnoname]

Which just makes me think back.. what did LE see when they looked back into him, that justified the search of his property and subsequent arrest? I actually cannot remember what they learned that allowed to get them the search warrant. Anyone know?

I don't believe LE has ever officially stated how they focused on RA in 2022 or should I say refocused on RA?

moo

 

[arielilane]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1846205108234686607

 

[arielilane]

@KylaBRussell

#NEW: 3 of the 14 jurors selected for the #Delphi double murder trial were dismissed this morning by Special Judge Fran Gull. That puts us back at 11 — with 5 more needed to be picked, including alternates. Of the current 11, 7 are women and 4 are men. #RichardAllen #RichardAllenTrial @WISHNews8

11:05 AM · Oct 15, 2024

 

[Inthedetails]

Also, I am still shocked at how quickly the jury was chosen! They quickly found all these folks who are unfamiliar with the case?!?! Wow!

IMO

Snipped

Jurors don't have to be unfamiliar with the case, but have to agree they will consider only the evidence presented in court in their deliberation.

jmo

 

[MassGuy]

There is evidence of a sexual motive, IMO. Two young girls, kidnapped by a stranger, stripped and stabbed to death.

What are the other possible motives for that? Can anyone name some other possible motives?

It wasn't a robbery. It wasn't road rage. What was it if it wasn't sexually motivated?

Even if these girls were fully clothed, I would bet the farm on the motive being sexual. A sexually motivated murder need not include an overt sex act. It’s about power and control, and how it makes the offender feel.

I’ve always thought the killer was behaving as a sexually motivated serial killer, even though he was not by definition a serial killer. In crimes like that you frequently see a signature (something not necessary to commit the crime, but necessary to the killer).

Hence the alleged staging of the bodies here.

 

[SouthEnd]

Cicero Testimony:

_Testimony of Major Patrick Cicero Given at Hearing on Motion in Limine Held August 1, 2024.pdf

drive.google.com

You are a legend, and I shall now bookmark that page.

The relevant testimony is p16 to p19, specifically disputing the idea that LW's bra or sweatshirt were put on AW post mortem. The redressing and undressing had already occurred.

Thank you so much Vern!

 

[WildHuncher]

Murderers have been known to remove a victim's clothes to dispose of them due to worry over DNA being left on them, for identification purposes. There are alternative explanations as to why they may be removed that don't include wizard fire spells. IMO

Plenty of clothes were left on the scene. Some on Abby, including some of Libby’s. Some were retrieved from the creek. Some, OTOH, have never been found.

There are infinite alternatives, but do any of them really fit here? How many make any kind of sense?

SA leading to murder may be irrational, but we know it happens. A lot.

 

[FrostedGlass]

There is evidence of a sexual motive, IMO. Two young girls, kidnapped by a stranger, stripped and stabbed to death.

What are the other possible motives for that? Can anyone name some other possible motives?

It wasn't a robbery. It wasn't road rage. What was it if it wasn't sexually motivated?

Some murderers don't have a motive. They just feel like killing someone and they do it.

The work of a drugged-up psycho, posing them for humiliation and shock value.

We don't have the details of the crime scene. Statements made over the years have been frightening and puzzling.

 

[Inthedetails]

You are a legend, and I shall now bookmark that page.

The relevant testimony is p16 to p19, specifically disputing the idea that LW's bra or sweatshirt were put on AW post mortem. The redressing and undressing had already occurred.

Thank you so much Vern!

I think we're about to learn a lot more about investigations and how LE can piece together an order of events in a crime from the evidence. I'm ready for it.

jmo

 

[Warwick7]

Yes, I'm aware of this fact...but for me that doesn't answer the question of 'how' LE would know he was interrupted by one of those other people, other than to have a record of the fact. From whence does that record come? A witness? A phone? Evidence on the bridge side of the creek?

We shall soon find out.....

 

[minazoe]

these crimes were one hundred percent sexually motivated...but remember most sexual crime is about power.so it leans into sexual violence ..this is how the murders happened. RA felt omnipotent with a gun, once he used it he had power and control over the girls. he could move them somewhere and make them do what he wants..he has fantasies he wants to experience....these are dark sexual fantasies where he is able to show his power and get revenge ( probably motivated by rejection) and get the sexual turn on he wants with these little girls.

when clothes are removed and a victim is a young girl this is sexual assault. mOO

 

[Niner]

Prosecutors in the murder trial of Richard Allen, the Delphi man who is accused of killing two teenagers, has asked the court to prohibit the sketches used by investigators.

View attachment 537846

Prosecution in Delphi murders trial seeks to ban suspect sketches

Prosecutors in the murder trial of Richard Allen, the Delphi man who is accused of killing two teenagers, has asked to prohibit sketches.

www.wishtv.com

@Vern - this is probably not yet posted in the court site?

 

[Web_Sleuth]

I’m sorry if this has been mentioned… is there any thought that he left the scene the day of and returned at a later time, but before the girls were found?

 

[SouthEnd]

I’m sorry if this has been mentioned… is there any thought that he left the scene the day of and returned at a later time, but before the girls were found?

I don't believe there is evidence of that, no, but I suppose it is possible - if he wanted to make sure he didn't forget any of his items behind?

IMO anyone returning later would have been extremely unlikely, because unofficial searches were still ongoing.

All MOO

 

[Vern]

@Vern - this is probably not yet posted in the court site?

Not yet; I'll watch for it and tag you when available.

 

[Inthedetails]

I’m sorry if this has been mentioned… is there any thought that he left the scene the day of and returned at a later time, but before the girls were found?

I wondered that at the very beginning of the case, but I don't think so now. I think he went home, showered, ate dinner, and went to bed. imo

jmo