Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #203

[FrostedGlass]

His phone provider would logically have a record of every device he had registered with them over the years. I think it would simply be a matter of comparing that vs what they found.

Huh. I did not know that.
It's kind of scary knowing they can track every phone a person has owned. I always thought they couldn't track burner phones... I learn something new every day.

 

[MassGuy]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1849453150924578830

 

[Melted]

It was stated that there were 2 different measures of GPS data from her iPhone:
1) Elevation change
2) Distance (or steps taken).

The 20 ft was the elevation change....and I thought I saw somewhere there were 400+ steps taken before the phone stopped moving... or something like that.. but don't quote me on that.

50 meters.

 

[Melted]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1849453150924578830

Why wouldn’t he want to testify?

 

[Inthedetails]

Good point. The more I think about it the more that seems logical.

Was clothing removed after she was killed or before? Clothes in the water would still probably be stained.

Sadly, I think this may mean that they were disrobed before being killed. But how would he have done that without having to restrain at least one of them?

I always thought they would find handcuffs, zip ties or duct tape but none of that... so he must have had a gun on one of then then forced the other to take off their clothes. Maybe one at a time then reverse.

But how did Abby end up with Libby's clothes? I mean it is hard to redress someone even if you put baggy clothes on them from another person. Did he kill them then try to redress Libby, which was too hard to do and then just did Abby with Libby's clothes.. .then threw all the other clothes in the creek?

Not that this matters, by whomever did this is one very disturbed person.

Just pondering....could he have told Abby to get dressed with the idea he wasn't going to kill her, but then changed his mind and did? She just grabbed whatever clothes were available?

That might explain why her injury seemed so quick and abrupt rather than what seems like more of a fight with Libby.

Thinking aloud, that's all.

jmo

 

[Deleted member 296739]

Huh. I did not know that.
It's kind of scary knowing they can track every phone a person has owned. I always thought they couldn't track burner phones... I learn something new every day.

I think that a phone provider has records of the phones registered to your account- if I get a random phone with random SIM card and not using my primary carrier then that would not show up in my account records- I would not think- jmo

 

[Trebor5591]

Totally agree on trail murder, who carries a gun and knife/box cutter on a public trail unless your up to no good.
<snip>

Plenty of people do, and they're not looking for trouble. Knives are tools and guns are tools too. It's a dangerous world, and if anyone should know that, it should be true crime buffs. Hiking on trails one might find a pack of feral dogs, a mountain lion or a bear. Or a two-legged predators like Richard Allen, looking for a victim. .JMO

 

[Deleted member 229974]

Ballistic evidence is allowed in every state, and that’s been the case for decades. Maryland requires it to be presented in a certain way though, not that it applies here.

The OP said something about “it being “junky science anyway”.
Perhaps she was referring only to the condition of the unspent bullet that was found in the ground. Thanks tho.

 

[loveplace]

I think it's about 60 feet from the bridge down to the base of the hill. I have no idea why the phone only showed 20 feet.

I feel like a 20 ft altitude change, like it seems is being described in the source above, is very different from a 20 ft distance. I also am wondering if that altitude change is cumulative... down a step decline but then partway up on the other side so the overall change is less than the altitude change of just going "down the hill." I am just speculating possibilities here as I have't reviewed the terrain carefully. Just my opinion.

 

[Bergmann]

But when you have evidence from the prosecution that conclusively shows one thing

That assumption is doing a lot of heavy lifting IMO. Lets say you are utterly convinced, at the moment I'm certainly not.
But neither opinion matters because its what the jury conclude, not you are I.

JMO

 

[loveplace]

I find Abby’s jeans inside out with underwear attached interesting - sounds like she was undressed…pants pulled down in a way to become completely inside out. Then redressed in Libby’s wet clothes. IMO

It has been a number of years since I wore skinny jeans, but even with my boot cut Mom jeans, if I undress in any kind of hurry my pants end up as described ( completely inside out with undies on top of the inside out pants) on the floor until I seperate them and turn them right. I have also spent an inordinate amoutn of time over the years seperating and right siding my kids jeans and undies for laundry purposes. I think it can be common in any circumstance with kids this age, but especially when under duress and in a hurry as the girls were. I wouldn't make any assumptions from this. Just my opinion.

 

[steeltowngirl]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1849453150924578830

Well that is interesting. Blast from the past. Ives was just talked about on the threads Monday and yesterday. So, defense suddenly decides they need to have him testify. Light-bulb moment triggered by social media chatter?

jmo

 

[MassGuy]

Huh. I did not know that.
It's kind of scary knowing they can track every phone a person has owned. I always thought they couldn't track burner phones... I learn something new every day.

I have AT&T. They would certainly have a record of every device I’ve ever registered on their network, especially considering I’ve purchased every device from them.

It would simply be a matter of getting records from his carrier.

This is how they would know a particular device is missing. They would presumably also know exactly when he changed phones.

 

[Deleted member 229974]

I just wonder how Abby's bottoms and Libby's tops were found in the creek but Libby's pants were on Abby and wearing her own top. I can't think of what scenario happened there. If I'm understanding where everything was found.

Sounds like a pretty busy scene for just one man to manage by himself. IMO

 

[ClearAhead]

"While questions remained about the phone’s period of inactivity, locator pings never placed the phone outside the Monon High Bridge area and the site near Deer Creek where the girls’ bodies — and the phone — were found. This lack of movement casts doubt on the defense team’s floated theory of a possible abduction and off-site killing."

https://www.wdtn.com/news/delphi-murders-phone-pings-cast-doubt-on-defenses-alternate-site-killing-theory/

The other point TMS brought forward, since the cellphone wasn’t turned off or turned back on, if the girls were taken by car and brought back (even if the app doesn’t log steps in a vehicle) it still would’ve logged steps from exiting the car to the crime scene area, which it didn’t.

I just finished listening to this Day 5 podcast and although they’re not technical experts, I appreciate their insights and impressions from inside the courtroom. JMO

 

[susiQ]

So which one was it, mud or mud and blood?
If only she was a Good Samaritan and called 911 when she saw a muddy and perhaps a bloody man, who she thought at the time may have fallen and injured himself. But you know, “she’s a woman” so she’s not going to offer to help a strange man in a park. @@ IMO

Exactly! If I saw a muddy guy walking on the road and he looked alright, well, no need to call 911. IF, I saw a guy with mud and obvious blood on his jeans, I would definitely call 911 regardless of whether I thought he was hurt OR he had hurt someone else! JMO

 

[BUF]

How many prosecution witnesses are we up to…..about 25?

I saw on one report that Sarah Carbaugh was witness #19.

 

[Jade]

So which one was it, mud or mud and blood?
If only she was a Good Samaritan and called 911 when she saw a muddy and perhaps a bloody man, who she thought at the time may have fallen and injured himself. But you know, “she’s a woman” so she’s not going to offer to help a strange man in a park. @@ IMO

An adult man proceeding ably under his own power doesn’t need 911 called for him.

In these days of everyone with cell phones he can call himself or go on wherever he is headed.

BG didn’t need a good samaritan. He was not like prone at the bottom of a hill waving to flag her down for help and she passed by.

Here is why a women may wisely choose to not get involved in a strange man’s problems in a park:

“The Gift of Fear”, De Becker, good book for all women and those who love them



all imo

 

[FrostedGlass]

I feel like a 20 ft altitude change, like it seems is being described in the source above, is very different from a 20 ft distance. I also am wondering if that altitude change is cumulative... down a step decline but then partway up on the other side so the overall change is less than the altitude change of just going "down the hill." I am just speculating possibilities here as I have't reviewed the terrain carefully. Just my opinion.

I quoted from the article but I'm obviously clueless.

The hill on the bridge side just goes down.

https://www.wane.com/top-stories/he-was-covered-in-mud-and-blood-bridge-guy-witness-testimonies-continue/

 

[loveplace]

I quoted from the article but I'm obviously clueless.

The hill on the bridge side just goes down.

https://www.wane.com/top-stories/he...bridge-guy-witness-testimonies-continue/[/URL

I wouldn't call anyone clueless.

I realize that the bridge side only goes down to the lowest point where the water flows in the valley, but if the 20 ft altitude change was cumulative over all of the steps recorded until they stopped, then I'm guessing it would include an increase in elevation as they walked up out of the creek bed on the other side to reach the loaciton of the bodies, hence my speculation that it is a cumulative altitude change. Just my thoughts on the matter.

Edited by me to fix formatting